Question: Aspergers and CT shooting

[hh5]

you're explaining things very well ... perhaps its like being an alien or an android that can not understand the complex human emotions ... but for humans its a disability or disorder.

 

Yes, this dialog is leading me to understand aspergers is unlikely to be the reason.

 

Again I am not really pushing that as the main reason ...

I am just questioning the possibilities

 

 

I bet the experts are baffled by all this. The evidence is slowly explaining who this person is.

It be great to hear someone else explanation on who this person is after they read the many articles.

 

Is it possible for someone to have a combination other disorder or disability 

... like a fruit punch mix ?

 

as you mention ASD or not ... it seemed that pre-meditated violence could be possible

 

 

he did make a step out of many in that direction according to an article 

the reality is that no one would ever know he has aspergers unless its indicated on his drivers licence.

 

I don't know of how many parents who would have their children with disability take up a dangerous hobby.

That doesn't make sense ... even if the person can partially understand the respect for a given hobby,

I coming from the understanding we only get people with disabilities or disorders involved in the lease dangerous hobbies.

 

hh5, the confusion lies in that we often use the word "empathy" to both represent sensing the emotions of others, and also sharing the emotions of others. NotNoNever split these into Empathy (sensing) and Sympathy (sharing). People with an ASD tend to have a deficiency in the former, but are generally 'average' with the latter.

Also, a deficiency doesn't necessarily mean that they can't sense other's emotions - they can, instead, have trouble identifying the correct emotion. eg. They may misinterpret grief for anger, because there's an overlap in how people express those two emotions, and they don't pick up enough of the non-visual clues to isolate one from the other.

I'm not explaining things well, but hopefully it's enough to make it clear that if you're talking pre-meditated violence, Asperger's is highly unlikely to be the reason.

[hh5]

it appears its possible 

 

 

Mixed State Bipolar Aspergers

An individual experiencing mixed state bipolar Aspergers is faced with some complexities that can be difficult to overcome. Identifying the comorbid condition is a crucial aspect of the problem.

http://autism.lovetoknow.com/Mixed_State_Bipolar_Aspergers

 

 

here is an article trying to diagnose the Lanza ... it does support the theory to having multiple disorders

thus this is the lesson of questioning the news and the facts ... thus leading to other ideas from our discussion

its not an attack on aspergers nor about weapons ... perhaps its the perfect storm that lead to one of many massacres

Lanza scored the #2 position - 29 ... compared to the 32 in Virginia tech in 2007

In the aftermath of the Sandy Hook massacre, reports have surfaced that shooter Adam Lanza suffered from some sort of mental disability or disorder, the exact nature of which is thus far a matter of dispute. Neighbors have described Lanza as odd, remote, and reclusive ; schoolmates recall him as a brainiac, with a flat affect; and a longtime family friend reveals that Adam lacked the ability to feel pain. His brother, Ryan Lanza, told ABC news that Adam "is autistic, or has Asperger syndrome and a 'personality disorder.'" Police authorities, meanwhile, have alluded to the shooter's "checkered past," calling him a "troubled youth."

 

Asperger's: Asperger's is considered a type of autism (though there will be a change in nomenclature in 2013). In this disorder, individuals have difficulty with social interaction and demonstrate repetitive and restrictive behaviors, but have no difficulty with communication. People with Asperger's may lack interest in sharing experiences with others, or developing relationships.

 

Personality Disorder: This refers to a category of psychiatric diagnoses, each related to a lifelong pattern of maladaptive behaviors. In the words of the DSM-IV, psychiatry's diagnostic manual, "a personality disorder is an enduring pattern of inner experience and behavior that deviates markedly from the expectations of the individual's culture." Some of the personality disorders that may be examined in Adam's case include:

 

- Antisocial Personality Disorder: The DSM-IV's closest analog to psychopathy. People with ASPD tend to be aggressive, remorseless, and deceitful, and lack empathy. Violence - premeditated and otherwise - is strongly associated with this category.

 

- Schizoid Personality Disorder: These individuals avoid social intimacy, have little interest in relationships, and have limited emotional range - often manifest as blunted affect. It is not the same as schizophrenia, although there is a familial association between the two. There is also a familial association between schizophrenia and insensitivity to pain.

