PrivateTim

I was disappointed that Frank and Isidore weren't in on the meeting as they are Zach's defacto guardians and Frank has proven to be solidly in Zach's corner. Will and Zach got the "I love you" faster than I thought. I can't help but wonder where the blindside to their happiness is going to come from.

Dude, I think you have Stockholm Syndrome. You are starting to identify with your captors (Matt's eyes). I love seeing Matt's POV again, but our own POV is always rosy on our actions and harsh on others. Matt feels excluded in Boston, but if we were seeing this from Wade's perspective he'd think Matt was being standoffish and distancing himself from the others. Just because I like seeing Matt's POV doesn't mean I have an iota of sympathy for him. He made is own bed, now he has to lie in it. He has already eaten his cake, so he can't have it anymore. He ran his flag up the flagpole and no one saluted because Elvis had already left the building..... Okay, no more cliches and mixed metaphors. Matt had the ability to lock down Wade for life and he blew it through selfish, small head thinking. At anytime Matt could have woken up to the fact that getting laid is vacuous and leads to nothingness. The senior in college trying to cram in those last lays and days of fun is not my experience, especially having been around Berkeley and Stanford seniors. Most of the guys I knew at these two schools were done with partying and skirt chasing at the end of their junior years. Being a senior was about focusing on the future and being burned out being around "little kids" who just wanted to party. When I was a freshman in my fraternity house I couldn't believe what fuddy duddy old men the seniors were and three short years later I was one. While I hold out hope for Matt maturing and fulfilling the potential we saw when Matt was a senior in high school, I am not going to forget that he forged these chains that now bind him (okay, sorry, one last cliche) or blame those whose patience wore thin.

I like that Wade seems to be not liking that now Matt is actually moving on. Like his mother, he has a control thing. It may not be as evil or as sinister as hers, but it is there. The undercurrent that they may have a future together in 3-5 years is there. Or not. But I think yes. Or not.

I like the story and I really like seeing Matt's POV again. I assume in a future story is that we will see Wade's POV again. But is it pretty obvious that I am going to have a problem throughout the entire story when there are parallels drawn between Sam & Jake and Will & Tony, because it is either bootstrapping or shoehorning the storyline to pretend that the "family" argument was brought up when Brad and Wade slept together the first time two or three stories ago. I get where Matt might have a problem with it because Wade got too into Brad because he was so much better in bed than Matt, but the rest of the family never had an adverse reaction. I am willing to accept that the storyline needs this tension..... I am just not done giving Mark shit about it yet

Dude..... look at that guy.....

The danger for Will & Zach is the unguarded moment. They can not be a couple for a moment any place in public; not London, not Paris, not anyplace. De La Salle is a very affluent school pulling from some of the East Bay's tonier areas. It may not be Sacred Heart, but still plenty affluent to the extent that it would not be out of the realm of possibilities that they could run into De La Salle kids in Europe and definitely Menlo School kids in Europe. If Zach keeps blowing off hot chicks who want to rock his world, that will send up more red flags than how much Will and he hang out.

I think people forget how very young Matt and Wade are. Yes they have been through a lot together, but this isn't the 1950's where you marry your college sweetheart. So many people, straight & gay don't get married until their late 20's, early 30's. Of all my first cousins, 25-35, only 2 of the 10 are married and only a couple are in serious relationships. As to Zach and Will, I find it interesting that Frank wasn't there, given that he is now Zach's de facto guardian and that he seems to be the one who can tell Wally the way things are and Wally is afraid to push back. Did I miss a chapter? I don't recall a Matt/Wade/Tiffany hook up?

Ben

Well not to be a pissant, but how is sleeping with Brent, now that he has been with Zach different from sleeping with Zach after he had been with Gathan?

The most interesting part of the whole chapter is Brent's "project". I've been driving myself nuts trying to figure out what it is and why Will will be interested in it. Maybe it is one of Robbie's old cars..... Anyway, an interesting tease that there might be work arounds for Will & Zach, except of course if they do stay together that just makes for more drama down the road when one of the chix sniffing around Zach figures it out or flat out catches them in flagrante delicto and that ruins Zach's future and he blows all over Will about it. It will make the phone call break-up look like high tide compared to a tsunami.

On my continuing line of confusion....... first Wally and Clara were simple bumpkins, now they are Machiavellian geniuses? (based on the reviews I read)

Bunch of pussies need to quit crying so much and sack up

And this.

No, that is how posers dress. Here is how surfers look in CA.

