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    northie
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Stories posted in this category are works of fiction. Names, places, characters, events, and incidents are created by the authors' imaginations or are used fictitiously. Any resemblances to actual persons (living or dead), organizations, companies, events, or locales are entirely coincidental.
Note: While authors are asked to place warnings on their stories for some moderated content, everyone has different thresholds, and it is your responsibility as a reader to avoid stories or stop reading if something bothers you. 

Never Too Late To Explore - 11. Up For Discussion

Eric has supper with the two lads, and Andy's boss from the charity...

Sitting at Andy's kitchen table, Eric was pleased with himself. He managed to eat most of his portion of Andy's fish stew. Only a few of the tiger prawns remained. The taste of them was odd – unpleasant, to his mind. The others round the table ate them with gusto. It took all sorts. Andy and Adam helped themselves to seconds. The woman sitting opposite him, Claire, had also finished, though her plate was clear.

“Eric?”

It was Andy. He was looking hopefully at the remaining, abandoned prawns. “Don't you want those prawns?”

Eric shook his head slightly in amazement. Anyone would've thought the two lads didn't get enough to eat. “No. I'm full, thanks. I liked most of the stew, but not those.”

“Ah …” Andy glanced further up the table. “Excuse me. It's a shame to waste them.”

He piled them onto his own plate.

Claire nodded in agreement. “Too right. The amount of food that gets thrown away is disgraceful. The latest statistics show fifteen billion pounds worth of edible food was binned over the course of a year.”

“Billion?!” Andy's jaw dropped.

“Yeah …”


As she continued to chat with Andy, Eric took the opportunity to snatch several glances in the woman's direction. She was pretty, yet appeared not to have given much thought to how she looked. Not that he was any expert. Jeans, a hooded casual top, her long brown hair bundled out of the way, she still drew his eye. She was confident, straight-talking, acting more like a man than a woman, it seemed to him.

Adam cleared his throat. “So, Claire, talking of food waste. Andy mentioned you'd had an idea?”

“Yeah.”

The woman turned her attention away from Andy. She pushed her empty plate aside. “It's nothing original. But why reinvent the wheel? I was thinking of setting up a foodbank here in the town somewhere. There's need – the rural poor might not be as obvious as those in the cities, but they exist.”

Eric frowned. Was she referring to him? Labels weren't something he liked. Enough of them had been applied to him during his lifetime – loser, recluse, weirdo…

He was spotted.

“Sorry, Eric.” The woman smiled at him in apology. “I slipped into work mode there. We have to talk in generalities to understand what's needed.” She turned back to Adam. “But the statistics back up my point. Fifteen percent of rural households are in real financial distress. Another seventeen percent struggle at various times to get through.”

“How does that compare with urban areas?” Adam was thinking aloud.

“It's less than in urban areas, especially after housing costs are factored in. But think how much more money central government pumps into those areas …”

“That doesn't necessarily mean the funding per capita's any higher, though greater population density makes it easier to run projects.” Andy was also getting involved.

“Yes. And the urban poor are possibly more vocal? But none of that detracts from the central issue of rural poverty.”

Eric looked on as the conversation became more animated. Claire, in particular, was getting fired up. He was fascinated by her hands, constantly moving, emphasising the points. No wonder she moved her empty plate out of the way.

“The countryside's a healthier place to live …”

“If you don't need actual health services.” Claire frowned at Andy as she spoke. “The urban poor usually have better access to health care, whether it's because a clinic is nearby, or because their public transport allows them to get to services.”

Eric spoke for the first time. “My GP's fine.”

Claire nodded. “Yes, we're lucky the local partnership has a good reputation. But if you need hospital care for any reason, it's a thirty mile round trip with no direct transport links. … Anyway, getting back to food. There's only one supermarket here, and that lack of competition isn't good for anyone.”

Andy objected. “There're other food shops.”

“Yes. More expensive, open limited hours, and only offering a focussed range usually. Whether it's the corner convenience store or the high-street butcher. I've noticed you in the butcher's, Andy. Who else do you see shopping there?”

Andy gave a wry smile. “People like me and Adam mostly, I suppose. Earning good salaries, or with a private pension. And the local landowners, as well.”

“So, not you then, Eric?” Claire looked in his direction.

Eric shook his head. “Even when I was working, I don't think I went in there. It never occurred to me.”

“Which brings us back to the foodbank.” Adam was steering the conversation back to where it started. “Would you use one, Eric?”

“Ehm… Andy explained a little yesterday, but I'm still not clear how they work.”

“OK…” The woman opposite him took a drink from her glass of cider.

