PrivateTim

I am not sure on what basis you think they could be out with no problems. There might not be problems in their immediate circle (or might be, we still don't know where Ally lies), but that doesn't mean they wouldn't encounter issues at school, and in the community. I also think Grace was over the top. Technically Luke and Jackson are adults. It is a little late for her to join the parenting game.

I don't think Cindy is all that bad. She is just a mother trying to protect her son. Jackson's reputation as a wild child is well established and most people thought he was an ass the first several chapters. If people wanna read about bad mothers they should dial into a Mark Arbour story and read about Brenda Hayes and Janice Schluter, two mothers from the bowels of hell. But at 18, the boys can ignore her pretty much, especially as long as Luke's father stays in his corner.

I understand the horseback ride is only half over, but I was expecting drama, a buck-off, a runaway horse or the boys getting lost. It seems they are having fun though, making memories... I just wonder when they'll start trying to make babies 😲

I think Grace has seen more seriousness in Jack and some growth and maturity. I think she attributes that to him starting to figure himself out.

They are details that are important to me as a lifelong, competitive swimmer, but largely irrelevant to the main thrust and theme of the story. Your writing and capturing teen angst and drama is wonderful.

I didn’t know how long I could keep up with all these fucking secrets, either. I could see them all coming out and blowing up in my face and sometimes I wished they would. At least then I’d be free of thinking about them and having to be careful. I wasn’t the careful type. When you are a gay/bi male and you can't be out, you learn pretty early on how to compartmentalize, not just feelings, but actions as well. “I know this is a short race from what you’re used to, so you can push yourself, but we have a long year and you’ll have more events added someday soon.” I know the story is 52 chapters in and this chapter is six years old, but as an FYI, this is the exact opposite of what a swim coach would do in real life. In swimming, nothing matters until the Q's (qualifying meets leading to the nationals). In early season meets a coach shoves you into the max number of events, even in events you suck in. They do this for a variety of reasons, for one, it is just more conditioning, but the biggest reason is that competition isn't like swimming against the clock or teammates. The only way to learn how to swim in a competition is to swim in a competition. The more you do, the better you get. There is no substitute for that experience. What Jackson did in maybe swimming too fast in his heat is because he lacks experience. The more heats and events he swims in, the better he is going to get. And unless he was injured, no coach would pull a swimmer from the finals of an event. Just like the only way to learn how to swim in a competition is to swim in a competition, the only way to learn how to swim in a final is to swim in a final. Michael Phelps didn't win races because he was the fastest swimmer, he was the fastest swimmer because he refused to lose.

It is absolutely wrong for anyone to try and force Luke or Tony out of the closet, so to speak. It is none of their damn business and it can have real consequences, bad, nasty ones, in people's lives sometimes. My guess is Ally would not be in Jack's corner, but maybe I am wrong. What I do know is how many friends I have who were outed in high school before they were ready to be, and it was because they told someone they thought they trusted (a girl) and that person just buried them at their school. The whole swimming part is just not a set-up I've ever experienced before. Typically a swimmer enters 4-6 individual events and 1-3 relays.

In the annals of gay teen fiction, Cindy was pretty mild. There were no threats of eternal damnation, Satan's name never came up once, no mention of sinfulness or wickedness, just a mother unhappy about underage drinking. I don't think Cindy was "holding anything over their heads", I think she was saying that since Jackson was "the boy that lived" (sorry JK), that Grace should have been more protective and less indulgent. We did get an insight into maybe why Jackson's parents have been so lenient. Yeah sorry, but that just sounds terribly bigoted to me. Is there a reason to dislike "religious" people just because they are "religious"?

