Mark Arbour

This is true, but I think that for right now, he's probably alright in Europe. He's not at sports celebrity status yet, and the odds of running into someone they know in Europe are small. But your point, that it could happen, makes it scary for them. I wonder, though, in the world of football of 2002, what would happen if the players generally suspected Zach was gay, but no one knew for sure, and it was kept pretty quiet. Like with Troy Aikman. I've read some interview about players referring to teammates who were gay and pretty much everyone acted like it wasn't happening and ignored it.

I live vicariously through my characters. Why would I want to fuck someone normal in my fantasy world, when I can do that in real life?

Zach probably needs to know, but Will probably won't tell him. Guess who does.

I'm sure that Wally and Clara really do want what's best for Zach, but they don't understand their own limitations. Zach does, and he's determined to succeed and to keep them from interfering in his life. They probably see him as a loose cannon destined to self-destruct.

June 19, 2002 Boston, MA Matt “Are you going to Claremont for the 4th of July?” I asked JJ. “I told Stef that I would go if John and Marie went,” he said with a smirk. “So I’m betting I won’t be there.” “Are you going?” Wade asked me. I shrugged. “I’m thinking about it.” It had been a shithole of a town, but it was supposed to be a lot cooler now. “If I’m traveling with Zach and Will, I’ll probably end up there.” It also reminded me of Robbie; it was p

Jeremy, I meant to comment on these. Really nice picks. The Chevelle song is just agonizing; so perfect for Will's mood. I hadn't heard that Gilbert O'Sullivan song in forever. My mother loved that song. Not a big Avril Lavigne fan, but the song works great. But of all the songs, my favorite, was the Enrique Iglesias one. "Red" sets the tone for the hell Will is going through, and "Escape" brings us back to the love these two share. Well done!

I'll have to try that for one of the anthologies. A frog-fucking story.

I figure when I hit 80 and the ED kicks in, that's a good time to turn into a bottom.

Cool! There's hope!

I think you have to decide if a family bond is created by adoption and/or marriage. If the answer is yes, then I think there are reasonable grounds to classify it as a form of incest. Just my opinion.

Welcome! I get your cherry post! :2thumbs: You raise an interesting issue...not about Wade and his hookup with Brad...but with your acknowledged predisposition to hate cheaters. Often times in this forum the discussions become heated when our basic attitudes are challenged. Or when Private Tim is being a pissant. That being said, at least Wade wasn't cheating in this situation. Hopefully that gives him some redemption in your eyes.

Zach hasn't admitted anything to his family, but Gathan knows, and Brent has probably figured it out. I don't think Wally and Clara know the status of their relationship, which is a stunning tribute to their naivete. I don't see Brent doing that, trying to hook up with Will, for two reasons. The first is that he's been portrayed as someone who's straight, so unless he takes an occasional walk on the gay side, that's not happening. More importantly, from what we've seen of him, he doesn't seem like a shit disturber. He seems to be a go with the flow, play by the rules, don't rock the boat kind of guy. I think the fact that he came over and picked Zach up shows that he at least has Zach's back some of the time.

You're right about that...it was George's first action. It seems to just come naturally to him, no? I think the no-nonsense characterization I've painted of St. Vincent actually works quite well with how he was in real life. I'm glad that came through. If you think about it, George has been too busy, with his new ship and his passenger, to really strike up a liaison with anyone. Bet that changes.;-)

Amazing how once one hits 40, just about anything can provide a good excuse for a nap. ;-) Glad you liked the chapter!

But you do pissant so well. The difference is in the relationships. Gathan and Will were friends, and while they had sex, they were never in a romantic relationship. Zach and Will clearly are. And then there's the basic human element of it. It didn't hurt Gathan that Will slept with Zach. It would devastate Zach if Will slept with Brent.

I could honestly see JJ doing the love triangle, but not Will. Part of what this whole thing with Matt and Tony (and Brad and Wade) has been about was him trying to set up some basic moral guidelines in this family where it's pretty much a free-for-all. Now that he's been through this crucible, he won't screw up like that. Probably. JJ hasn't had that kind of epiphany because he's been more on the periphery of this drama, so I could see him doing it. I don't think Zach even thought about it like that. I think he thought about this concept of Will he could get rid of, but then when he was away from the assault team (Wally/Clara/Barry) and actually talked to Will, I would suspect that's when he got clarity. And he had to hear how upset Will was on the phone, and when Will didn't answer, he probably realized how badly he'd hurt Will. That evidently was enough to get him to run 5 or more miles in the humid Ohio heat.

I'd lean toward 'never'. Will's not going to do that to Zach, even if he's pissed off at him. He got too upset when Matt hooked up with Tony to do something like that to Zach.

Thank you Miles, but you know you have but to wait a few more days and the next injection of literary heroin will be on the way. ;-)

Me too. Having someone with a logical mind, that is also impartial (more or less), can be invaluable.

Like I said earlier, I think that Wally and Clara probably see things in simple terms. Before Zach met Will, he was a good, obedient son. After he met Will, he's this obnoxious and rebellious kid (like Will). They wouldn't have factored in that Zach has always had those traits buried inside, and that their emergence probably has little to do with Will, and all to do with Zach reaching that point where he needs to make decisions on his own.

As I mentioned, I think JP is less worried about "wrong" than about healing. In any event, I thought his arrival was really neat. It sent a huge message to Will, making him feel loved by this man he really respects.

I think the call to Cody got Barry's attention more than Zach's. ;-)

Grieving like this, especially for intensely emotional people, is not likely to be short or easy. In this case, all of them have constant reminders of the attacks. In 2002, the news feed on 9-11 was relentless. It's hard to get over something when it's constantly being shoved in your face.

I liked that line about Afghanistan. ;-) I think that Wally and Clara caved on the deal with Matt because Frank intervened and told them it was important. Matt would have lost it if they'd have said no to him, but yes to Gathan. I visualized the meeting with Zach, Wally and Clara, and Barry as one where they sat on all sides of him and browbeat him until he agreed to their demands. As soon as he was out of that pressure cooker, he was able to see things more clearly. Keep in mind, too, that he knows Will really well, and having Will not respond to his calls must have scared him shitless.

You're such a pessimist! You can't see how Will and Zach can live happily together in closeted bliss? Muhahahaha. It will be a bit before you see "Brent's project", but consider his profession, and that's a pretty strong hint.