Eric tried to focus on her face rather than her hands; he found them too distracting.

“Essentially, it's somewhere people can go to collect a free bag of donated food and other necessities.”

Eric didn't like the sound of that. “Can anyone get them?”

“No, no. Not at all.” Claire leaned forward across the table. “You must be referrred by a health worker, social worker, Citizen's Advice Bureau. Somebody official. Andy could do it for you.”

Out of the corner of his eye, Eric saw Andy smile in agreement. He still wasn't convinced. “What would I want with charity stuff? I pay my own way. Always have done. And I've never been in debt.”

“Not everyone's as prudent with their money as you are, Eric.”

He grunted. “More fool them. They shouldn't spend what they haven't got on fripperies. I've managed to get by without them.”

Andy grinned. “People have more expectations nowadays, and of course, housing costs are so much higher.”

“And transport, particularly if you commute. Don't forget working-age people have to pay, Eric.”

Eric stared at the woman. Maybe she had a point?

Adam chuckled. “A foodbank's a good idea, Claire, but it sounds as though it's going to need an information campaign to gauge take-up?”

The woman shrugged. “Perhaps.” She turned to Eric again. “A foodbank is a lifeline when somebody's in debt, or their salary hasn't quite stretched to the end of the month. What's on offer is basic, own-label stuff – boxed, canned, dried. People still have to buy some of their own food as well. Particularly anything fresh.”

It sounded like most of the contents of his weekly shopping list. Eric frowned again. He didn't want to be stigmatised, to be dependent on charity. He managed OK, and he'd continue to do so.


Andy stood up and started to clear away the plates. “It's the lack of fresh stuff that bothers me. Eric? Wouldn't you like to have more fruit and veg?”

Eric thought for a moment. He bought the odd banana now with his increased pension, and a leek or two. Occasionally, a small cauliflower, if Andy was giving him a lift.

“Err … perhaps. Depends what was on offer.”

Andy put the dirty plates in the sink. He turned round. “I'd hope to persuade the local market gardeners and soft fruit growers to add something into the mix. Slightly damaged stuff, overstocks, anything that won't be accepted by the retailers. I think fruit and veg are at least as important as the other things. One of the aims of the foodbank should be to help improve people's health.”

Claire grinned. “You're getting as fired up as me.” She looked in Adam's direction. “Isn't he?”

He chuckled. “Yep. It's one of things I love about him.”

Andy rolled his eyes, but still gave Adam a kiss on the cheek as he returned to the table. “OK. Who'd like some afters?”

Eric raised a hand, as did Claire. Adam appeared to hesitate.

He eyed his partner. “This wouldn't be more of your special ice-cream, would it?”

Andy smirked.

Claire raised an eyebrow. “I'm curious.”

Adam grunted. “Hnh. If the idea of peach and sweet-cured bacon ice-cream grabs you, I'm sure there's some left.”

Eric stared at Adam. “Pardon?”

“Yeah. Exactly that.” Adam turned to Andy. “Please tell me it's something else.”

Claire sat back in her seat. “I don't know. I'll try most things once. Is there any left, Andy?”

Andy was now rummaging in the freezer. “Nope. Looks as though I ate the last of it. Either that or Adam threw it out.”

“Excuse me?” The snorts and chuckles from around the table made Adam shake his head in amusement. “Anyway, what is it you're offering?”

“Something acceptable to all, I hope.” Andy reached into the fridge and produced the dessert. “Apricot and frangipane tart with pouring cream. … Actually, I've just thought. Do you want it as is, or warmed through? It'll only take quarter of an hour.”

'Warmed through' was the verdict, so Andy put the tart in oven before returning to the table where talk had turned to roadworks in the town.


Eric only had a dribble of cream on his tart. Rich things like that upset his guts. He used his fork to prod the tart with caution. He knew of apricots from seeing them on the supermarket shelves, but the stuff they were in, he'd never seen before.

Again he was spotted – by Andy this time. “It tastes of almonds, Eric. A little like marzipan.”

That gave him a pointer, of sorts. Eric picked his fork up again with determination and took a piece of the tart. It was good. Very good. The flavours went together perfectly. He set to on the remainder of his portion, hoping the others would continue to carry the conversation without him.

It didn't last for long though before the woman addressed him again. “Eric, would you agree A Helping Hand has made a real difference to your life?”

In the spotlight once more, Eric glanced round the table. It appeared the two lads were just as interested in what he was about to say. Andy looked a little more pink than usual. Eric took a moment to decide what it was he was going to say. He moved in his seat slightly to favour Andy's end of the table.

