BigBen

I doubt that Hank ever consciously glommed on to Chase's problems simply to gratify his own ego, but I see signs that perhaps he felt better when Chase needed him, because as Chase has grown stronger, more independent, and less needy, Hank seems to be more and more taken aback. It's possible to slip into that, even when starting from a place of healthy love. It's quite possible, however, that I'm reading into the situation something that isn't there, or perhaps there's a better way to describe what I see, sorry. As far as respect goes, I see the running, whoever did it, as a form of lack of respect. If you really value someone, you engage with them, and encourage them to engage with you. Again, perhaps there is a better way of describing things that I'm not managing to come up with. It also seems we are focusing on different aspects of the situation: you are giving Hank credit for following through and tracking Chase down, whereas I am jumping on his willingness to assume the worst and his inflexible refusal to hear any plea for forgiveness. It is entirely possible, of course, that I am excusing Chase's behavior simply because he is the viewpoint character, and I am engaged with him. You, as the author, can see into Hank's heart and soul, whereas we, the readers, can only know what Chase sees, because that's how the narrative is structured. On the other hand, I am also mindful of Dawson's repeated cautions that Chase is giving too much credit to Hank's view of the situation. So when Hank shows his belief that Chase's alleged affair with Dawson constitutes cheating on the relationship, whereas his own admitted affair with Kevin is acceptable because the relationship is over, I take Dawson's warnings to heart and see someone who is being rather unfair. Hank's pain explains his behavior but doesn't justify it any more than Chase's pain justifies his behavior with regard to the marriage proposal. ETA: I think we can both agree that Hank is not evil, but rather badly messed up. I do hope he can find a way to deal with his issues, but I also doubt that it can happen in time to forge any kind of meaningful relationship with Chase.

I don't see how they can, if by "sorting out their issues" you mean getting back together. Hank has declared the relationship over, he has declared Chase's refusal of his marriage proposal and subsequent behavior to be unforgivable, he has reneged on his promise of friendship, and in this chapter he has now blithely passed off his sleeping with Kevin as "not cheating," whereas the affair he imagines Chase and Dawson to be having apparently does somehow count as cheating (someone really needs to tell him he can't have it both ways). On top of it all, Hank was in love with the dysfunction, not with the real Chase, and Chase has just asserted that he is no longer the man Hank was in love with ("I'm not that guy anymore"). Hank has destroyed the old relationship—they can't return to it. The problem is that Hank has shown very little respect for Chase, which is why he was so ready to jettison their relationship at the first major problem. Had he truly respected Chase, his handling of the botched marriage proposal would have been quite different. So in the event that Hank should ever get over himself and decide that he wants Chase after all, I would fervently that hope Chase will have the self-respect to insist on their starting over from the beginning. Hank needs to woo Chase all over again—seriously, and with respect. Frankly, it appears at this point that the only way the two of them can sort out their issues is by healing enough that healthy relationships with other people become a possibility. Chase is clearly already in the process of doing just that. What Hank will do still remains to be seen.

Two things I hate are size queens . . . and little dicks. 🤣

He was the gay divorcé. 😁

Are you sure a mere ten will be enough? 🤣🤣 At least it wouldn't be as many as Cave-in . . . 🤣🤣

. . . by my own fault, my most grievous fault. . . .

Because it's Lent, the season of penitence? No, wait . . . 😁

Or perhaps Cave-in's favorite game: World of Whorecraft! 🤣

Oh, I've probably already seen it, without knowing it was you. 🤣

I wish this site updated automatically. By the time my phone re-loads the page and I manage to scroll all the way down to the bottom to see the new comments, three more have been posted . . . ☹️

A star is born! But: A video?

The places I frequented were all too dark for a camera to pick up an image. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

I thought her reasoning was that her illness would take the focus off Chase and Hank, not that Chase couldn't handle it. One of Chase's reasons for freaking out at the proposal was that Christine couldn't share the wedding, and he chides Hank in this chapter for not proposing while Christine was still alive.

But he's been getting a lot of practice with Hank, lol!🤣🤣🤣

Back in the 70's at college, I in fact knew a gay activist who took the position that we had a moral duty to be promiscuous, in order to fight the patriarchy. It worked for him, but not for me. Despite my whoring-around phase, I'm basically a one-man man.

I'm re-reading the chapter again, and all through Dawson's and Chase's conversation about Brent and Hank, and I keep being reminded of the words of an immortal Canadian: "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take." Seems to be the theme of the chapter. We can say that Charles's attempt to reconcile the guys didn't work (not completely, anyway), but think if he hadn't taken the shot. And if Chase had turned around and walked out the door instead of confronting Hank one last time. . . .

Stop bragging, buddy!

Two really good analyses of the story this far. I'd say Danners and FanLit are spot-on. It really looks to me right now as though Chase and Hank are not going to be able to reunite as a couple. For me, I have to say that were I in Chase's place it would be hard to get past Hank's brief affair with Kevin. Chase might be able to, however; he is more forgiving than I am. Hank's readiness to declare the relationship over and move on so quickly still disturb me, and I hope that if Chase decides to forgive Hank, he will not do so without getting to the bottom of what was going on with Hank. The renewed relationship wouldn't be any good, otherwise. The contrast between Kevin and Dawson is really clear, isn't it? Dawson has the strength and integrity not to take advantage of Chase, but Kevin moves right in and takes advantage of Hank's vulnerability.