 

- Avoidant Personality Disorder: These individuals are socially inhibited, feel inadequate, avoid social interaction, and are hypersensitive to criticism.

 

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2012/12/diagnosing-adam-lanza/266322/

 

The combination of a flat affect, analgesia, social avoidance, autism-like features, and premeditated violence defies obvious categorization. Like so many out there with unknowable illnesses, Lanza may have had a case of the NOS, or "not otherwise specified," psychiatric shorthand for an undiagnosable illness. Undiagnosable, however, is not tantamount to untreatable -- which, ultimately, is why any of this diagnostic speculation even matters. The hope is that Lanza's doctors and treatment records can help shed light on what might have gone wrong, and what we can do to prevent future massacres.

[hh5]

What the diff between mild and regular and full blown? but this article isn't comprehensive about him

Link between autism and planned violence discounted by experts

Unconfirmed news reports after the Connecticut school shooting that gunman Adam Lanza had been diagnosed with a milder form of autism prompted strongly-worded statements from autism advocacy groups that the developmental disorder was not associated with “planned violence.”

Edited December 18, 2012 by hh5

[NotNoNever]

Just heard on the news that the little British boy who was shot was found cradled in the arms of his learning support worker who was also killed. He had autism. Without pre-empting anything, given that he was in mainstream and said to be very proud of learning to read, it would seem to me that this was probably a mildly autistic little boy. Or, in other words, a little boy with Aspergers.

[Celethiel]

My best friend has Aspergers....

He's a good guy, and quite brilliant.

 

The aspergers causes him not to understand many times interpersonal relationships...

including how close is too close, or doing inappropriate things in public places... (no not shooting rampages)

 

He has the same feelings and thoughts of everyone else here or anywhere

The same worries... well for the most part, because he has no job and can't ever get one...

 

he's afraid of the dark....

He loves video games of the adventure type, Sonic, Sly Cooper, heck even Skyrim,

He likes Anime and dislikes how American companies when they localize it take to editing the content...

 

 

He was tormented by kids in school beleaved to be the village ideot.

 

Aspergers is not the enemy...

Fearing a whole group of people because of a single individual is....

 

perhaps you should look at everything around the person and the idividual and see what could cause that boy to snap...

maybe he suffered from Depression as well...

maybe he had other mental problems...

or maybe he wanted to commit suicide and go out with a bang...(which by the end he did.)

[hh5]

More evidence - He cover up his tracks by destroying evidence on his hard drive on one of his computers

This is a second clue of premeditation ... investigators found odd ...

I wonder how many more clues to make them believe a new theory or the typical theory.

 

But he could have had a tantrum and it could be a coincidence.

Adam Lanza damaged his hard drive before Sandy Hook massacre

 

Police say that before he went on the deadly rampage at Sandy Hook School, Adam Lanza, in what is now being alleged evidence of premeditation in his crime, damaged his computer hard drive, making it difficult for investigators to extract information.

The New York Post reports that police investigators say that before he set off to the elementary school, Adam Lanza smashed the hard drive of at least one of his computers, possibly using a hammer or a screwdriver in an effort to destroy potentially valuable evidence.

The Daily Mail reports police sources say he may also have overwritten the hard drive to hide information. According to a source, the state of the computer on which he played video games was "pretty bad." The police source speculated: "If he destroyed the computer, that means there are things on there that would concern him."

 

Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/339325#ixzz2FRN2nQ4S

 

Lanza was not on Meds according to investigators

The schools recognize that Lanza is diagnosed with a disorder

is it easy to defraud the schools n gov't?

Could it be that the parents didn't want him to be diagnosed with a more violent disorder?

 

There is not enough history to know when he was diagnosed with something?

Police find no evidence Connecticut gunman was on medication

 

Authorities armed with search warrants are still working to obtain the 20-year-old man's medical records, according to the report. Lanza's parents told friends and divorce mediators that their son had Asperger's syndrome, a form of high-functioning autism, but it was unclear if he had ever been formally diagnosed.

Detectives were scouring cellphone records, text messages, computer records and social network pages, hoping to find clues as to what made Lanza snap.

"They are looking at everything," former FBI agent Robert Paquette told the newspaper group. "They are poring over anything and everything. Was he on meds? Did he go off meds? How was his relationship with his mother? What video games did he play? How often did he play? Where did he learn to shoot? How often did he shoot? ... Forensics are going to tell us who died where and when. What they want to determine is why."

