Thick or thin?

[GaryKelly]

All the world is a stage... true, but theater seats hold a helluva lot more people. When a person decides to take center stage, they become a target - a target for what? That's the risk every performer takes. Sounds a tad masochistic. I wonder why performers (from politicians to jugglers to authors) take that risk. On the one hand, sensitivity is a prerequisite for creativity. On the other, insensitivity is an antidote for bruised ego. Is it possible to be both thick and thin skinned?

[Menzoberranzen]

Yes - it all depends on the person you are dealing with. I am sensitive, and 'thin skinned' to criticism from people I respect, but I don't give a damn what most of the morons around think about or say to me. I imagine the same is true for published authors; they must take criticism from noted literary critics far more seriously than that which is found on websites like yahoo.

 

I may or may not be making sense here...

 

In short, don't take to heart the things said by people you don't respect (or at least whose opinions you don't respect) and you can be both thin and thick skinned.

 

Menzo

[GaryKelly]

Yes - it all depends on the person you are dealing with. I am sensitive, and 'thin skinned' to criticism from people I respect, but I don't give a damn what most of the morons around think about or say to me. Menzo

 

You raise an interesting point, Menzo. What is the definition of a moron? :king: Or did I miss something?

[The Reaper]

Now here's a topic question i like, (great question btw). I do magic, for those who dont know. And i have to perform for many people at a time, anywhere, anytime someone asks. Yes i can be a lot of pressure, but it does take some thick skin to do it. I dont think thick or thin skin has to do with getting up and performing (thats courage and skills if you ask me), i think thin and thick skin have to do with what you do OFF the stage.

 

After i do a trick, ive had people tell me it was good, or it was flat-out bad. And both types of feedback are good, but think and thick skin come into play when those things are brought up...or ANYTHING is brought up about your performance off stage. it doesnt even have to do with a stage, just speaking in front of two people telling a story takes thin and thick skin (when the story is over).

 

Now why would people put themselves in this position where their "think and thick skin" is put to the test? I think its for a number of reasons, but none of them matter to me more than this reason: my reason.

 

My reason for doing things like this, performing magic, taking the spotlight away form others and telling a story, or writing a long answer to a question in a forum, is because i like the feeling of accomplishment. I like to be able to HONESTLY say that i have performed for over 50 people at a time, that (to me) means i have captivated the interests of over 50 people all at once!! That to me is an accomplishment, although an accomplishment can be personal and can contain no others but yourself, mine is with a lot of people.

 

There are many reasons why people do and dont get up in front of an audience, but i do think that either way, thin or thick skin is tested in daily life, and perfected through accomplishments.

[Graeme]

Yes - it all depends on the person you are dealing with. I am sensitive, and 'thin skinned' to criticism from people I respect, but I don't give a damn what most of the morons around think about or say to me. I imagine the same is true for published authors; they must take criticism from noted literary critics far more seriously than that which is found on websites like yahoo.

 

I may or may not be making sense here...

 

In short, don't take to heart the things said by people you don't respect (or at least whose opinions you don't respect) and you can be both thin and thick skinned.

 

Menzo

That makes perfect sense, and it was what I was going to say.

 

I used to be a basketball referee. As such, I used to get a lot of abuse. It seems that many people thought I was totally incompetent at the job (usually just after I've made a call against their team). It didn't bother me because I knew when I was right and when I was wrong. The only people whose opinion I listened to was the referee coach and the referee supervisor.

 

On the other hand, I've been very badly hurt, emotionally, by negative comments from people I liked in response to something I've said. From a stranger, it wouldn't have hurt, but from them it did. It's another consequence of relationships -- that criticism within a relationship can hurt a lot more.

 

Off topic, slight, but I remember a sign in a basketball stadium I saw a long time ago. It was something like:

 

WANTED: Blind, deaf, sadistic people with the hide of a Rhinoceros to enroll in the next referee school. Must be over 16.

[Menzoberranzen]

Off topic, slight, but I remember a sign in a basketball stadium I saw a long time ago. It was something like:

 

WANTED: Blind, deaf, sadistic people with the hide of a Rhinoceros to enroll in the next referee school. Must be over 16.

 

Not to be overly pedantic, but shouldn't it me masochistic? Or do refs need to like hurting others?