OMG even as a Spanish novella 9-11 is twice the story War and Peace is...... War and Peace bored me to tears. The more apt comparison is to The Pickwick Papers and David Copperfield, two great works of fiction, but not even Dickens could have kept up your pace of doing two serials at the same time. I appreciate the hard work of the team given the frenetic pace of your writing. Thanks to all of you

You do miss the point Westie. The first part is that Matt can be mad and unreasonable, but he can't rely on the "you're my stepfather" objection, because it has never been an objection in the past. I get the emotion that led to punching Brad and fucking Mary Ellen because he wants to hurt WADE, but he has no right to be mad at Brad later since the whole cascade of events that led to him and Wade being broken up rests squarely on him. He may not be self aware enough to see all that yet, but surely even the densest of dullards would have to understand that punching Brad was wrong on so many levels. Just being called to JP's study should have caused that nickel to drop. The second part is that people have to continue to separate out the reason why Brad and Wade sleeping together last time caused a problem. It was not because Brad was Matt's stepfather, it was because Brad rocked Wade's world with the sex and that destroyed Matt's ego. No one had any issue with the 'Brad is Robbie's partner' issue and nothing about 9-11 changed that. The other issue is Will. Will needs therapy in the worst way and his family should quit indulging him and enabling him. He has no concept of the real world (in as much as we treat CAP as a real world).

Okay I am sorry, but Will can just go fuck himself, the self righteous, hypocritical, spoiled ass, rich, Malibu Colony shithead. He has done nothing in life or accomplished anything. He is like every entitled smarmy 15 year old who thinks he is special because his family is rich. He has absolutely no right to expect people to stay out of his life while he thinks he can dictate theirs. Not that I have strong feelings about it.

You may be persistent, but also making no sense, Will was 13 or 14 the first time and he was completely calm. There was also much more of a threat the family back then since both Brad & Robbie were together and Matt & Wade were together.

Did you read the passage I quoted? Go back to Paternity and read those chapters? No one at that time, Matt and Will included, made any reference to Brad and Wade sleeping together as being inappropriate or a parallel to Jake and Sam (which is the parallel people cite when talking about Tony and Matt). Matt's problem with it came up later because Wade was getting into Brad beyond just a roll in the hay and Will never had a problem with it, unless someone can point to a textual reference in Paternity that I missed.

So I went back and looked in Paternity, here are two relevant passages, first Wade talking to Matt: “A blast. Even his ass is muscular,” Matt said with a leer, cracking me up. “So who did you end up with? My money was on Gathan.” “Nope, I hit the mother lode,” I said. He looked at me, waiting for me to spill my guts. “Brad fucked me.” He stared at me, amazed. “With that monster dick? Dude, you must be sore as hell.” I laughed. “Nope. Took it like a champ.” He was quiet for a minute, and that made me nervous. “What about Robbie?” “He doesn’t know, and Brad’s not going to tell him, or at least that’s his plan,” I said. “I told him that I wouldn’t say anything to anyone except you. I promised that you’d keep your mouth shut.” “So I’m supposed to look at Brad, you, and Robbie over Christmas and pretend that nothing happened?” he asked, being bitchy. “Yeah. I’m sorry. I guess I should have made you promise not to say anything before I told you, but I figured that I could trust you on this.” “You saying you don’t trust me?” I looked at him calmly. “No, I’m saying that I trust you completely, that’s why I didn’t hesitate to tell you, and that’s why I told Brad it would be alright to tell you.” “Oh,” he said, getting it. “What if this fucks up their relationship? You remember what that was like last year.” There was no freaking out, no "OMG you slept with my step father" and no one got punched in the nose. Here is the passage with Will after he caught Robbie in bed with Jeff when Stef, JP and Brad had first discovered the JJ pictures: “He was busy,” I said. I looked at my dad as I said that, and watched him digest that. Normally, I’m not a snitch. Normally, I wouldn’t have said shit about Jeff fucking Robbie. It’s not my place to get involved in what either one of them did. But I knew that my dad had fucked Wade, and I guessed that he was probably feeling guilty about that. I assumed that in this case, since he and Robbie had both blown it and slept with other guys, it was probably best if they knew it. And even if my dad didn’t tell Robbie, it would help him assuage his own guilt. Again, there was no recrimination from Will for his father sleeping with Wade. I think those two passages pretty well lay to rest the argument that there were any parallels between Tony/Matt and Brad/Wade. No one raised the "who is inherently off limits" argument in Paternity. And who really could when you have grandfathers and grandsons sharing lovers (Will and Stef with Gathan), fathers and sons (Robbie and Will with Jeff) and any number of odd, non traditional couplings. That is why the sudden "OMG" over Brad and Wade has me baffled.