Dr. H. Wayne Carver, the chief state medical examiner, said Tuesday that his office is consulting with a geneticist at the University of Connecticut to find out "if there is any identifiable disease associated with this behavior," the Hartford Courant reported.

Carver told reporters he does not know whether Lanza had Asperger's, but he said the syndrome "is simply not on the menu, in terms of what is wrong with this kid." 

 

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/18/police-find-no-evidence-connecticut-gunman-was-on-medication/#ixzz2FRXoHqco

 

Edited December 18, 2012 by hh5

[Graeme]

*sigh* I don't think there is any doubt that it was premeditated, so I'm not sure what the destroyed hard disk is supposed to be evidence for.

 

The earlier article you posted mentioned "Mixed State Bipolar Aspergers". This appears to be short hand for saying that he had bipolar as well as Aspergers (I'm not sure what the "Mixed State" means). As such, why is there any attempt to point the finger at Aspergers in preference to the Bipolar?

 

As has been explained, Aspergers does not lead itself to pre-meditated violence. Spontaneous violence, yes, as that's true for most people on the autism spectrum, but there is no reason to say that Asperger's leads to pre-meditated violence. Having said that, as people with Aspergers tend to be average to above average in intelligence, and also tend to have a very methodical mindset, if someone with Aspergers decided to conduct pre-meditated violence, you can be fairly confident that they would do it in a methodical way.

 

It makes no more sense to blame Aspergers for his actions as it would be to blame being left-handed as the reason why someone who was left-handed hurt someone with a weapon in thelr left hand. The handedness plays no part in the decision to hurt someone - it only comes into play after the decision has been made. Similarly, Aspergers plays no part in the decision to commit mass murder - it only comes into play after the decision to commit mass murder has been made.

[NotNoNever]

HH5, it's starting to get a bit offensive now. It looks more like you're looking for a way to demonise him, rather than understand. This constant postulation of questions with random 'evidence' isn't going to get you very far. Aspergers is a complicated thing. Furthermore, it is like any other human characteristic set - unique in its warp and weft to each person. As I have been saying all along, as has Graeme, there was far more likely to have been some desparate contributory factor. There is a concept of co-morbidity which is a bit like 'mixed state'. He is also said to have had a personality disorder. Aspergers is not a personality disorder, and I'm not sure how much credence to give that either, but a co-morbid personality disorder, or bi-polar depression is likely to have been at play. It is still inlikely, as Graeme has said, that the Aspergers was the trigger, cause, or primary factor. There is the possibility that certain rigidity of thinking helped him on the way once he had started. But it's also true that once a suicide has made up their mind to do it, they become very settled and rational about it.

 

One other thing that is interesting is that there are reports that his mother was stashing the guns and stuff for the end of the world on Friday. My husband works in the media and told me that, but I have no real knowledge. However, as an illustration, I am going to speculate a bit here: it woud not surprise me if he actually got caught up in the irrationality of this and decided to kil his mother and as many other people as possible along with himself to save them the ordeal. Autists, as I said before, are quite concerned about the happiness or contentment of others and are often over generous. Put that particular trait possibility together with a lack of proper control of a co-morbid condition affecting rationality, and you have all the ingredients for last week.

 

I suspect, and I have difficulty with this myself, that Adam Lanza is as much to be pitied in this as the victims. That might not be popular, but it might be true. Speaking for myself, I would rather he had done this for no reason, than some crazy Waco style belief in changing the world. In fact, was there not an end of the world element in that too?

 

It's all just very sad for the families left behind. The devastation this causes is immense.

[TetRefine]

Edit.

Edited December 19, 2012 by TetRefine

[Gene Splicer PHD]

Well when I got diagnosed, it became my responsibility to manage myself. That's why I tell close friends. I can't control my emotional state very well sometimes, but I can sure try to manage my reactions and do what I can to not be in situations where things could escalate. That's the core of my "take five" behavior. I'm really glad I have the ability to do that.