I think people, starting with Lily, were a little too quick to detect anything between Jackson and Luke. I mean Luke has only been at the school for a week and the only real major interaction with the whole group was at the lunch table and that was mostly one day, the first one. That seems quick to pick up on anything between Jack and Luke, and there really isn't mush there, I also think Luke needs to explain to Jack (and us) what he thinks is at stake if he is outed? Does he fear being kicked out of his house and cutoff by his parents? We haven't really seen that much of Cindy, other than she is protective, maybe overly so, of Luke, but is that because she already knows Luke is gay? Lastly, I wish we knew where this town is and where the college is that Jackson plans to go to. But when I was getting ready for college, I applied to about five different schools and I am pretty sure I didn't start getting acceptance letters until the late fall, maybe early winter. But of the people I knew going to college (which was about 95% of my high school) everyone applied to multiple schools. There was your "reach" school (Harvard, Stanford, etc), your desired school (Cal, Michigan, etc) and your fallback school (Cal State Fresno, San Diego State, etc). Some knew they were going to community college their first two years and so none of them stressed over acceptance letters like everyone else did.

Whether or not Jackson is actually gay or not remains to be seen, but at this point in the story I don't think he even remotely considers himself gay. Luke has stirred some feelings in him that appear to be brand new, although we don't know if he'd even done any experimentation with Derek or Toby, or someone else before. That certainly wouldn't be unusual for teen boys as they get hormonal, huge numbers do, but the vast majority do identify as straight, despite the wandering. The swim team is sure different from any swim team I was ever on. There was never a set limit on how many guys were in a team. In a bigger team they might divide into upper and lower groups based on times and abilities, but the groups were always flexible, not rigid numbers. It should be interesting. Lastly, is there any chance Jackson won't drink at Toby's party? Won't make an ass of himself? That too should be interesting.

Nose clip? No one wears a nose clip unless you are in an SNL comedy skit. As to shaving down, you never shave down until you get to a qualifying meet that leads to a final. I do get a slightly creepy vibe from the Garrison's too, but since Krista isn't Mark Arbour I am sure nothing will come of it 😁

High school girlfriends are scary things. They are completely paranoid, insanely possessive, insanely clingy and hell on wheels when scorned. Mean Girls doesn't even start to cover it when they sense a threat. Jackson needs to be at a high school party and mack on some other girl in front of Ally so she won't concentrate on Luke. I played this game really well in high school.

Losing the scholarship doesn't mean he loses his university admission or that he can't be on the team, it merely means he needs to find a different way to finance his education. The better DI swim programs have 30-35 swimmers on their roster and there are only 9.9 scholarships allowed by the NCAA. That means there are very few DI college swimmer on full ride scholarships. It is an ego blow, but should not be a major derailment.

If I was Jackson I'd create a fake gmail account and send Welker an email that Jackson was seeing his daughter to get Allison off his back. She is a pain, better to cut her off at the knees now before Jack gets weak, tells her he likes Luke and then she outs Luke to the whole school. Surely Jack must realize the consequences of Luke being outed before the end of the school year. I don't think Henry would let Cindy kick Luke out of the house, but it remains a possibility.

For 65,000 to 70,000 words, Jackson is the dumbest mudderfudger I've ever seen in my life and then he busts out with this: “I can’t be gay,” he said falling silent. “I can’t be.” “Just be Luke,” I said reaching out for him. “Be Luke and I’ll be Jackson.” Yes! Why can't it be that simple? Why does everyone need labels so badly? In two of my favorite stories, It Started With Brian and Crosscurrents, both based on true events, men who are not gay, allow themselves to fall in love with and be with a gay man. Apropos of nothing specific in this story, but some hints of maybe, but are staples of gay fiction, here are my three biggest pet peeves. 1) Christians (church people) are virulently anti-gay, sometimes violently so - I've been a Christian and church goer my whole life and still attend church with my partner to whom I am legally married. We are intimately involved in the church and welcomed. 2) Two boys in love are incapable of hiding their love for each other and everyone will know - No one in middle school or high school ever suspected I was anything but the straightest boy in the school and the same went for the many boys I'd been with and shared feelings with. 3) A gay/bi boy can't shower with other naked boys 'cuz he'll pop wood - I started playing skin flute with neighbor boys and a cousin when I was 12 and none of us ever popped wood in the showers despite the fact that we looked.