[Demetz]

All the world is a stage... true, but theater seats hold a helluva lot more people. When a person decides to take center stage, they become a target - a target for what? That's the risk every performer takes. Sounds a tad masochistic. I wonder why performers (from politicians to jugglers to authors) take that risk. On the one hand, sensitivity is a prerequisite for creativity. On the other, insensitivity is an antidote for bruised ego. Is it possible to be both thick and thin skinned?

 

Feedback is an essential part to any performance. When one finds a performer to be exceedingly boring, or politician to be unamuzingly nonsensical, it is to be expected that the unimpressed will voice that opinion. When it becomes clear that a comedian is unfunny, that an entertainer is unentertaining, or that a politician is without sensibility it is of no surprise when that negative feedback increases and forms into a consistent blowback. When that happens the performer should seriously consider reforming his performance or finding a new task to apply himself to.

 

Being thick skinned is of importance as criticism should not necessarily be taken personally, but it is not the skin that is of concern so much as the mind which should be considering whether the criticism is valid and if so how to act on it. Failure to seriously consider the validity of criticism and subsequently to make changes where such criticism is found to be valid is tantamount to failure as a person as such an individual can no longer advance himself.

[Graeme]

Not to be overly pedantic, but shouldn't it be masochistic? Or do refs need to like hurting others?

This was twenty-plus years ago, but I think you're right. The sadistic part is what everyone else thinks the referees are.... I think the ad did say masochistic.

[MMandM]

If you're a civil rights lawyer you need to be thick-skinned, or you're in the wrong business. I find thin skinned lawyers to be weak and easy targets.

Edited June 13, 2007 by Mark_Marciano

[Razor]

Performers perform because they are attention whores. You think I used to march around on a field with a saxophone for the hell of it? Ya think I played that thing on stage at concerts, doing solos and whatnot, just cause I could? Ya think I write cause I like to type? Noooooo, I am indeed guilty of attention whoring. And GOD I love the attention that comes with performing. Anyone who says they don't love it is a baldfaced liar.

 

So, the risk of being made fun of or whatever is much less important to me than the possibility of being applauded.

 

Thin skinned? Yeah, I am, bigtime. I want to please everybody and have everybody be my friend. I don't like conflict, and I don't understand it when people can't empathize with others.

 

However, thick skinned is for when someone says "You suck. Your writing is terrible. Go kill yourself." Yeah, at least one person has said that, but then I send them a nice reply detailing the objects they can shove in a certain orifice.

 

So, basically we use our judgment on when to be thick or thin skinned. As Menzo said, it has to do with the respect a person has from you. If, for instance, my editor told me very frankly that a chapter of a story sucked, I would cry and beg him to help me fix it cause I know he knows what he's talking about. A random e-mail with enough n00b speek to kill a horse will not evoke the same response.

[GaryKelly]

Performers perform because they are attention whores.

 

I luvya, Razor.

[jfalkon]

It's not so much about how thick your skin is as what you let pass through the layers. You can be thick skinned in the sense that you are not crying every time someone criticizes your performance but also listen to the feedback.

 

I usualy like to stay out of the spotlight physicaly but when I was in school the instructors seemed to take a sadistic pleasure in making their students do presentations. That ment that every three to six months I had to give one of those Powerpoint talks. What I learned to do was to get ready before the talk. In this phase I would be creative and quite attached to the slide show I was putting together. Once I was satisfied with the performance I would give I could emotionaly detach from it. On the day of the talk I would watch the audience and try to adjust to any visual feed back they gave me in a completely mechanical way. After the event I listend to the criticisms and praises and remembered them for the inevitable next time. At this point none of it was personal and I was not upset by any of the coments. I was treating my performance as a product made to someone's specifications.

 

The key is to think about the feedback instead of immediately reacting. Sometimes someone says, "That sucked ass!" just because they were in a bad mood. Rather than imediately feeling terrible it makes sense to ask yourself why that person said what he said. Then you can sort out the useful coments from the useless ones. Your skin can be thicker to some of them than others. Its also important to realize that sometimes the show does not mach the audience. There is nothing that can be done about that. It happens to the best performers. That reminds me of a line from "Headwig and the Angry Itch". She said something to the effect of, "They threw tomatos...I had a nice salad after the show."