[hh5]

the thing is u have agreement of premediated but you're stuck on aspergers ... what if he had a severe personality disorder

 

The mix bipolar has nothing to do with Lanza ... just proof that a person can have more than one disorder

The other article Diagnosing Lanza is more pertinent ...

the police are trying to get a hold on the medical records ... they found that Lanza wasn't on any meds

they state that they don't think Lanza was diagnosed properly ... or some thing like that ... they need more proof for their investigation

 

*sigh* I don't think there is any doubt that it was premeditated, so I'm not sure what the destroyed hard disk is supposed to be evidence for.

 

The earlier article you posted mentioned "Mixed State Bipolar Aspergers". This appears to be short hand for saying that he had bipolar as well as Aspergers (I'm not sure what the "Mixed State" means). As such, why is there any attempt to point the finger at Aspergers in preference to the Bipolar?

 

As has been explained, Aspergers does not lead itself to pre-meditated violence. Spontaneous violence, yes, as that's true for most people on the autism spectrum, but there is no reason to say that Asperger's leads to pre-meditated violence. Having said that, as people with Aspergers tend to be average to above average in intelligence, and also tend to have a very methodical mindset, if someone with Aspergers decided to conduct pre-meditated violence, you can be fairly confident that they would do it in a methodical way.

 

It makes no more sense to blame Aspergers for his actions as it would be to blame being left-handed as the reason why someone who was left-handed hurt someone with a weapon in thelr left hand. The handedness plays no part in the decision to hurt someone - it only comes into play after the decision has been made. Similarly, Aspergers plays no part in the decision to commit mass murder - it only comes into play after the decision to commit mass murder has been made.

Edited December 19, 2012 by hh5

[hh5]

first off ... I never said aspergers was a personality disorder ...

two ... u not read the article .. its saying that he could have a personality disorder in addition to aspergers ...

there is suspicion that he has a mild case of aspergers and he wasn't on meds 

 

Your theory for doomsday ... spot on ... very impressed ... 

 

demonise ... nope ... I don't care if he is the devil or god ... or trying to be a savior of doomsday

I have no romance to this notion

 

the big hole to theories ... he didn't leave a note explaining how he felt ... it bears more investigation if he told anyone that is his confidence

but he's a loner ... mysteries take time to unravel ... well in 48hrs ... doomsday comes ... or another period of man's evolution for another 56,000 yrs

 

it would be interesting if there was evidence of him reading up on 2012 mythology ... 

 

I like your theory very much ... I could imagine other ppl n cultures doing crazy things in the next 72 hrs

 

update

found that article calling the mother a doomsday prepper ... I have seen documentaries on this ... and I rather say that during the next 48 to 72 hrs ... those preppers are on heighten security ... I would not advise going near them ... they are prepared to protect their place ... they are looking for signs that doomsday has indeed taken place

 

based on that other article about losing her son ... perhaps her doomsday hobby ... really affected her son ... perhaps she is the trigger ... she caused him to seek out his own solution to doomsday ... 

 

I think you've hit upon the perfect storm scenerio ... he used the information he had available to formulated his own solution

 

that same article mentioned that Lanza was loner and played violent video games ... its not playing ... perhaps he sees it differently ... like if it was his training for when doomsday comes ... and then he acted upon his own plans

 

HH5, it's starting to get a bit offensive now. It looks more like you're looking for a way to demonise him, rather than understand. This constant postulation of questions with random 'evidence' isn't going to get you very far. Aspergers is a complicated thing. Furthermore, it is like any other human characteristic set - unique in its warp and weft to each person. As I have been saying all along, as has Graeme, there was far more likely to have been some desparate contributory factor. There is a concept of co-morbidity which is a bit like 'mixed state'. He is also said to have had a personality disorder. Aspergers is not a personality disorder, and I'm not sure how much credence to give that either, but a co-morbid personality disorder, or bi-polar depression is likely to have been at play. It is still inlikely, as Graeme has said, that the Aspergers was the trigger, cause, or primary factor. There is the possibility that certain rigidity of thinking helped him on the way once he had started. But it's also true that once a suicide has made up their mind to do it, they become very settled and rational about it.