“If I'd never met you, Andy, I would still be stuck in my rut. Living the same day over and over again: no purpose, no friends, no being the true me. Thank you.”

Eric looked first at Claire, and then for a longer time at Andy. “You rescued me. I am truly grateful.”

Andy turned a brighter shade of pink. His lips sketched a kiss in Eric's direction before he replied. “You rescued yourself, Eric. We helped, but you made that phone call. You made that all-important first move.”

Claire nodded vigorously.

Eric felt the colour rising in his cheeks – something that rarely happened to him. “It was one of those forks in the road. And I took the right one for the first time in my life.”

Adam reached over and stroked his hand. “No regrets?”

“No, not at all. … Well, the only regret is that I didn't do it sooner, I suppose.”

Claire looked thoughtful. “Hmm… but Andy had only joined A Helping Hand a couple of months before you contacted us. Yes, you might've found someone as good, but they would've lacked that certain extra something.”

Eric looked down at his empty plate. “I'm learning so much about what it means to be a gay man today. Out in the open. Or a little, at least. And to hope one day that I might become a part of a community… That would've been impossible without these two lads.” His voice caught at the end.

Adam gave his hand another squeeze which made him look up again. “It continues to be our pleasure, Eric. It really does.”

A tear or two threatened, but Eric blinked rapidly until the urge subsided.

Andy got up to clear the dishes. When he got to Eric's place, Eric felt a brief kiss on the top of his head. “Don't forget I've learnt a huge amount since you became my client. All sorts of things. I hope it's made me a better person.”

Claire let out a bark of laughter. “OK. Mutual appreciation session over? Seriously though, I think you're one of our more successful pairings.”

“Thanks, Claire.” Andy continued clearing up.

Adam got up and started preparations for a large pot of tea.


While only the two of them were seated at the kitchen table, Eric wondered if he should say something. What, he had no idea. He was spared from commenting on the weather by being asked another question.

The woman leant across the table. “Eric? May I ask a favour of you?”

Eric blinked. What on Earth did he have that she didn't? “Err…”

“Would you be prepared to repeat some of what you said on camera?”

Eric's jaw dropped. “Camera?”

She snorted. “Don't worry. It's not the movies. It'll just be me. And Andy could be with you for moral support, if that would help?”

Andy heard his name being mentioned and called across, “Yes?”

Claire beckoned, and he came back to the table.

“I was asking Eric if he'd be happy to do a short video for the charity's website.”

“Oh… OK.” Andy turned to Eric. “What d'you think?”

Eric tried to gather his thoughts. He'd never so much as had his picture taken, never mind anyone filming him.

Andy sat down again. “It would be a good way of showing your appreciation.”

“Err…” Eric considered that fact for a moment before looking at the woman. “What would I have to say?”

“Only what you'd feel happy with. We wouldn't give you a script of any sort. How we helped you. What changes have happened in your life. The sort of thing that might encourage someone else in your position to apply for help. Or indeed, inspire a volunteer.”

Adam deposited the teapot on the table. “Just caught the end of that. Sounds a great idea.” He went off to get the mugs, then returned and sat down.

Claire accepted a mug. “It'll only happen if Eric's willing. There's no pressure.”

Eric felt he was being observed from all sides of the kitchen table. He was in two minds. It seemed impossible that anyone would want to watch him, Eric Whitehouse, stuttering through his piece, dressed in his usual shabby clothes. But those who might know better, disagreed.

There was a welcome pause as Adam poured the tea. It wasn't tea as he recognised it. Eric peered at the pale, delicate liquid which tasted of nothing much in particular. Adam liked it, so in the evenings, this was what appeared. How much longer would it be before he drank a proper mug of tea? Eric missed that and many other things from not being at home. His ankle continued to improve, so maybe he'd be allowed home the following week sometime? Eric decided to ask once the other guest had left.

Andy repeated his question from earlier. “What d'you think, Eric?”

Eric clutched at the first of many questions that floated around inside his head. “Could I read from a piece of paper?”

He and Andy looked in Claire's direction.

“It would look more natural if you talked straight to the camera. Perhaps as if you were chatting to a friend, but we don't get to hear that part of the exchange.”

Another question. “What if I get my words mixed up, or I grind to a halt?”

Adam joined in. “Eric, it isn't on film, you know. It's all digital, which makes editing so much easier. … Look, how about I or Andy ask you questions off camera, and Claire records your answers?”

That sounded easier. Eric tried to make his mind up, though there didn't seem to be any rush. There was no fixed date or anything.

He decided to postpone the decision until he got home. “Ehm… I'd like some more time to think things through, if that's alright with you, Claire?”

