LeeSA

Hmm ok well think of it like this... I knew a kid in high school, I assumed he was gay as did everyone else, I was 13 at the time, I just went along teasing him calling him horrible names and so on for two years while still calling him my friend. Not my proudest moment. I admit I treated him horribly and to make it worse he was my friend in a trio of friends. We had a terrible argument as kids do when we were 15 because he liked my other mate, while I had a crush on him on, but wouldnt admit it. I can list the things I felt at that time as an adult, but as a kid I put a wall around them, boxed that shit up so tight you would need a jack hammer to find it. Fast forward 20 years and I bump into said friend. First contact was ok, polite no veiled comments. We caught up again and old hurts filtered through in our conversation while still being polite. The next time we caught up I knew what I had to do. I came out to him, I lived out by then but he didnt know that. I Apologised for every word I used toward him, for every moment I made him feel shame. I also had to admit I was jealous and scared of being gay and loving, as passionately as kids do. So you absolutely can have have half truth conversations with people. When you create hurt you have two choices you can man up or you can run away. One of the hardest moments of my life was to admit that I was an ass and a bully. I chose not to run again, but fuck me I didnt couldnt consider the possible outcomes of my actions, though it was something i had NEVER forgotten, him or my behaviour. The boxes dont open in one big rush of information it is in bits and pieces so it staggers the memories making it easier for the human brain to cope with the chemical onslaught it creates. Alex Brad and Lyn all know their truth they are just yet to open the whole box. They have been pretending, yes but it cant go on forever if they want to stay in contact. We are witnessing the slow leaking of feelings betwèen them all.

Suppose that is better than my fire idea ... but still a wothy consideration

A child for Alex and potential half siblings for the man he is in love with 😮, I sincerely hope not, I would be gutted. Call me hopeless for the HEA. Lyn is a control freak in survival mode, but plank of wood works sometimes too.

Of course the above was supposed to mention @peter rietbergen that the impossibly beautiful men and suits, money and charm are just there to remind us to look deeper. Just not at H or V...

If you met a Veronica or Harry in person you would lock them in a room and walk away never to return. Initially I did think about setting the room on fire too but that seemed extreme. Vile. But I am still reading and still hopeful. I think its cause River has a backbone. Gotta love that.

Is it Tuesday yet? .... or rather Wednesday for me.... so close yet so far. Withdrawls oh yes.

Good point it is avoidance, then maybe he was aware prior to turning up at Lyns unannounced? Processed a little before turning up. See thats what I mean by the shift between them all, Brad trying to keep up the old dynamic. We know the memory chapters led up to the argument and you have spoken about mirrors a lot made me wonder what of the past will be reflected into the future and will that "argument" have to happen again, but with a different outcome.... if thats the case I wonder if we will actually read that in the memory chapters or not. Guess @Laura S. Fox only knows.

Well said @Cane23 i guess i saw some stuff a little differently though. Lyn and his room and yes it kept in a way that is different from the chaos that surrounds him. Personally I believe that what you think you create, the external is a representation of what Lyn thinks is required to "fast forward" through the BS. Ordered, structured, calm, uncluttered. If people see nothing they ask nothing so he doesnt face anything and the BS is avoided all together. That and I feel it is also a bit of a visual show to his mother that while he plays her game he does so to get through the crap, that he is nothing like her. On a Subconcious level. Exactly how long has Brad known where Lyn has lived and he chooses now to turn up? He also shows no reaction to Lyns home. It was a nice change of pace to see him unconcerned about the house of his supposedly well off friend, that being said he had no reaction at all. Only to the room which made me suspicious. Overall this chapter may have slightly improved my thoughs on Brad, maybe. @Cane23 you said that Brad and Alex have family pressure thats active loud and so on, I dont disagree with that. I think though, that because Lyns mother is not pushing in a similar manner that the other two encounter, I dont think that its much different. She wants others to see that everything appears to be perfect, yes? .. what does she then actually think her life looks like if she needs the delusion to begin with? If she wants Lyn to appear perfect then what does she actually think of Lyn and how do you think that would make Lyn feel. For her none of it is good enough. So.... then Lyn has to live in a world where he is consistently shown he is not good enough just as he is, you need to fake it up, glamour money and society are whats important, not Lyn. Also happen to think she is far to selfish in her own fantasy world to expect anything too deep from Lyn. It does feel like there is a shift between the 3 of them..closer in some ways and further apart in other ways. What ever drives them apart feels like it started forming in this and the previous memory chapter. Maybe Brad is seeing something very different when it comes to Alex and Lyn. He laughed off Lyns question about Alex giving him the address pretending to be hurt, maybe he was maybe not but Lyn is giving off subtle clues I think. Then at the very end Brad asked Lyn about Alex....that felt very intentional.

See now I am waiting, verbal pitch fork ready with Brads name on it. Maybe two others that come to mind.... Lyn probably just deserves a little plastic fork though just cause he is oblivious for the most part.

I agree, though I think that the "social test" will be harder for Lyn and yes Alexander understands this. Lyn has had a lifetime of living the performance so to speak, thanks to his mother, and not addressing the fear he holds onto or the reasons why it exists in the first place. Private steps are much easier. And herein lays the problem. Lyn has lived his life a particular waycand knowlingly hidden it from people he cares for. I think the struggle will really begin now as he not only has to face Brad and speak his truth but he has to face himself. Its not just about his sexuality its a whole lot deeper than that. If he wants a relationship with Alex he has a lot of work to do. In the grand scheme of things 5 days is not a lot of time to do that. There is beauty in the mundane for that is where commitment lives.