One other thing that is interesting is that there are reports that his mother was stashing the guns and stuff for the end of the world on Friday. My husband works in the media and told me that, but I have no real knowledge. However, as an illustration, I am going to speculate a bit here: it woud not surprise me if he actually got caught up in the irrationality of this and decided to kil his mother and as many other people as possible along with himself to save them the ordeal. Autists, as I said before, are quite concerned about the happiness or contentment of others and are often over generous. Put that particular trait possibility together with a lack of proper control of a co-morbid condition affecting rationality, and you have all the ingredients for last week.

I suspect, and I have difficulty with this myself, that Adam Lanza is as much to be pitied in this as the victims. That might not be popular, but it might be true. Speaking for myself, I would rather he had done this for no reason, than some crazy Waco style belief in changing the world. In fact, was there not an end of the world element in that too?

It's all just very sad for the families left behind. The devastation this causes is immense.

 

Edited December 19, 2012 by hh5

[hh5]

Yeah I am glad too ... its very healthy 

 

   my oldest brother has anger spots ... I've seen both he and his wife have a extreme argument ... the danger was he was in the car with the engine in gear and running ... bullying his wife ... she is arguing in front of us ... his daughter and nieces were in serious tears ... so was I ...

 

the situation goes counter of how my brother would explain that he takes five to ten minutes alone to stop being angry

 

my morality and ethics ... just told me .. to try to stop this situation from escalating ... I told the kids to not be scared and its not ever about them ...

I turned my attention to my brother and spoke in a manner he might be more open to ... I asked him to shut the car off ... and in less than 30 seconds he did ... what I requested

 

I have to say this is the sort of situation I would really hate to see get ugly

 

Well when I got diagnosed, it became my responsibility to manage myself. That's why I tell close friends. I can't control my emotional state very well sometimes, but I can sure try to manage my reactions and do what I can to not be in situations where things could escalate. That's the core of my "take five" behavior. I'm really glad I have the ability to do that.

[hh5]

here is an article from the blaze ... never heard of them nor would expect this to be reliable info

 

 

It seems to show that the mother knew her son was very dangerous to himself

Its showing that during a period of time from one year ago to one week before the shooting that the mother unable to deal with the situation

AFRAID SHE WAS ‘LOSING’ HIM: SLAIN MOTHER OF CT SHOOTER REPORTEDLY SAID SON WAS ‘GETTING WORSE’ LAST WEEK

 

 

Roughly one week before her son went on a deadly shooting rampage at an elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut, Nancy Lanza reportedly told a friend that she feared her always-eccentric son was “getting worse.”

 

The New York Daily News relates:

 

A drinking buddy of Lanza told The Daily News that her son Adam had long been troubled and rarely came up in conversation.

“She just looked down at the glass and said, ‘I don’t know. I’m worried I’m losing him,’” said the bar pal, who did not wish to be named, of the ominous conversation at the bar My Place in Newtown, Conn.

“She said it was getting worse. She was having trouble reaching him.”

 

“Nancy told me he was burning himself with a lighter. In the ankles or arms or something,” [the friend] recalled of a conversation they had about a year ago. “It was like he was trying to feel something.”

[hh5]

gosh ... for a period of time ... people thought Ryan Lanza died ,,,, Adam took Ryan ID ...

Adam had no social media and Ryan did ... FB ... this caused a lot of trouble for him

There are other Ryan Lanza in the world and people have sent messages to them too

http://www.businessinsider.com/what-it-was-like-to-be-ryan-lanzas-facebook-friend-when-the-world-thought-he-was-a-killer-2012-12

http://www.inquisitr.com/438676/ryan-lanza-idd-as-newtown-school-shooting-gunman/

 

About the mother stock piling weapons ... that is only a portion of doomsday preppers ...

they usually stock pile food and other provisions in preparation for doomsday

so far police did not report finding that ... just guns n survivalist talk with a relative

 

 

 

American Preppers Network Statement Regarding the Connecticut School Shootings

 

It has come to our attention at the American Preppers Network that certain people in the media are now trying to make a connection between the peaceful, preppers community and Nancy Lanza, mother of Adam Lanza – the monster who brutally and savagely took the lives of so many innocent children and adults in Newtown, Connecticut.

Our members, and others around the globe who share our philosophy of being prepared in times of emergency, are sickened by this event.  We too are fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters, sons and daughters and to associate APN or any legitimate organization that stresses preparing for emergencies with this barbaric act goes against everything we collectively stand for.

