PrivateTim

Wow is all I can say. A twin spin of emotion today.

Hmmm, well I guess that is that then.......

I would really encourage people to click on the links I posted in response #642 and then read all the stories in USA Today that are linked. Not everyone who tried to help people and died doing so that day were professionals, quite a few were ordinary people. Many of the "civilian" heroes that day lived, which is how we know their stories and many people survived but their civilian hero did not, that is how we know that part of the story as well. Centex, the "Inches decide life, death on the 78th floor" is one you might find especially interesting. The 78th Floor was the transfer lobby of the South Tower where people used express elevators to get the ground and it is where the tilted plane partially hit the South Tower. The lobby was packed from people trying to evacuate when the plane hit. I think only 7 people got out of the lobby alive using Stairway A. I too hope Robbie doesn't get through, but we will have to wait.

Another gripping chapter. I won't assume anything because authors get to bend reality a little, but one of the links I posted in the forums from USA Today, "Delay meant Death" or words to that effect, Hank & Jeanine's fate would have been sealed by not leaving when Will, Robbie & Darius did. The only hope for Robbie is that he wasn't able to get back up through the increasing heat and smoke. I have mixed feelings on Senator Danfield. He was not one of the more lovable characters early on, but he has largely redeemed himself (as much as that is possible for his horrible actions). It is sad to think Wade may not get the chance to continue the healing process. I am hopeful he can still find his way out. Overall though, a tremendous chapter...... I do wonder what is rolling through JJ's mind now as things unfold further.

I had just started three weeks off from my firm. My bar exam results were not in yet so my work at the firm was busy work so they not going miss me and I was taking the three weeks off because I was flying to Barcelona from JFK on Sept 15 with my family to celebrate my grandparents 50th anniversary. We had flights from LAX to JFK at 6AM on Sept.14. I was up getting ready to head to the pool to work out when I saw on the news that a "small plane" had hit the WTT. I sat down to watch the news because the footage was pretty dramatic. My memory is, and it could be faulty, but it is how I remember it, that the news commentator was talking with the video screen of the burning tower as the second plane struck behind him, he paused, very confused and after a few seconds of silence said, "I don't think this is an accident" (or words to that effect) and I thought 'well no shit Sherlock'. Thankfully later in the day I had to officiate a high school water polo game, one of the few that was not cancelled that day, otherwise I would have been home, glued to the TV being maudlin. The high school kids didn't quite get the import of the day at that time. I've never really asked them now what they thought back then, but I still see a couple of the guys who played that day and they are now coaching themselves so maybe I'll corner them and ask in reflection what they thought. The reactions we got in Europe were interesting and the activity in our hotel at JFK was interesting, but those are stories for another day.

I can't imagine any court awarding Will custody regardless of circumstances. Cody might be a party guy, but I don't think he is an ass. Unless Mark decides differently for poetic license Cody will get custody. What he decides to do with that custody is another matter. If the family could get their act together as a group, I'd think they'd propose to Cody that Jack & Claire raise Maddy while Cody retains his legal rights. If Cody wanted nothing to do with Maddy, which again, I don't see, I think he'd have a had time walking away from his parental responsibilities. Bottom line is it would be a legal morass since no one really has a solid legal claim. Brad would be Jeanine's common law husband since all Brad and Robbie could be at that point is RDP and I don't think they are; Will is a half brother, not full and wasn't living with Maddy at the time of her mother's (presumed at this point) death and the fact that he was emancipated from his mother and father could work against him. Here's to hoping the zeitgeist of 9-11 pulls the family together to help Cody with one mind. ****************************************** In refreshing my memory on the events of 9-11 I ran across some interesting articles in USA Today (who knew USA Today could have interesting articles). Delay Meant Death on 9/11 Inches Decide Life & Death on the 78th Floor Desperation Forced a Horrific Decision I won't post all the links, but the USA Today stories have links to the about 10 articles on that day. They are gripping, heart wrenching tales. ******************************* For the CAP story, I thought the chapter was masterful and I really liked the various viewpoints, especially JJ's as he gets to view the insanity of his family from a slightly detached POV. I don't see JJ as the prig or vacuous youth that some do, nor do I see future JJ as a brand conscious Millennial. In some ways he may turn out to be the most normal. ******************************** As the story moves forward from 9-11, the CAP story not the day, I hope we get to see Jeff and his brother Ryan, Cody & Maddy, Kai, Cam, Alistair or whatever other good guy comes into Will's life and Brad as a more mature, focused person as his defense company ramps up.