I've known a lot of Tony's (guys who have issues with their sexuality) and I am bright enough to avoid relationships with them. I had no problem dating guys who needed discretion because I understood it, but they were guys who were not afraid of their sexuality, they accepted who they were, they were just not sure they could live openly either then or in the future but they weren't the self loathing "I hate you because you made me fuck you" Tony types. I would make the same points that I made in my review: Still confused, still not seeing the parallels in Wade/Brad and Matt/Tony. And for the record I find Brad/Wade creepy and I had no problem with Matt/Tony, but at least in Matt/Tony we had Will verbalizing he didn't want Matt to go there (which I found really hypocritical of Will "don't tell me who to sleep with" Schluter). In Brad/Wade, it isn't the first time, Matt already knew about it and I don't recall Matt ever telling/asking Wade to not sleep with Brad. I remember him not liking it, but I don't call limitations being placed. All that said, it is a fun chapter and will be even more fun when Wade becomes one of the fathers of his nephew, gotta love Crónicas De Un Depredador Académico **** So am I wrong? Was there a time when Matt placed Brad off limits? I don't recall huge issues when Wade and Brad slept together the first times, why is it a big deal now?

Still confused, still not seeing the parallels in Wade/Brad and Matt/Tony. And for the record I find Brad/Wade creepy and I had no problem with Matt/Tony, but at least in Matt/Tony we had Will verbalizing he didn't want Matt to go there (which I found really hypocritical of Will "don't tell me who to sleep with" Schluter). In Brad/Wade, it isn't the first time, Matt already knew about it and I don't recall Matt ever telling/asking Wade to not sleep with Brad. I remember him not liking it, but I don't call limitations being placed. All that said, it is a fun chapter and will be even more fun when Wade becomes one of the fathers of his nephew, gotta love Crónicas De Un Depredador Académico

No. I don't remember a single thing about Growing Pains, Facts of Life or Family Ties......

I dunno, this author is pretty detail oriented, you might even say anal , and the scene didn't seem that long. We'd also have to believe that Will is noted for his patience. But be that as it may, I still don't think that gives him a right to enter his father's bedroom except in the most dire of emergencies (the house is on fire). Going to to tell JP he couldn't get an answer from Brad was exactly what he should have done, but again I am willing to accept that as plot device to drive a storyline. The point I did want to make and emphasize is the complete hypocrisy of Will. If his father entered his locked room the same way on the same explanation, Will would go ballistic. Will also continues to think it is okay for him to tell others who they may and may not sleep with, but no one is entitled to even hint at anything about his choices or they risk his wrath. And I am still not seeing ANY parallels with Jake and Sam. I mean, if you want to really put a fine point on it, when we first met Jake he was on a date with Claire, so shouldn't that have made Jake off limits to Brad? Even though Claire knew it when she invited Jake over, Brad didn't. And while Brad was schmoozing up Jake he was getting his prostate banged by Lark too. So Brad was the same hypocrite that Will is now. There are no paragons of virtue in this story. Everyone has had their sordid little moments which is why the moral relativism falls flat with me and why when they try to come up with some moral code, it doesn't seem to last past inconvenience.

I will repost my review and revise and extend my remarks: I am one very confused person. Here is why people rag on Will and what makes Will an arrogant little prick. No one can tell Will anything. No one can make judgments about Will's love life. No one can invade Will's privacy. But apparently it is okay for Will to define for everyone else who they can and can not have sex with, it is okay for Will to invade and betray people's privacy and it is okay for Will to bully people to do what he wants. The fact that Will thinks it is the right thing to do (send Brad to his shrink) makes it even worse. it is the exact thing he blew up and ran away over, others deciding what was good for him. It is a cute dramatic device to have him knock on the door, not get an answer and go for the skeleton key, but in reality could Brad and Wade have been so clueless as to not hear someone pounding on the door? And if Will wasn't pounding, what makes him think he has the right to enter someone's room before making the effort to do other things, like call on the phone or cell phone? Mark points out that they would have likely ignored the phone, but maybe not, a phone call first on the house phone and then on his cell might have broken the mood and convinced Brad that someone inside the house need him on something urgent. I think Will went too quickly from "no answer" to "I am breaking into your room". I am further confused why Brad and Wade having sex is a big deal? Weren't Brad and Wade having sex when Matt and Wade were a couple? Hey I thought it was creepy having sex with your partner's son's partner, open relationship or not, but Wade and Matt didn't have a lot of parameters and Matt certainly had no room to complain about the two or three guys Wade chose vs the dozen(s) he did. Was there ever a point when Matt made Brad off limits to Wade? If not, why is it a big deal now that they are broken up? I mean, he may have been hurt because Wade was into Brad for more than just a fuck, but that was part of Matt's problem in not wanting to be exclusive. I actually see it very differently from Sam & Jake. Someone in their review didn't see a big deal with Will talking to Ben. Remember how Will got up in Stef's face over telling Brad about the sex room? That was no great secret either, but Will flew off the handle at people about it. Will had zero right in talking to Ben about his father especially given his attitude about people getting in his business. Will needs to learn boundaries and as of right now he has no clue. Lastly, and for the record, Will is not an adult. He is an emancipated minor which is not the same as being a legal adult. He gets certain rights and privileges, but having sex is not one of them. In the State of California it is illegal for two minors to have sex with each other. I can not say that there are a lot of prosecutions for it, but there have been ones.