In the documentary ... no one ever mentions they are a member of APN ... no one mentions how they will act during an event

we are only shown they will survive and defend their place and supplies 24x7

Edited December 19, 2012 by hh5

[JamesSavik]

I'm not a member of that group but you might call me a "prepper".

 

Living without power for days after hurricane Katrina would make anyone a "prepper".  I'm betting that Sandy made a lot of converts.

 

Disasters suck. The time you spend preparing for them up front will save tears or maybe even you life.

 

I don't think that this has anything to do with the situation.

[Graeme]

The following article from today's Washington Post is extremely relevant to this discussion:

 

Confusing Asperger's with mental illness, and mental illness with evil

 

One quote from the article:

 

And though you might not know it from some of the coverage, Asperger’s isn’t a mental illness at all, but a developmental disorder. The young adults I know who were diagnosed that way are smart, sweet, and simply had to work harder to learn the social cues that came effortlessly to their peers. When one of them got into a top college a few years ago, his mom fantasized about sharing the news with every kid who was ever mean to him in middle school: “Have fun at DeVry!” Because the fact is, kids with Asperger’s are far more likely to be bullied than to do any bullying.

 

 

Combined with the comments above, is that enough to settle once and for all that Asperger's is not the cause, or even a contributing cause, for what happened? It could be said is that Asperger's may have helped the killer be more efficient with what he did, but it had nothing to do with WHY he did it.

 

If you want to look for other causes, that's fine, but Asperger's has nothing to do with it!!!

Edited December 19, 2012 by Graeme

[hh5]

Yes, I agree that aspergers made him an efficient killer ... 

He exceeded everyone's expectations by acting out his violent video gamer and weapon skills.

and that's what upset the public ... he scored the #2 position for the most kills

 

If he had join the military service then No one would blame him for shooting in a war zone.

He demonstrated that he didn't care about his mother, the school staff, or the children.

 

There are things that makes his aspergers ... atypical ...

there is a lacking of knowing what his medical diagnosis is.

We don't know about his particular condition.

 

Yes, aspergers didn't kill those people theoretically ... Lanza killed them with asperger efficiency

 

Here is a story that explains in detail of what is known so far. It explains how efficient he carried out his mission.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/9749157/Connecticut-school-shooting-Adam-Lanza-rigged-rifle-for-maximum-damage.html

 

Adam Lanza planned his murderous rampage with meticulous precision, destroying his computer's hard-drive to hinder investigators and rigging his semi-automatic rifle .... (read the rest from the website)

 

 

The report that he obsessively played violent criminal games will raise fresh questions about the impact of such games on disturbed individuals.

 

I bet the video game companies are going to get some bad press when those games are named by title.

The gamers website will have to change something about its membership or what goes on in their forums and chats.

Already a company sold off their weapons division in fear of a lawsuit.

 

Can any one comment based on aspergers experience?

   * What happens when one is exposed to an abnormal environment for a few years?

     (150% exposure to violent games, Exposed to weapons, 0% Social Contact)

   * Does this prolong exposure have an impact on ethics and morals? 

   * Can an aspe choose a more healthy routine rather than an unhealthy one? or do they just focus on what interest them the most even if its unhealthy.

   * Would exposure to a more wholesome environment help bring about a more ethical and moral aspe person?

      (10% violent games, 90% Social Contact)

   * How do you rate your environment? Do you consider your environment Normal or abnormal?

 

      ( ___% violent games, __% Social Contact, Weapons: ____, etc etc)

 

 

 

Adam Lanza’s Mother Warned His Former Babysitter: “Don’t Turn Your Back On Him”

 

When he was 10-years-old, Kraft moved to Newtown from Hermosa Beach; the Lanza family moved next door around 6 months later. When he turned 14-years old, he was asked to babysit Adam Lanza and was given troubling instructions by his mother,

“[she told me] to keep an eye on him at all times…to never turn my back, not even to go to the bathroom,” Kraft said.

Kraft says he remembers Lanza as quiet, very intelligent and introverted, noting, "Whenever we were doing something, whether it was building Legos, or playing video games, he was really focused on it. It was like he was in his own world."