Ha ha, I should have guessed you'd never be able to wait until 9-11-13 to actually open the dram I bet you were one of those kids who opened at least one Christmas present on Christmas Eve! It is hard to believe this is one of the longest chapters (#2) in the story because it flew by. The POV I enjoyed the most was JJ's actually. I'd love to see read JJ read Will the riot act because Will is reaping the downside of being the favorite now, but JJ feels like the complete non-entity. I think it is worse to be invisible than to be hated or loved. JJ could give Brad a piece of his mind as well. I would mind A Summer of JJ (Love) POV for 10 chapters or so. Lovely beginning. I think it is pretty obvious where things are going to fall and it brings up all kinds of interesting possibilities.

The nouveau riche are every place in So Cal, I don't know that they are concentrated in anyone place. Maybe a place like Manhattan Beach that was always solidly middle class, but because of property values found itself becoming upper class. That didn't start in 2000 though, it probably started in the 1980's. The places that had the high foreclosure rates were the lower middle class areas like the Inland Empire where people who were making $50k were buying $400,000 homes thinking the value was going to go up the way it always had. There is no "small lot" movement in "LA". The City of Los Angeles is one, small geographic part of Greater Los Angeles. The expansion and building in COLA with the lawns and pools that happened post WWII was in the San Fernando Valley largely and suburban areas and cities.

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The DOD does not track reasons for enlistment, but there was an uptick in enlistments immediately post 9-11 (more quotas and goals were met than in previous periods) and the biggest difference was the quality of the enlistee as outlined in a GAO report. The Demographics of Military Enlistment after 9/11

Most UC schools are quarter, except Cal, all the State Universities are semester schools and the Cal Poly schools are quarter and all the JCs are semester schools, so it just depends. As to the OC stuff, no one in my family (parts of which have been in Orange County since the 1920's) had ever heard Orange County called "the OC", ever. Someone might have said, "I live in OC" or "next time you are in OC", but never ever with "the" in front of it. As to the interview where Schwarz said of USC, "It was more a reflection of this idea of going to USC and being surrounded by all these kids from Newport Beach who were water-polo players", it is a completely absurd statement. Newport Beach only has two high schools, Newport Harbor and Corona del Mar and while both are huge powers in water polo, they still are only going to have 5 or 6 seniors every year and not every one goes to USC, maybe one or two. The rest will be at Stanfurd, Cal, UCI, UCSB, Navy, and other schools so at most at any given time there might be 8-10 guys from Newport Beach at USC who played water polo and USC is a school with 17,000 undergrads. That is hardly "surrounded". Newport Beach has always been a playground for the rich and famous, it was never a middle class town. It didn't suddenly prosper in 2000. What changed was the culture, not of Newport Beach, but of the entire society of the U.S. where ostentatiousness became the norm and it didn't start in 2000, it started well before that when people started wearing labels (polo ponies, alligators, golden rams, etc) on the outside of their clothing, not the inside. The Official Preppy Handbook was published in 1980 and it was gently mocking the trends already and at the same time you had the Sloane Rangers in the UK so it was not just a U.S. trend, it was a general shift in culture. It is also very, very hard to discuss trends in CA, even OC, because it is not DL where when someone sneezes in one part of the state someone else in another says, 'Gesundheit'. CA is so big and multicultural that areas 10 miles apart (downtown Santa Ana & Newport Beach) can be vastly different. The average Newport Beach kid has more in common with a La Jolla kid (70 miles), Santa Barbara kid (140 miles) and Santa Cruz kid (400 miles) than they do with Santa Ana kids.

I think Will and Noah will get back to a good place because Will will understand that Noah was a victim here and he won't be willing to victimize him twice. Cam seems nice, I hope Will can have a nice, normal relationship with him. I do hope that even in 2001 Will remains sensitive to the fact that not everyone can be out and that people come to the place of telling the world they are gay/bi in their own time and comfort level and that in a lot of cases it is one step at a time, first a few friends, then a few more, then immediate family, extended family and the rest of the world and it never really does stop, Sometimes the more people are against you (Darius, JJ, JP, Robbie, etc) instead of moving you off your position, it actually entrenches you that much more. I think Brad is in that place right now and the emotion driven Stef is along for the ride. I do get that we are going to lose some people that maybe we wish we didn't lose, but for the remaining people, family and friends, I think it will refocus people on what is important in life. The one thing I remember post 9-11 is how everyone seemed to get along for a while. There was a sense of unity and people treated each other a little nicer. I don't remember how long that lasted, a few weeks, a couple of months, but it is the one thing that sticks with me after the shock of the friends and acquaintances I lost.

