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my inner editor is in pain now...

 

i always use "double quotes" for speech even though i am english.

i never put a forth dot on the end when i tail off speaking...

and when using fancy quotes (ie the curly ones) when ever you get cut off -" they end up facing the wrong way round. 

 

so many things i am doing wrong...

 

OO!  I know this one! *as happened to me too many times to count* you put your em dash and then put a comma right after it, then your quote, and then take out the comma.  I have to do this every so often and I've gotten really good and fooling the bugger. :evil:

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All I do is the add the quotation mark after the last letter of the word, with no space between them, hit the left arrow on the keyboard to go back, then use insert, symbol, emdash. Voila.

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OO!  I know this one! *as happened to me too many times to count* you put your em dash and then put a comma right after it, then your quote, and then take out the comma.  I have to do this every so often and I've gotten really good and fooling the bugger. :evil:

 

I do the same, but for some reason, I always add the letter 't' rather than a comma. I don't know why it has to be a t, it's just a habit.

Edited by Thorn Wilde
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I'm a very naughty sheep.  I don't use emdash and endash when writing, I just use an ordinary dash.

 

**ducks and hides from the editing police**

 

Normally word will autocorrect to whatever I need it to be.  But...doesn't it just...LOOK wrong???

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When speaker 1 is saying something that's interrupted by speaker 2 saying something else, then speaker 1 continues as if there was no interruption, I use:

 

“Because I was quick on the draw—”

 

Tom interrupted, “Quick on the draw my behind!”

 

“—and said it first,” I continued, “it’s Tom who’s gotta pick something for us to do.”

 

But how do I show that what the interrupter said didn’t cause the first speaker to stop at all. perhaps:

 

“Because I was quick on the draw—” Tom interrupted, “Quick on the draw my behind!” “—and said it first it’s Tom who’s gotta pick something for us to do.”

 

which is ugly and confusing. Any suggestions? Cia?

 

I never use an ellipses as. . .because of the end-of-line problem. .

.just like this. I'd have to use a non-breaking space between the dots (they aren’t really periods and probably shouldn't be called periods) but that's clumsy (Ctrl-Shift-Spacebar). Word (and other word processing programs) auto-convert ... into a single ellipses character. That is easier for the writer and is an easier way to handle the end-of-line problem.

 

Colin B)

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Hi Colin,

 

   Actually you're doing it right. First off, you can't have 2 people speaking in the same paragraph, so your second example would be incorrect. Secondly, the em-dash within dialogue indicated someone being interrupted or that you're coming into the middle of a conversation. I've used it when someone walks into the room to indicate that the person speaking was talking before the POV character could hear them, and I've used it the way you mention, when someone speaking is interrupted, then resumes speaking. Your use of 'interrupted' and 'continued' as speech tags are a good way to indicate that the person speaking is interrupted and then resuming a statement and is actually grammatically correct in that respect.

 

You can also use a narrated thought or response to indicate the interruption beyond the use of speech tags. I attempt to avoid using them, preferring to share tone/events through physical actions or narrated thoughts from the main character myself. But to be honest, I had no trouble understanding what was being shared in your first example, because I know the rules.  Most of the time you just have to trust that your readers can follow along with who is speaking and the vein of the conversation by using these conventions. 

 

This would be my way of sharing the scene, without using tags. I could change it up to indicate different emotions. But in this, I went with Tom being surprised and annoyed (surprise from his mouth dropping open, the subtle 'my behind' insult for the annoyance) and the 'I' character crossing his arms showing his stubborn belief in what he is saying and his humor is stated overtly when he sarcastically is waiting for Tom to respond to him saying Tom has to pick their activity. I wanted to show subtle arguing, annoying tit for tat byplay between friends, without anyone being truly upset or angry.

 

“Because I was quick on the draw—”

 

Tom's mouth dropped open. “Quick on the draw my behind!”

 

I ignored Tom. “—and said it first, it’s Tom who’s gotta pick something for us to do.” I crossed my arms over my chest and waited. It was funny how he had nothing to say when I was done talking.