“Yeah, sure.” Claire smiled. “There's no compulsion. It just suddenly came to me and I'm glad you haven't dismissed it out of hand.”

Andy passed his mug down the table for a refill. “Would Eric be the first?”

“Apart from me droning on, yeah.” Claire looked at the time. “I'd better be getting back. Busy day tomorrow.” She looked at Andy. “Thanks for inviting me, Andy. I'm really glad I agreed to come. And Eric …”

Eric raised an eyebrow – he still wasn't sure about Claire.

She laughed. “There's no need to look at me like that. It's been a pleasure to meet you, Eric. I hope you and Andy continue your excellent work together.”

Eric muttered a “Thank you” amongst the noises of the others starting to move.

Adam stood up. “It's been great to have met you, Claire. A fascinating evening's been had by all, I think.”

After a chorus of farewells, Adam showed her out. Eric and Andy were left at the kitchen table.

“Awesome! Eric, the trailblazer.” Andy grinned at him. “You should do it, you know.”

Eric stared back in disbelief. A trailblazer, him?

My ongoing thanks to Parker Owens. 
I love to read your comments, thoughts, speculations, and experiences. Leave them here, or on the story discussion:
 
Copyright © 2018 northie; All Rights Reserved.
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Stories posted in this category are works of fiction. Names, places, characters, events, and incidents are created by the authors' imaginations or are used fictitiously. Any resemblances to actual persons (living or dead), organizations, companies, events, or locales are entirely coincidental.
Note: While authors are asked to place warnings on their stories for some moderated content, everyone has different thresholds, and it is your responsibility as a reader to avoid stories or stop reading if something bothers you. 
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1 hour ago, Ivor Slipper said:

Yes, she does seem rather pushy, but perhaps that goes with the territory. 

I think it does. Committed, visionary people are always going to be in there, putting their points forward.

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1 hour ago, Wesley8890 said:

She seems a bit over eager

1 hour ago, Ivor Slipper said:

Yes, she does seem rather pushy, but perhaps that goes with the territory. 

Claire had to be an over-eager person to get a non-profit like Helping Hands off the ground. Others may have had similar ideas in the past, but only a pushy person could get it going. You have to have an aggressive personality if you want to find funding, recruit volunteers, and otherwise interest people in your work. A shy and retiring person either needs to become so passionate about their work that they overcome their natural tendencies, have deep pockets themselves, or have access to deep pockets through generous friends or relatives.

But I think Claire overwhelmed Eric.
;–)

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27 minutes ago, droughtquake said:

But I think Claire overwhelmed Eric.

He doesn't know what to make of her, certainly. But I'm not sure 'overwhelmed' is the right characterisation. As far as the video request goes, that's reasonable, if completely out of left field. ;) 

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9 minutes ago, northie said:

But I'm not sure 'overwhelmed' is the right characterization.

Even her hands being constantly in motion distracted Eric!
;–)

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11 minutes ago, droughtquake said:

Even her hands being constantly in motion distracted Eric!
;–)

Don't you find that? I know I do.

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14 minutes ago, northie said:

Don't you find that? I know I do.

I guess I’ve been around more than a few Gay men who had ‘fluttery’ hands. And some of the numerous cultures I am surrounded by are more expressive physically. Not all cultures are as repressed as the British, Japanese, and Scandinavians.
;–P

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I don't think I'd classify Claire's personality as aggressive, rather I'd say assertive. I agree too that it's a necessary trait of folks that do the kind of work she does.

Eric doesn't seem to realize how exceptional he is in the changes he's made to his life. At the same time Claire, Adam and Andy don't seem to understand what it means for Eric to accept "charity". He has subsisted within his means and if that meant doing without well then do without he did. That was a common trait among folks of my grandparents generation and even my mum. My grandparents, like Eric, were rural farmbased thoughout their lives. They survived the Great Depression and the deprivations during WWII. They got by with what was available. As a boy my maternal grandfather ate poached venison. His people were mountain folk. My paternal grandfather hunted rabbit, pheasant and deer in season as supplemental meat for the table. I myself can remember when Sunday night's meal was hot chocolate and toast because it was cheap and filled our tummys. I watched my dad eat "coffee soup", nothing more than broken up toasted bread with a spoonful of sugar, hot coffee and some milk. I helped my paternal grandmother glean dandelion greens from along the hayfields in the spring to cook up into a tasty nourishing meal. We got by with what was available. Growing up I never went hungry, my body and clothes were clean. I got new school clothes each year but also wore hand-me-downs from my older cousins and passed on my clothes to a younger boy who was the son of a friend of mum's. It wasn't "charity" it was commonsense there was still wear in those clothes, they weren't worn and shabby. Charity was for the poor folks who had less than we did. So suggesting Eric go to the foodbank for handouts was almost an insult. An assault on his dignity and self-worth. What needs to be done is to get him to see it as a benefit, like those others available to him, that provides him with some of the things he buys now so that he can use those savings to buy fruit and veggies he otherwise could not.