 

Ok, I've had your attention lond enough. I'll let someone else take the stage now.

[BeaStKid]

i think quite a few viewpoints have been given here...so here is mine--

 

It all depends...i mean, when we're giving a performance/writing or doing anything which requires a feedback for the first time, it does matter a lot! And i'm speaking from personal experience. I like public speaking. People say i speak well in front of people. The first time i spoke on the stage was when i was in 2nd grade. had i not been appreciated then, i would not have gone ahead and won the best public speaker title in my school in grade 4.

 

Similarly, i posted the first chapter of my very first story a few days back. Had i not received a single positive feedback, i would have never posted another chapter. But, coming back to the point. Once a person is experienced in his/her field, he/she starts taking feedback, +ve or -ve, with a pinch of salt and strives to do better. Hence, i feel all types of feedbacks are necessary as it gives a person humility to understand that he can improve a lot.

 

Further, the first positive feedback, as i mentioned earlier, is very important. I learnt this in the workshop i'm attending that one should never shy away from appreciating good things and also not be offended by what others think of you (It's a presonality development class, btw).

 

So, adopt a happy-go-lucky attitude and be merry...Damn the others who say you aren't good, 'cause YOU know you are. But don't damn the ones who give comments and are experienced enough to be your great grandfather in that field....LOL

 

hot_bsk

[AFriendlyFace]

I guess overall I consider myself thick skinned. That's not to say I don't react to criticism, I just don't fall apart over it. My most likely reaction will be to either distance myself from the situation until I can improve (assuming I think the criticism was accurate), or to distance myself emotionally from the person who did the criticising (assuming I think it was unfair). That second part sounds worse than it is. I tend to be a very emotionally available, empathetic person. If I remained emotionally close to someone who was harshly and unfairly criticising me it would be bad for my emotional well-being. The distance is also usually temporary, usually only until I/we can work out whatever the issue is, or if it's completely about me until I can sort out what to do with the criticism. But anyway, while I'll adapt I most certainly won't break if someone criticises me.

 

The only time criticism really does hurt is, as the others have said, when it comes from someone I respect in the area that they're knowledgable about. In other words a friend that I really like and respect could say "what a stupid play" with regards to some game I'm playing, and chances are I won't care if the friend is less knowledgable about the game than I am.

 

Also, the criticism should be about something subjective if it's going to hurt me. If you say you don't like something I've written, or painted, or otherwise created and I care about you (and you've done it in a harsher way than simply "I don't like that"), THEN I'll be hurt. If it's something objective then it doesn't really bother me because either you know more about it than me in which case you're right and the criticism can help, or you know less about it than me and I'm right so your opinion doesn't matter.

 

Actually I admit that during an argument/confrontation/fight I won't let my opponent see that he/she has hurt me at all. It may have hurt but I'll deal with it later on on my own or with trusted people, but I'll hold up during the incident itself. To be honest the only time I do let someone see that they've hurt me would be if I were doing it for guilt or sympathy purposes.

 

Few things frustrate me more than seeing someone fall apart under criticism when they're the only person that can help themselves. If I can help I will, but often the only person that can fight back is the person in question. In which case I just hate seeing them fall apart.

 

Of course there are a few sore spots for me that always hurt and that I always take straight to heart. Unfortunately this is true even if the person isn't trying to offensive, or even "brutally honest", but just happens to say the wrong thing that they probably can't even imagine why it would be offensive. It's probably further complicated by the fact that apart from these few things I'm generally pretty difficult to offend or upset so I'm sure it seems like it comes from out of no where. I realize this, and I don't hold it against the person, but it does hurt. LOL, generally in this case I'll be completely open and honest with my feelings since the person wasn't trying to hurt me in the first place and since I'm not on the offensive.

 

 

 

Performers perform because they are attention whores. You think I used to march around on a field with a saxophone for the hell of it? Ya think I played that thing on stage at concerts, doing solos and whatnot, just cause I could? Ya think I write cause I like to type? Noooooo, I am indeed guilty of attention whoring. And GOD I love the attention that comes with performing. Anyone who says they don't love it is a baldfaced liar.

 

So, the risk of being made fun of or whatever is much less important to me than the possibility of being applauded.

What an awesome post!! Everyone come look at Jamie's clever post!!