OMG Stanfurd isn't even a full university, it is right there IN THEIR NAME, Leland Stanfurd, JUNIOR UNIVERSITY 🤣

Jackson is a major league asshole and his mother is a saint to have put up with his crap for so long. I don't think she and her husband were neglectful, I think like many parents with only one child they were indulgent. No. If my best friends were urging/leading me to do what I know is wrong, they would not get many more chances to stay my best friends. What have any of the "church people" done to anyone in this story to justify calling them "harpies" or losers, as has been done? The only losers in this story so far are Jackson and his friends.

He has shown signs when he and Luke slept together and his morning wood lasted longer than normal and Jack even worried if his tenting the covers was noticeable. I am glad they kissed and I am glad Jack returned the kiss, especially since he appeared to do it to keep Luke calm and from panicking.

I never mentioned Will’s priorities, I said his "interests", which is different. Everyone I know, and certainly in Will's universe of The Menlo School and Harvard-Westlake, has an idea of what they want to do in the future. Those plans have probably changed every other year since the age of ten, and may change three more times in college, and again once he starts a career, but at least people do have thoughts to the future and choosing where to go to college is an important part of that. When I was a senior, if you wanted to be an architect, you went to Cal Poly SLO or USC; a filmmaker, USC, UCLA or Chapman; a doctor, UCSD, UCI or Stanford; winemaker, UC Davis; a business major, USC, ASU and Harvard; and so on. Future plans did effect school choice as did things like if you played sports, if you wanted the Big Football School experience (USC, Cal, UCLA), small school experience (Claremont Colleges, Occidental, St. Mary's, etc) or religious (Azusa Pacific, Pepperdine, Cal Lutheran, etc) and lastly, what your family could afford. But I'd say the #1 driver was future plans.

Stylistically I wonder about several things: “You church people,” I hissed, rolling my eyes. “You make my high school sound like a, well I don’t know, but it’s not that bad. I have enough fun there and no one gets hurt.” In a small town, the name of the high school is most likely the name of the town, so why wouldn't Jack say, "Westerville High (or what ever the name of the school is) isn't that bad" vs "my high school". If Cindy and Luke's mom are best friends, and they go to church together, surely Jack would have gone to church as a kid and maybe be allowed to stop going at a certain age. And in small towns, a lot of times churches are the glue that holds together a town, and more people go to church than not, whether or not they are actual believers. So wouldn't Luke and Jack have known each other as kids? Done family BBQs, etc together? They might have become estranged after Jack stopped going to church, but they still would have had a history of some sort.

How did you have any respect for Jack to begin with? He's been an ass since the story's first paragraph. I actually think on a subconscious level Jack is afraid to have Luke in school with him. Somewhere in the deep recesses of his mind there is the question of why he had morning wood for so long when Luke was around. No mystery why Luke would ever speak to Jackson again, he likes Jack. He may not fully understand how or why (or maybe he is more aware than we know), but he likes Jack warts and all.

It is one thing to be in Boston for a week when it is cold, but when the first snow falls in October and is still around in April.... it gets old pretty fast.

What's up with Jackson's mom? How about she has a son Jackson who is a spoiled complete ass-wipe who hasn't had to face enough consequences for his actions and attitudes in the past and now she is realizing that leniency didn't work. Jackson's mom is a pussycat compared to Luke's mom.

The thing that has never been discussed is what Will's future plans on. He has never mentioned any hobbies or interests besides fucking (which becomes old at some point) and surfing (which he already rejected as a career). To me Harvard is good for four things, Law, Medicine, Politics & Government and Business (MBA). I don't see any reason to go to Harvard to get a degree in any other field.

It is more like, "Okay, gag and barf. Almost similar words were exchanged with (fill in name) and Will and similar pledge."