Kraft is still having trouble believing the kid he babysat could have been involved in such unspeakable horror. "I'm just numb to it, I haven't really processed the fact that this happened right where I used to be, and that, 15 years ago, it could have been me."

http://www.autismwebsite.com/crimetimes/05c/w05cp13.htm

ASPERGER'S DISORDER: A POSSIBLE EXPLANATION FOR BEHAVIOR OF SUBGROUP OF SERIAL KILLERS?

 

A series of papers by J. Arturo Silva and colleagues suggests that some serial killers—including Jeffrey Dahmer and Theodore Kaczynski (the "Unabomber")—exhibit evidence of Asperger's disorder (AD), a variant of autism.

...

Similar patterns, Silva and colleagues say, appear in the history of Kaczynski, who killed three people and wounded dozens by sending them mail bombs. Silva et al. note that Kaczynski was aloof and could not understand the feelings of others. He also exhibited an aversion to being touched and experienced extreme distress when exposed to noise, both common reactions in children with autism. A neighbor described the young Kaczynski as "a child who was an old man before his time," consistent with Hans Asperger's description of his young patients with AD as "little professors," and as an adult, Kaczynski was extremely impaired in social relationships. Kaczynski's preoccupations with bomb-making and the perceived evils of technology, the authors say, can be viewed as typical of the obsessive interests of a person with AD.

 

Silva et al. say their characterization of a subset of serial killers as having high-functioning autism could lead to a greater understanding of the etiology of both serial homicide and autism. "Psychological phenomena of central importance to understanding serial killers such as deficits in empathy have frequently been explained as originating from a psychopathic core," they say, "thereby missing the possibility that deficits in empathy may also be due to autistic psychopathology."

 

 

Edited December 20, 2012 by hh5

[Graeme]

Can any one comment based on aspergers experience?

   * What happens when one is exposed to an abnormal environment for a few years?

(150% exposure to violent games, Exposed to weapons, 0% Social Contact)

The same as anyone else who is exposed to an abnormal environment.

   * Does this prolong exposure have an impact on ethics and morals? 

It would have the same impact as someone without Asperger's.

   * Can an aspe choose a more healthy routine rather than an unhealthy one? or do they just focus on what interest them the most even if its unhealthy.

A more interesting question. Aspies tend to have "special interests". According to Professor Tony Attwood (world recognised expert in Asperger's), an Aspie will often try to learn everything they can about their "special interest". In one case (an extreme one), the special interest for the person with Aspergers was pornography, and they felt compelled to gather examples of all types of pornography, including child pornography....

 

However, making the jump from video games to real life is a big one. The "typical" Aspie response would be gather and experience all the different types of video games available - not extrapolate that experience to real-world situations. Extrapolation outside of their "normal" view of the world can be difficult for someone with Asperger's. That extrapolation is more typical of someone who doesn't have an autism spectrum disorder.

 

So the answer to your question is that if someone with Asperger's has a special interest, even an unhealthy one (eg. the pornography example mentioned earlier), they will stick with that special interest.

 

Did the killer have a "guns" special interest? Probably not - if they had they would have been much more likely to have been collecting guns, and would be have become known as a "guns nut" with all their knowledge.

 

On the subject of special interests, Aspies are also known to bore people to tears with discussions on their "special interest". Another example from Professor Tony Attwood was when he was warned not to talk about punk rock with a particular patient. He asked if they became violent when the subject was discussed. He was told, no, he would just bore them to tears talking about it, so they told everyone to avoid the subject...

   * Would exposure to a more wholesome environment help bring about a more ethical and moral aspe person?

      (10% violent games, 90% Social Contact)

Depends on the social contact. Remember, social interaction is often an area of difficulty for someone with Asperger's - pushing them into a social environment can actually be detrimental, as they could become overwhelmed. One Aspie I know is good with small numbers of people, but will avoid crowds as much as possible because he finds them scary.

 

Overall, Aspies tend to be quite ethical and moral. Because of the way they think, they often become sticklers for the rules - breaking a minor rule like crossing against the lights is on a par with stealing "A rule's a rule!" is a very Aspie view of the world.

   * How do you rate your environment? Do you consider your environment Normal or abnormal?

