Harry Patch 1898-2009

[Daisy]

I mean this as a tribute.

 

Yesterday the last British veteran of the First World War, Harry Patch, died at age 111. Last week Henry Allingham who also was a world war I and II veteran died at age 113.

 

I find it quite sad that the last living link has gone. Whenever Remembrance Day (poppy day) comes around I always tend to think of World war II, maybe because my granddad served in the 2nd, or maybe because in school I studied the 2nd more. But the 1st really was a terrible war. A guy on the TV mentioned that the number of dead that we mourn in Afghanistan in a year is about the number who could die in an hour in the first world war trenches.

 

The headline of the newspaper this morning was "war is organised murder, and nothing else", it was something that Harry Patch had once said.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/the-last-of-the-noblest-generation-1761467.html

It was only once he was 100 that he started talking about the war. He reminds me of my granddad in these senses. He does talk about the war, but not very often and only about little details, nothing about what really happened, his friends and all those that he lost that were close to him while he survived. The latest titbit I got was a tale about the tube in London and whenever he was there using Camden Town station for a free bunk they provided for soldiers. So no hostel fee, and no hard cold floor all the other people there to flee the bombs would have to put up with. It was strange - I'd stood on that very station a few days before he told me that. He also detests war - and his favourite song that he wants played at his funeral is Imagine by John Lennon. He also doesn't like people being cavalier about war or politicians who are too keen to agree believing they don't really know what war is like, the horrificness of it.

 

I don't know what the actual statistics are now, but at one point a quarter of all homeless in my country were army veterans, while the army now claims that it is only 1 in 10. Still, ridiculously high, the same as those who suffer Post Traumatic Stress and all those other war related effects.

 

The other day I met a lady who is about to become an Officer in our army. She told me that it was the only vocation that she could find that fit her skills, I wish I could think of something else for her. There must be. She asked me what I thought of the army, and I could only reply that I couldn't separate it from politics to really answer. She told me she agreed and very much understood my answer and what wars are really about. However she felt that she was doing it for people like us, who would be sold by those at the top without a care without experienceing it themselves. In a way I can understand her logic, and I didn't argue back, I didn't want to. But all I could really think was I was going to be adding another person to my list of those that I watch with dread the news reports of deaths from the battlefield.

 

Anyway, here is to remembering all those that have fought and died and lived. all those affected.

[Mark Arbour]

All wars are horrible, but I think that WWI was especially horrible for the average soldier. I can't imagine spending weeks at a time in a trench, covered in mud, lice and other parasites, with dead horses and dying men all around, waiting for the next shell to land. Would it be an explosive, and blast me and my mates into a million pieces? Or would it be gas (mustard, chlorine, etc) that would make me cough my lungs up? And while artillery was the biggest killer in WWI, charging into the face of machine guns would require an almost unimaginable amount of courage.

 

This is just anecdotal, but when reading about other conflicts, I perceived that soldiers were more willing to talk about their experiences. With WWI, it seems just the opposite. It was so awful they couldn't bear to re-live those moments?

 

Rest in Peace Harry.

[Daisy]

All wars are horrible, but I think that WWI was especially horrible for the average soldier. I can't imagine spending weeks at a time in a trench, covered in mud, lice and other parasites, with dead horses and dying men all around, waiting for the next shell to land. Would it be an explosive, and blast me and my mates into a million pieces? Or would it be gas (mustard, chlorine, etc) that would make me cough my lungs up? And while artillery was the biggest killer in WWI, charging into the face of machine guns would require an almost unimaginable amount of courage.

 

This is just anecdotal, but when reading about other conflicts, I perceived that soldiers were more willing to talk about their experiences. With WWI, it seems just the opposite. It was so awful they couldn't bear to re-live those moments?

 

Rest in Peace Harry.

 

I think you are likely right about that anecdote. All the stuff that I have heard about that war sound absolutely horrendous and off the scale of anything that I can imagine - that people were really put through that, that it was allowed to happen.

 

The bittersweet tale that I remember the most is about christmas day, and how soldiers on both sides on that day emerged into no-man's-land to play football and swap gifts. Before resuming war the next day.

 

As well as of course the young age that people were in the war, and that literally whole villages would be wiped out of their men in one go, devastating whole communities with such force.

 

It also makes me really appreciate that I don't have to participate in war - that I have a choice. Where those then, including my granddad didn't, as well as others today in different countries.

 

What is making this even more poignant for me is thinking that someday the last world war II veteran will pass away. That is much more real to me knowing many of those that did serve whether abroad or at home in some capacity. And still at least able to chat to them about their lives and experiences, no matter how trivial.