Wow, the most reviews in a long time..... wonder why everyone is paying so much attention lately. I think I've figured out Noah.... Marie told Noah the only reason she turned him down for the dance was Will asked her to because he wanted Noah for himself. It is about the only thing that makes sense on how a sweet kid goes 180 the other direction. Man it is going to be awkward tomorrow when Will and hunky football player bump into Tony.... what's he doing in NYC?

Lovely piece of writing. As much as I enjoy Will as a narrator it is so nice to have JPs POV back in the story and I suspect that POV will be critically important in the days ahead. Be interesting to see how the Menlo School handles Ferris and the situation with Will. I wonder if they would have had on campus cameras in 2001. Like H-W, they take the honor code, bullying and harassment very seriously.

IKEA, are you kidding? They have slings in three different colors and one that only uses green energy and vegan lube..

“When I was a boy of 14, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be 21, I was astonished at how much the old man had learned in seven years.” Attributed to Mark Twain Oh you are so wrong here. Rape is a crime of power and control only in some cases does it involve violence. A rape victim does not say "no" sometimes because they can not out of fear of violence, fear of reprisal or the lack of mental capacity to say no. Mere lack of a "no" and a claim of "expressive consent" (I knew she wanted it too) is a very weak defense in rape cases. The notion of "I knew he/she wanted it too, but I had to take control" is a 1970's attitude that if a defendant said that on the stand it would take everything his lawyer had not to reach out and not choke him right there. Juries don't like that attitude. The fraternity house that I advise at USC we bring in an ADA every fall to speak to the pledge class on what constitutes rape and especially the idea of "date rape" and by the time he is done he has scared the 18 year olds into at least two weeks of celibacy, maybe longer. As to Will & Brad, it is very hard to have a calm, polite conversation with someone that won't talk to you. I can only imagine the pent up anxiety of the father of a 14 year old who has their own bar, is buying pot and has a sex room and won't take his phone calls. It also takes two to have a shouting match just as it takes two to have a calm, polite conversation.

You mean John who is grounded right now?? The single best post on all 23 pages. The notion that we can see the mature side of Will (as well as the immature) is key. You are right that Brad only sees the one side.

Pot has been defacto legal to smoke in CA for many years, long before medical marijuana because the vogue. Possession of small amounts of marijuana was only a ticketable offense and many police stopped even doing that. They still went after traffickers, but the JPs of the world who were growing for home usage were pointedly ignored. As to sex, I do think you need to check the California Penal Code. CPC 261.5 a states, "Unlawful sexual intercourse is an act of sexual intercourse accomplished with a person who is not the spouse of the perpetrator, if the person is a minor." CPC 261.5 b states, "Any person who engages in an act of unlawful sexual intercourse with a minor who is not more than three years older or three years younger than the perpetrator, is guilty of a misdemeanor." So under CA law, even minors may not lawfully have sex with each other. I am not saying that prosecutors are standing in line to prosecute minors for having sex with each other, but they can and have. Not sure where murder came into the discussion. The discussion was about the difference between activities that are legal at one age, but not at another because the law recognizes that children do not have the proper judgement to engage in certain activities. A parent who drinks is not a hypocrite for telling their 14 year old not to drink. They are not even a hypocrite if they drank at 14. They are imparting their wisdom to the 14 year old on the topic through experience. Kitt, the point is not the law stops anyone from actually breaking the law, but that it is the law. It all stems from the many comments about Brad's hypocrisy because he drank and smoked in high school. it is okay to tell a 14 year old, 'yes I drink and you can too when you are 21'. There is nothing hypocritical in that. it is also okay to tell your kid, 'yes I drink when I was in high school and it was a mistake for the following reasons'. That is what parents are supposed to do, impart the wisdom of their experience to their children. In Brad's case his drinking and that of his peers led to the death of his brother and a lifelong wedge with his step mother. Seems to me he has pretty good reason to call his son on his drinking. As to pot smoking, you can not be arrested or imprisoned for possession of one ounce or less. It is a ticket with a fine of $100, if they bother to write you up.

As a Californian you should know that pot smoking, alcohol drinking and multiple sex partners are all legal activities for someone over 18 years of age and illegal for someone 14 years of age.