But ya are the author, Blanche, ya are! 🤣🤣🤣🤣

I don't know that we can blame the entire affair on Cave-in. Hank was very quick to hook up with Kevin after declaring himself done with Chase. How much in love could he be with Chase, to be willing to hook up so quickly? Chase, the supposed cheater, has been faithful to the relationship for months, because he still loves Hank. The only reasons I can think of for Hank's willingness to move on so quickly are things like anger and revenge, which don't reflect well on his character. Another possibility we have to consider is that Hank had already developed feelings for Kevin, even before proposing to Chase, which would explain his insistence that Chase was a cheater, his willingness to immediately declare the relationship completely over, his refusal to listen to Chase's explanations, and his ability to move on so quickly. Perhaps he was glad of the excuse to break up, because he couldn't deal with having feelings for two people at once. As every long-term couple knows, you are going to feel attracted to people outside the relationship from time to time; it's how the couple handle such moments together that defines the relationship. Perhaps Hank was hoping that proposing would help strengthen his commitment to Chase over his attraction to Kevin, when what he really should have done was to acknowledge the attraction to Chase instead of hiding it, so they could have worked through it together. All this speculating is a lot of fun, but Gary alone knows what Gary's gonna do! 😀😊

Warm honey? Now that could be fun!😁 You are right, but the challenge is always to discern when that point has been reached. It may well be that Brent has moved on, but Dawson has realized that he owes it to himself to make sure there's no thread of hope left. Likewise, it may not be possible for Chase and Hank to get back together either, but Chase needs to be certain one way or the other. Dawson doesn't stand a chance with Carter until he finally lets go of Brent, and Chase can't move on, either, until he definitively deals with Hank. I'm glad Charles will probably be able to keep his two sons together as friends, even if he can't fully bring them back together as a couple. He gets many points for making the attempt, because Chase and Hank could never have reconciled on their own. This way, even if they don't become a couple again, they at least will still be in each other's lives. And if Chase does mange to get through to Hank, it will only be because of Hank's affection for Charles holding him still long enough. (I hope this makes sense.)

Oh, yeah. You remember my first comment in chapter one, right? They may not get together again, but if they both learn and grow, it's still a happy ending. And I don't really have that much invested in Dawson and Chase, either, but they would be a fine, well-matched couple, with a solid basis of friendship to underly the romance. Just saying. Friendship is good; it's just that I seemed to be picking up on a bit more at one point, and I liked it. I also really like that Chase has become assertive about his point of view, and it's sad that Hank is still somewhat stuck, despite the signs of cracking. Interesting that he and Kevin have stopped shacking up, but whether that's permanent or temporary is the question, isn't it? It's clear Hank still has feelings for Chase, and they will prevent him from moving on with Kevin, unless I miss my guess. This conversation seems to reinforce my logic from the previous chapter: Hank says he didn't cheat on Chase with Kevin, and that can only mean that it's because he considers the relationship with Chase to be over and done with. So if he still has feelings for Chase, that's a sticky place to be. He can't go forward with Kevin, and he's precluded getting back with Chase. And sleeping with someone is a lot tougher obstacle for a couple to overcome than three measly kisses.

As I mentioned in the last chapter, Chase is capable of forgiving Hank, but Hank is going to have a hard time forgiving himself. At least he's starting to see the connection between his mother's behavior and his reaction to Chase's. I really hope Charles was able to get through to him with that story about Christine and the diamonds. Dang! I was really hoping for Chase and Dawson to get together. Now it seems a foregone conclusion that Dawson's going to go after Brent or Carter, and Hank is all that's left for Chase. While I'm happy to see the movement on Hank's part, I don't really see him and Chase getting back together, somehow. And Kevin simply does not deserve Chase, no way!!! Well, at least our boys are growing up, and if they don't get back together, at least they'll be in better shape for the next relationship. P.S.---If they do get back together, Hank is going to owe Chase a shitload of diamonds--every anniversary and every birthday, for sure! 😁

I'd forgotten about that, and you guys are right. I don't believe in ambushing people, even "in the name of love." I know it's a trope in romantic fiction, but in real life it's a serious invasion of boundaries. In this situation, with Charles caring as much as he does about both men, I suspect he would be able to sit them down and get them talking, without having to trick them into it. Chase trusts his father (especially now that Charles is his old self again), and it sounds as though Hank has enough respect for Charles that he'd assent to a three-way conversation, if Charles asked. I'd be willing to bet that Charles would also be able to ease the two of them past their defined positions (can't think of a better term) and into a real, honest discussion.

I think it's a given that Hank would not have slept with Kevin unless he was certain the relationship with Chase was over, because otherwise he would be cheating on Chase. The way I'm reading this is that he has slept with Kevin and now is realizing that he still has feelings for Chase, in spite of everything. His sadness arises from the realization of having prematurely declared the relationship over. His options at this point are (a) to decide that the relationship is not over, making himself a cheater, by his own standards; or (b) to avoid being a cheater by renouncing Chase, which he's realized he doesn't want to do. He's pretty effectively boxed himself into a corner. The unrecognized third alternative would be to forgive Chase, either by redefining cheating or by giving it up as an issue altogether, but you haven't given us any sign yet that Hank is capable of that kind of growth. We do know that Chase is capable of forgiving Hank, though I hope he would say a few home truths to Hank before doing so. A hard and frank discussion at that point would save a lot of grief, whereas a too-easy reconciliation would lead to more grief down the road. Here's a point where Charles might make a really useful intervention.