 

(and don't forget, things like trench foot)

Edited July 26, 2009 by Smarties

[Mark Arbour]

 

The bittersweet tale that I remember the most is about christmas day, and how soldiers on both sides on that day emerged into no-man's-land to play football and swap gifts. Before resuming war the next day.

 

 

And the generals went apeshit about that and took steps to make sure it never happened again. They didn't want their boys to see the human side of the enemy.

 

The Wiki on it: Christmas Truce

[Daisy]

One of the letters about it from that wiki page you posted.

 

10 page letter from an unknown British soldier that records events and incidents with the Germans on that night describing "the most memorable Christmas I've ever spent".

The letter begins:

This will be the most memorable Christmas I've ever spent or likely to spend: since about tea time yesterday I don't think theres been a shot fired on either side up to now. Last night turned a very clear frost moonlight night, so soon after dusk we had some decent fires going and had a few carols and songs. The Germans commenced by placing lights all along the edge of their trenches and coming over to uswishing us a Happy Christmas etc. They also gave us a few songs etc. so we had quite a social party. Several of them can speak English very well so we had a few conversations. Some of our chaps went to over to their lines. I think they've all come back bar one from 'E' Co. They no doubt kept him as a souvenir. In spite of our fires etc. it was terribly cold and a job to sleep between look out duties, which are two hours in every six. First thing this morning it was very foggy. So we stood to arms a little longer than usual. A few of us that were lucky could go to Holy Communion early this morning. It was celebrated in a ruined farm about 500 yds behind us. I unfortunately couldn't go. There must be something in the spirit of Christmas as to day we are all on top of our trenches running about. Whereas other days we have to keep our heads well down. We had breakfast about 8.0 which went down alright especially some cocoa we made. We also had some of the post this morning. I had a parcel from B. G's Lace Dept containing a sweater, smokes, under clothes etc. We also had a card from the Queen, which I am sending back to you to look after please. After breakfast we had a game of football at the back of our trenches! We've had a few Germans over to see us this morning. They also sent a party over to bury a sniper we shot in the week. He was about a 100 yds from our trench. A few of our fellows went out and helped to bury him. About 10.30 we had a short church parade the morning service etc. held in the trench. How we did sing. 'O come all ye faithful. And While shepherds watched their flocks by night' were the hymns we had. At present we are cooking our Christmas Dinner! so will finish this letter later. Dinner is over! and well we enjoyed it. Our dinner party started off with fried bacon and dip-bread: followed by hot Xmas Pudding. I had a mascot in my piece. Next item on the menu was muscatels and almonds, oranges, bananas, chocolate etc followed by cocoa and smokes. You can guess we thought of the dinners at home. Just before dinner I had the pleasure of shaking hands with several Germans: a party of them came 1/2way over to us so several of us went out to them. I exchanged one of my balaclavas for a hat. I've also got a button off one of their tunics. We also exchanged smokes etc. and had a decent chat. They say they won't fire tomorrow if we don't so I suppose we shall get a bit of a holidayperhaps. After exchanging autographs and them wishing us a Happy New Year we departed and came back and had our dinner. We can hardly believe that we've been firing at them for the last week or twoit all seems so strange. At present its freezing hard and everything is covered with ice

Edited July 26, 2009 by Smarties

[Excuse]

I think you are likely right about that anecdote. All the stuff that I have heard about that war sound absolutely horrendous and off the scale of anything that I can imagine - that people were really put through that, that it was allowed to happen.

 

The bittersweet tale that I remember the most is about christmas day, and how soldiers on both sides on that day emerged into no-man's-land to play football and swap gifts. Before resuming war the next day.

 

As well as of course the young age that people were in the war, and that literally whole villages would be wiped out of their men in one go, devastating whole communities with such force.

 

It also makes me really appreciate that I don't have to participate in war - that I have a choice. Where those then, including my granddad didn't, as well as others today in different countries.

 

What is making this even more poignant for me is thinking that someday the last world war II veteran will pass away. That is much more real to me knowing many of those that did serve whether abroad or at home in some capacity. And still at least able to chat to them about their lives and experiences, no matter how trivial.

 

(and don't forget, things like trench foot)

 

I think part of what stopped them talking about their experiences was the old "British stiff upper lip" Bad things just weren't discussed, you just plodded on. I think this mentality is waning slightly, but still with us. Some people wont seek treatment for PTSD because of it. Of course the fact that the war was truly horrific is a major factor, but I do think the "plodding" mentality stopped some veterans dealing with it.

 

anyway RIP harry!!

[KJames]

What a wonderful age to have the good fortune to live to! Congratulations to him, and a good rest.

 

Over here in the USA, we're nearing the end of that era also, as we're down to less than a half-dozen WWI survivors and I think it may actually be down as low as only two or three.

[methodwriter85]

It's interesting to think that soon, the 1910's will be out of living memory.