Oh man my head is spinning, I hardly know where to start..... a lot of inaccuracies and mis-remembering I think. 1) In no way would Brad win a court battle to revoke Will's emancipation unless Will was in a coma from a heroin overdose at the end of a long string of arrests and failures. Brad's time to protest the emancipation was before it was granted. He made the correct call in not fighting it, but supporting it.... which is why the current Brad's behavior is incongruous with the Brad who made that decision. I will chalk it up to "author's prerogative" in order to bring about a situation he can resolve in later chapters. 2) It is ironic that everyone who wants Marie broken, knuckled under, house arrested, shipped off to boarding/military school decried such actions for the much more out of control Will less than a year ago. 3) You can not use Mr. Martin as a justification for anything since before Will knew he was going to be abusive, he'd already taken steps to run away and drug Mr. Martin. 4) I am not sure where people see all this growth and maturity in Will. Refusing to take his father's phone calls or other wise speak with him is the ultimate immaturity. People who are adults talk over situations. Irrespective of how Brad acts, Will, if he were the wise, mature person he is supposed to be wouldn't fly off the handle and runaway every time he is mad at his father. The advice Darius gave him for school would work doubly well on Brad. Nothing would get under Brad's skin more than a calm Will (whether or not he felt calm on the inside) and give blase answers to Brad's threats ("yeah, yeah take me back to court, can someone pass the green beans") 5) Why does everyone assume that an adult who doesn't think their 14 year old should be getting drunk, smoking pot and having sex with 30+ partners has forgotten their youthful exploits? How about an adult who has grown up and looking back realizes that all those exploits were not necessarily the healthiest things for them and they are trying to use the benefit of their experience to help their kids avoid the same? 6) I think Will is being a complete asshole to his father. Why does Will expect that treating his father the way he does will produce positive results? If he would take Brad's calls, had taken them in Hawaii and talked to his father he might have been able to diffuse the situation, but he chooses instead to not take because he knows it pushes Brad's buttons. (*note to dear readers, don't bluster back about Brad's behavior, because Brad's bad behaviors do not justify Will's bad behavior. A mature person would call Brad on his behavior in a calm manner, a rational manner and would make the efforts to hold a civil conversation. If Brad doesn't react in a civilized manner then Will can call him on it, not get his panties in a wad and runaway again.) 7) Will has defacto thrown Brad out of Escorial. His passive aggressive behavior has placed JP in the situation of making his son not welcome in his house or his unstable grandson, who less than a year ago ran away after drugging his father and Martin and wracking utter destruction on his parents possessions. It is wrong (immature) of Will to place JP in that position, but is typical of an immature teen who places their self at the center of the universe. 8) Brad does not talk at Will given how few opportunities Will gives him to talk to him at all. Will managed to contribute to his mother's instability by treating her like hired help and not his mother (but Brad had his hand in contributing to that by not backing up Jeannine in her discipline of Will and not co-parenting). 9) You can not simultaneously praise Will for his maturity while excusing his bad behavior as the mistakes of youth. Lastly, I don't see any double standard in the sexploits of Darius vs Will since I couldn't begin to guess how many sexual encounters Darius has had since we've only seen him with a couple of partners. 85% of teens 12th grade and under have had fewer than four sex partners through high school and 15.9 was the average age for a teen boy to lose his virginity. If Darius had more than 4 when he graduated from HS, that would put him in the minority with Will who has already blown the doors off the averages not just for high school students, but for men in general since only 29% of men, under the age of 59 have had 15 or more partners.

Thanks for the frenetic pace of writing Mark it is such a pleasure to wake up to a new Chapter of CAP. Actually, I think Grienne is pretty right on in her evaluation and I might go even further, I think Will is being a complete asshole to his father. Why does Will expect that treating his father the way he does will produce positive results? If he would take Brad's calls, had taken them in Hawaii and talked to his father he might have been able to diffuse the situation, but he chooses instead to not take because he knows it pushes Brad's buttons. I agree that Will has defacto thrown Brad out of Escorial. His passive aggressive behavior has placed JP in a difficult situation. The rest I'll save for the forums. Thanks again Mark.

I feel badly they don't have the reviews and votes they deserve, but I think in the multiple times that GA has shifted the software either caused them to be lost or you couldn't do reviews.... or maybe reviews weren't a thing yet.

Not strange at all, especially given the circumstances. At one time I had emails from Compuserve, Prodigy and AOL starting back to when I was 14 (1991 and on) saved in files, but given that I've been through at least 6 storage media era (5 1/4 floppy, 3.5 floppy, ZipDisk, R/W CD, thumb drive and now Google Drive) and untold number of personal computers, I have no idea what happened to those files. I'd love to read some of them now. I had a really tight group of friends on the gay teen Prodigy boards and then a much wider, but less tight group of friends from AOL, or Gay-O-L as we called it. We used to have beach parties at Huntington Beach State Beach where over 200 guys from our AOL chat circle would show up. So yeah..... I wish I could find some of those old emails and chats.

Naw, I know an awesome school for her in Greece.