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To indicate a pause, like the person trails off speaking, you use ellipses rules. It's not being interrupted if the initial speaker stops talking, which is what a pause would be. If you're indicating an interruption then you must use the correct punctuation for that, along with whatever tags/narration you choose. I'm guessing you're talking about a situation like this:

 

I said, "Well, I was thinking ...."

 

"About kissing me?" His dimples were not nearly as cute as he thought they were when he flashed that cheeky grin.

 

"About going swimming, you dolt." I rolled my eyes.

 

The use of the ellipses indicates that the 'I' trailed off with what 'I' was thinking. The other character simply took advantage of the silence, and 'I' retorted with the ending of the first sentence. It's not a complete sentence, so that wouldn't fly in narration, but think about all the different types of dialogue you have or see around you. This falls almost into the type of dialogue you'd see between close people where one person might finish the sentence for another. You might have two people talk at the same time, or someone who constantly interrupts those around them. You could have two people fighting under their breath using short choppy sentences, or a lecturer at the front of a classroom droning on uninterrupted about a subject.

 

Dialogue is vital to a story and how you punctuate that can change the vibe of the exchanges just as surely as the tags or narrated actions/thoughts of the characters. The difference between a question mark and an exclamation mark or ellipses and em-dashes are subtle indicators that readers pick up on, either from knowing what they mean or because they infer the meaning from the surrounding info.

 

The vibe of this is similar to my earlier example, but not quite the same. Notice, it's not just the punctuation but also the capitalization as well.

 

I said, “Well, I was thinking—”

 

“About kissing me!” His dimples were not nearly as cute as he thought they were when he flashed that cheeky grin.

 

“—about going swimming, you dolt.” I rolled my eyes.

 

The em-dashes indicate speech that isn't as slow, and the exclamation point instead of the question changes the speed and where the emphasis would go if this line was actually spoken. A great way to test out the varied way of 'hearing' the dialogue, which is vital if you want it to feel natural to readers, is to read it aloud. Remember that the ellipses indicates a long pause before the next words are spoken whereas a em-dash at the end or the beginning of a line indicates the next line occurs immediately after the preceding line ends without any pause (when used in the middle of a line, or in narration, they indicates a longer pause or shares what could be considered an 'aside' and takes the place of where amateur authors often like to include parenthesis[yes, much like this here, which I'd do with em-dashes if it were a story]). A question usually is emphasized with the voice rising at the end of the sentence, and a line finished with an exclamation point has a strong, somewhat speedy delivery without any lilt. That is why I always do my first read through on my stories, where I edit the plot and dialogue-not just look for errors-by reading aloud. It catches bad pacing, in narration and dialogue, the best.

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Thanks for the suggestions. I'm writing a story where what a football coach says is yelled over an argument that two of his players are having about a failed play in their last game. The only way to do it is to use words to describe what's happening, like Thorn Wilde suggested. What I want would be easy to do in a video, but this is a story that's to be read not viewed.

 

Colin B)

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Okay, so let's clarify what each are and what you use them for, all in one spot.

 

Hyphen: Made using the hyphen button on the keyboard. This is used for compound words. Eg: Hi-tech, Sci-fi, etc...

 

En dash: Made using the insert symbol method or control, alt, minus key on the number pad. This slightly longer than a hyphen dash is used to connect words. This has the length of a letter 'n' hence the name, en dash. This is used to combine numbers (higher numbers, scores,distance) or when you combine two compound words that use a hyphens. Twenty–three, The Tigers won 55–32, or high-tech–high-powered rifle.

 

Em dash: Made using two hyphens (not all Word editions turn this into a em dash though) so I prefer to use the menu insert symbol method. This is a longer dash the length of an m, or two en dashes, is used to set aside parenthetical elements (I call these 'asides', because they augment the sentence but aren't a sentence themselves and could be removed), or to separate a final part of a sentence that isn't logically part of the sentence. This is also used to indicate interruptions in dialogue.  Eg: The spices—chili pepper and chipotle—burned my tongue. Sue waved to her friends who appeared—Tim, Mary and Dan, among others. (See interrupted dialogue above for that example)

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A question usually is emphasized with the voice rising at the end of the sentence ...