 

 

Similarly, i posted the first chapter of my very first story a few days back. Had i not received a single positive feedback, i would have never posted another chapter. But, coming back to the point. Once a person is experienced in his/her field, he/she starts taking feedback, +ve or -ve, with a pinch of salt and strives to do better. Hence, i feel all types of feedbacks are necessary as it gives a person humility to understand that he can improve a lot.

Yes, I agree. Postive feedback is definitely more important in the beginning phases of something, and I think it's very important to remember this and adjust what and how they say something accordingly.

 

Take care all and have a great day!

Kevin

[Razor]

I guess overall I consider myself thick skinned. That's not to say I don't react to criticism, I just don't fall apart over it. My most likely reaction will be to either distance myself from the situation until I can improve (assuming I think the criticism was accurate), or to distance myself emotionally from the person who did the criticising (assuming I think it was unfair). That second part sounds worse than it is. I tend to be a very emotionally available, empathetic person. If I remained emotionally close to someone who was harshly and unfairly criticising me it would be bad for my emotional well-being. The distance is also usually temporary, usually only until I/we can work out whatever the issue is, or if it's completely about me until I can sort out what to do with the criticism. But anyway, while I'll adapt I most certainly won't break if someone criticises me.

 

The only time criticism really does hurt is, as the others have said, when it comes from someone I respect in the area that they're knowledgable about. In other words a friend that I really like and respect could say "what a stupid play" with regards to some game I'm playing, and chances are I won't care if the friend is less knowledgable about the game than I am.

 

Also, the criticism should be about something subjective if it's going to hurt me. If you say you don't like something I've written, or painted, or otherwise created and I care about you (and you've done it in a harsher way than simply "I don't like that"), THEN I'll be hurt. If it's something objective then it doesn't really bother me because either you know more about it than me in which case you're right and the criticism can help, or you know less about it than me and I'm right so your opinion doesn't matter.

 

Actually I admit that during an argument/confrontation/fight I won't let my opponent see that he/she has hurt me at all. It may have hurt but I'll deal with it later on on my own or with trusted people, but I'll hold up during the incident itself. To be honest the only time I do let someone see that they've hurt me would be if I were doing it for guilt or sympathy purposes.

 

Few things frustrate me more than seeing someone fall apart under criticism when they're the only person that can help themselves. If I can help I will, but often the only person that can fight back is the person in question. In which case I just hate seeing them fall apart.

 

Of course there are a few sore spots for me that always hurt and that I always take straight to heart. Unfortunately this is true even if the person isn't trying to offensive, or even "brutally honest", but just happens to say the wrong thing that they probably can't even imagine why it would be offensive. It's probably further complicated by the fact that apart from these few things I'm generally pretty difficult to offend or upset so I'm sure it seems like it comes from out of no where. I realize this, and I don't hold it against the person, but it does hurt. LOL, generally in this case I'll be completely open and honest with my feelings since the person wasn't trying to hurt me in the first place and since I'm not on the offensive.

What an awesome post!! Everyone come look at Jamie's clever post!!

Yes, I agree. Postive feedback is definitely more important in the beginning phases of something, and I think it's very important to remember this and adjust what and how they say something accordingly.

 

Take care all and have a great day!

Kevin

 

 

 

Yeah, but that's cause you're just cool like that and anybody who takes a dig at you is a dick. It's funny how you deal with things. You've got a good system, but I can't stay that calm. If someone I don't respect criticizes me unfairly, I'm going to do my dead level best to tear them apart completely. It's only fair, seeing as how they opened their mouth with the intent of hurting someone else. I do the same thing when I see someone getting attacked unfairly. Plus, what's better than delivering a good old fashioned verbal bitchslap?

[Ieshwar]

I think that I'm rather thin-skinned. I get easily hurt by criticisms or easily flattered by praises. Sometimes, I try to reason myself that the person might be wrong or that he hasn't understood me but then, my depressing self kicks in and I start self-pitying. I have been told quite much things and unfortunately, I never forget them. During a bad mood, all of them surface and add to my depression. Grrr!

 

Of course, this isn't hightly recommended to an amateur writer. I have previously found myself thinking to stop writng coz of no responses. I think I should be a bit more lenient about myself.

 

Ieshwar