Perfectly imperfect even

"You are punishing me, " Alexander said promptly "You're just not aware of it " Aside from the belt play I think maybe @Laura S. Fox was alluding to the waiting and wanting of Lyn that Alex has done over many years as the punishment. Least thats how I read that part. Perhaps the belt was less literal punishment more performative? Lyn went in wanting the upper hand and what he got instead was another representation that he belongs to Alex now. Whats more he liked it. He just might want someone to be strong enough to take the lead. At least sometimes.

Now that I am not ahh... quite so angry... I get what your saying, I do. I also see the bigger picture I suppose. I think the tenderness that you see is borne out of fragility and not care or love. Lyn goes along with the "game" for different reasons than Blanche. It is those reasons that make their relationship toxic. Blanche had a guiding role as a mum and royally buggered it up. Young Lyn cant possibly know how all of that makes him who he is. Your right he is scared. Deep down how can he not be the only parent he had interactions with manipulated him horribly and continued to do so. Back then anyway. Lyn has been conditioned not to challenge his mother. Lyn giving her loyalty and support keeps the peace and she uses that.

Ill admit I went for a run after I wrote that. I was angry and a little triggered i suppose. It is an all to realistic behaviour for some. Sad so sad.

Woefully sad chapter. A mother who sees so much.. reads people to elevate her financial status or try to...has some very interesting narcisistic traits. Its the only way I can fathom how she is treating her son. And a son who shares part of that delusion because it is easier than the alternative. For that whole scenario to be played out for Alexander.... Lyn's walls his inability to be open and honest with anyone... Waiting for his next moment of being discovered and humiliated is not normal. How else can he deal with the situation but get defensive and angry with Alex to bring it to conclusion. The last bit where Lyn and his mum are walking to the car.... upset me. If a parent thinks that it is ok to expose their child like that to the cruelty of others and expect equal game play for fucking money. Wow just wow. Now I want to smack his mum upside the head. Maybe court appointed therapy. Something. 🤬

I am not sure what part is endearing? A tragic display in delusion yes. Part of the delusion is because its not about survival. She feels that she deserves to live in that manner, that these men are the answer to that. If it was about making enough money to "survive" the woman would have got herself an actual job... but no... she believes that that is what she deserves and wants other people to see that she is still part of a society that she is, so clearly not. Whats worse is that she has to take advantage of Lyns loyalty to ensure that she is not alone in her quest/delusion. It is manipulative. I wonder what the scene would have looked like if Lyn did not play along and challenged her. Instant anger I imagine. When that instant angry reaction comes, thinking of the belt she gave lyn as a gift, that screams personality disorder. Well to me anyway. It is no way to grow up and it is certainly not parenting.

The term "emotional support human" should not have cracked me up but it did 😂. I blame my double shift as in retrospect that is exactly what Lyn was. All three of them have flaws which make them unique and frustrating at times to read. I have wanted in equal measure to smack them all up side the head. If Lyn doesnt start being honest soon....he cant continue to expect anyone else to do things differently if he continues to hide parts of himself.

Thats what I love about differnt people everyone sees things differently.

Maybe, maybe we will see. 😂

Personally, I am not sure he evolved as much as though that the only way forward in his new realisation was to die. To be so rigid and choosing death as the outcome as @akascrubber its sad.

I took a punt on the belt reference, yes and eagerly await the outcome, so to speak. One can also assume that Brad would have little idea who Bernado Gui is. Which your right, is a little mean. I am also aware of the some of the debate surrounding "Gui". Your use of rigid and morally absolute made me think of who Lyns actual father is? Though I dont think that was the intention. Without descending into a debate of Medieval Religious anxieties, I struggle to see anything positive about the nick name. But perhaps that is my own limited understanding of "Gui's" guidebook. Perhaps it is just a refernce to Lyns ability to not be dissuaded from his path and belief in the timeline and what he needs to achieve before he lets himself be free... or as free as he was in the 8 missing years.

It is sad, but a very Brad thing. He needs to learn that his actions have consequences as they all do. He can either continue to be selfish or he can grow up. If he looks hard enough he will see that the pain and hurt will guide him. Though that will prove true for the three of them.

While I think Lyn put to rest his adolecent crush once and for all there were signs that that was coming to pass anyway, the hike just completed that for Lyn. Lyn, however, purposefully ignored the oportunities set out for him to be honest and open.... again. But I should not be surprised really. I think the epiphany was more for Brad than Lyn. He is about to get married and he is finding he cant coast through shit like he always could. He also just realised that he has lost the adoration that was given him so freely once upon a time. It was easy to maintain his ego when he had Lyn in the background, he knew that when everything turned to shit Lyn would still be there. As an adult he potentially faces responsibilities that you cant pass off to friends. Bella has expectaions I guess and Brad wonders if he is good enough. Maybe he is, maybe not. His choice to make and he has to do that on his own I suppose. Bernardo Gui @Laura S. Fox I am hopeful that Alexander's comparison was to the historian/inquisitor and not the book .... the comparison is interesting though. One can only ask so many questions when you base your truth on a lie. That being said Lyn will obviously address this with Alex, but, is he going to like the answer?

Ohh and I forgot to say that I dont think that Lyn is perfect....he is as full of shit as the other two....Just in a different way than Brad. Lyn is also easy to relate to being a goal orientated control freak. 😁

Why thank you @Seraph28 I will take all the leeway I can get. I can be a little... hmm fixed in my opinions at times 😂