 

Unless you're an Aussie ...

 

In which case it's at the end of every sentence?

 

:lmao:

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  • 4 weeks later...

This isn't necessarily about DIALOGUE punctuation, but it seemed like the best place without posting a new thread ><*  So what if you're talking about a man's best friend.  But you want to be specific about the man.  The man who is standing in front of him.  But you're talking about the man's BEST FRIEND.  So would it be "The man in front of him's best friend was talking incessantly" with the possessive on the last word?  I know that's what I use in oral english, right or wrong...  

 

My first example was decidedly worse...  It was GOING to be the man who slept with your wife.  The best friend of the man who slept with your wife?  It can't possible be the man who slept with your wife's best friend.  That just makes too much sense...for the absolute WRONG meaning.

 

Just wanted a clarification.

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This isn't necessarily about DIALOGUE punctuation, but it seemed like the best place without posting a new thread ><*  So what if you're talking about a man's best friend.  But you want to be specific about the man.  The man who is standing in front of him.  But you're talking about the man's BEST FRIEND.  So would it be "The man in front of him's best friend was talking incessantly" with the possessive on the last word?  I know that's what I use in oral english, right or wrong...  

 

My first example was decidedly worse...  It was GOING to be the man who slept with your wife.  The best friend of the man who slept with your wife?  It can't possible be the man who slept with your wife's best friend.  That just makes too much sense...for the absolute WRONG meaning.

 

Just wanted a clarification.

 

I would say 'the best friend of the man in front of him'... 

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I get that, but have you ever been talking to someone and you're thinking too fast for your mouth to catch up and you start out with the man?  Lol, I know that 'the best friend of the man in front of him' works, but for voice purposes, I'd like to know if there is another way, ya know? :)

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"The man in front of him had a best friend who was talking incessantly," doesn't that work and sound conversational? I agree that "the best friend of" doesn't sound colloquial if you're going for that type of voice. Another option is choppy talk, you know: "the man in front of him, best friend's yappin' up a storm and I'm like, `if you'd shut up for a second, one second, you may find out that no, yer not the only one who hates sardines`, jeez. I don't get it Harry, why can't these losers shut their traps?"

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"The man in front of him had a best friend who was talking incessantly," doesn't that work and sound conversational? I agree that "the best friend of" doesn't sound colloquial if you're going for that type of voice. Another option is choppy talk, you know: "the man in front of him, best friend's yappin' up a storm and I'm like, `if you'd shut up for a second, one second, you may find out that no, yer not the only one who hates sardines`, jeez. I don't get it Harry, why can't these losers shut their traps?"

 

I love that last example, it made me laugh.  :lol:

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"The man in front of him had a best friend who was talking incessantly," doesn't that work and sound conversational? I agree that "the best friend of" doesn't sound colloquial if you're going for that type of voice. Another option is choppy talk, you know: "the man in front of him, best friend's yappin' up a storm and I'm like, `if you'd shut up for a second, one second, you may find out that no, yer not the only one who hates sardines`, jeez. I don't get it Harry, why can't these losers shut their traps?"

 

As I said, it's more the structure that I'm looking for with him's or however.  It's something I do myself when I talk really fast, so it would only be for the purpose of voice.  I know that there are better ways to word it, but for the sake of voice, just wondering on grammatically correctness.

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As I said, it's more the structure that I'm looking for with him's or however.  It's something I do myself when I talk really fast, so it would only be for the purpose of voice.  I know that there are better ways to word it, but for the sake of voice, just wondering on grammatically correctness.

 

I'm pretty sure 'the man in front of him's' is not strictly grammatically correct. In other words, I'd use it in dialogue, but not in the narrative. IF the narrative is in 1st person, then maybe.

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