 

      ( ___% violent games, __% Social Contact, Weapons: ____, etc etc)

Pretty normal... but there's quite a range in "normal". The limited set of parameters you've selected is by no means comprehensive. I think you'd need at least 100 different parameters, covering such items as number of contacts for different ages groups, genders, ethnic groups, etc, as well as availability/time spend on things like TV, computers, reading, visiting museums, etc.

 

As an aside, one of my sons is involved in a longitudinal study of Australians, starting from when he was five. Every two years we get a survey to be completed, covering different aspects of what he does. It's quite interesting the sorts of questions they ask

[harcallard]

I am suddenly reading about cases of Asperger's and I have recently found out I have a friend who suffer's from it! Is it really as wide spread?

[NotNoNever]

Yes, I agree that aspergers made him an efficient killer ... 

He exceeded everyone's expectations by acting out his violent video gamer and weapon skills.

and that's what upset the public ... he scored the #2 position for the most kills

 

If he had join the military service then No one would blame him for shooting in a war zone.

He demonstrated that he didn't care about his mother, the school staff, or the children.

 

There are things that makes his aspergers ... atypical ...

there is a lacking of knowing what his medical diagnosis is.

We don't know about his particular condition.

 

Yes, aspergers didn't kill those people theoretically ... Lanza killed them with asperger efficiency."..................................................................

Sigh

[NotNoNever]

harcallard, on 20 Dec 2012 - 03:09, said:

I am suddenly reading about cases of Asperger's and I have recently found out I have a friend who suffer's from it! Is it really as wide spread?

 

Autism is about 0.5% - 1% of the population, 80% boys.

 

Aspergers is not suffered. The only suffering going on is that aspies have to suffer the ineptitudes of the rest of the world. Otherwise it's a pretty pleasant experience.

Edited December 20, 2012 by NotNoNever

[Graeme]

There are things that makes his aspergers humanity ... atypical ...

there is a lacking of knowing what his medical diagnosis is.

We don't know about his particular condition.

My apologies, but it took me a little while to work out how to fix your statement

[hh5]

I have been reading too ... in my life time perhaps I met one or two or more ... I respected their space ... and let them be

Nothing terribly to worry about ... 

 

Lanza is still unconfirmed about having aspergers ... investigators are trying to find out what his real mental condition is

according to googling ... its est 68 million world wide has aspergers of some kind

 

If you read the stories ... people normally forget people with disabilities ... not even have such people in their lives

me I always notice everyone ... I remember people ... its sad how we treat people with disabilities

 

 

I remember my korean friends sister ... she was autistic ... my friend needed to transport her to her environment

so I helped with no questions and got to learn what her routine life was about

everything was rooted in good wholesome environment ... nothing violent ... no weapons ... lots of family love

her life is very routine ... home .. work ... chores ... family visits ...

 

I am suddenly reading about cases of Asperger's and I have recently found out I have a friend who suffer's from it! Is it really as wide spread?

Edited December 20, 2012 by hh5

[hh5]

a possible motive

Adam Lanza's Motive: Did Fear Of Being Committed Lead To Sandy Hook Elementary Shooting? 

 

A senior law enforcement official also confirmed that 20-year-old Lanza's anger over his mother's plan is being investigated as a possible motive for the Newtown shooting.

 

"From what I've been told, Adam was aware of her petitioning the court for conservatorship and (her) plans to have him committed," said Joshua Flashman, 25, who grew up not far from where the shooting took place. "Adam was apparently very upset about this. He thought she just wanted to send him away. From what I understand, he was really, really angry. I think this could have been it, what set him off."

 

It's unclear whether Adam's mother, Nancy Lanza, was really filing the paperwork, because court officials say that such records are sealed. But she would have gone through a longer process to get legal rights to commit an adult to a hospital or psych ward against his will.

 

UPDATE: The New York Daily News reports that an unidentified friend claims Adam was withdrawing from his mother -- and the world -- in the days leading up to the killings. The person, who claims to be close to Nancy Lanza, said that the mother took Adam to a psychiatrist, but wasn't planning on committing him to a facility. Neither report has been confirmed by named police sources.

 

Nancy Lanza reportedly volunteered with kindergartners at the school for several years. Flashman said that Adam "believed she cared more for the children than she did for him." On the day of the massacre, Nancy was Adam's first victim. Flashman told Fox News that Nancy was also good friends with the school's principal and psychologist, both of whom were killed during the incident.