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One the things I enjoy most about posting this story is the responses I get from readers. I learn so much. Thank you for this, dugh.

27 minutes ago, dughlas said:

Eric doesn't seem to realize how exceptional he is

No. I suppose he has nothing to judge it against. In his mind, it's just him having done something right for once in his life. I don't imagine he's one for watching true life TV.

31 minutes ago, dughlas said:

So suggesting Eric go to the foodbank for handouts was almost an insult

As Claire herself recognises, she deals in broad swathes of the community. Generality against specific. Then she comes up against Eric: as you say, he's got himself through life. He barely has a bank account; no debit or credit card. He's been in employment all his working life. There's adjustment needed on both sides, I think. I'm not sure Eric knows anything much of the modern rural unemployed, or those who only have seasonal work. Their encounter has left them both with things to think about.

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7 minutes ago, dughlas said:

So suggesting Eric go to the foodbank for handouts was almost an insult. An assault on his dignity and self-worth. What needs to be done is to get him to see it as a benefit, like those others available to him, that provides him with some of the things he buys now so that he can use those savings to buy fruit and veggies he otherwise could not.

Those who deal with the less well off often do not truly understand the people they wish to serve. Different backgrounds, different experiences, and cultural differences all contribute to misunderstandings. This is exasperated in non-governmental agencies by the demands of the funding sources – often governmental, family foundations, or religious organizations. Government agencies are very susceptible to legislative extremist who tinker with regulatory guidelines and use funding cuts as punishment of those agencies and their clients.

Those who seek services often face conflicting demands, competing agencies that don’t cooperate with each other, and an overall lack of coordination. This leads to both incomplete and duplicate services. Funding usually targets specific goals of the funding source that don’t necessarily match community needs, sometimes ignoring basic problems in favor of more trendy and fashionable goals.

My county has a county-organized database where client information is entered once and available to all participating groups, reducing the times that a client has to repeatedly provide identical information to numerous agencies. This improves accuracy, reduces wasted time, and assists in identifying additional services that might be beneficial to the client – even if the service is provided by a different agency. San Francisco is just now setting up a similar system.

 

California applicants for CalFresh (aka SNAP or ‘food stamps’) and GA (General Assistance) are required to submit to fingerprinting and having their mugshot taken as if they were criminals. This sends the message to the applicant that the government believes you are guilty of a crime or are more likely to commit criminal acts. Those on the opposite end of the economic spectrum who apply for government assistance are not treated in a similar manner. The assumptions are very clear to anyone applying for CalFresh or GA.
 

While much maligned, the homeless study funded by Mark Benioff will not only find out what the needs are, but also the best practices for meeting the needs of even the most difficult cases. The study will also compile the existing data from around the world, translate academic jargon, and make it available to others so they can build on what is learned. In many cases, no one has actually surveyed the actual needs before programs are designed.

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Another way of selling the idea of the food bank to Eric would be to tell him to view this as compensation for not being paid enough for his labor while he worked, and for losing his home help due to cuts. That people who donate see it as a way to give to those who deserve a helping hand. In the best version it would be like going to the supermarket, but not paying. And who knows, he might find a friend or two, who will understand what it's like to have struggled to make ends meet all his life.

Oh, and why hasn't Eric said something about the tea? :facepalm: Adam will be mortified when he finds out. If he went to the trouble of getting Eric's chair, making a stronger cup of tea for him would be a piece of cake.

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19 hours ago, droughtquake said:

the homeless study funded by Mark Benioff

This made for an interesting read (a news article can be found here). My local city is experiencing an increase in homelessness. The reasons are many: lack of affordable housing stock; mental health issues; addiction issues; LGBTQ factors; and of course unemployment. 

 

19 hours ago, droughtquake said:

California applicants for CalFresh (aka SNAP or ‘food stamps’) and GA (General Assistance) are required to submit to fingerprinting and having their mugshot taken as if they were criminals.

We don't have this. The main obstacle for some is the fact that all applications for the combined Universal Credit must be handled online. Those with literacy and other issues are consequently disadvantaged.

As I said to @dughlas, I learn a lot from comments. :thankyou:

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18 hours ago, dughlas said:

This story draws out our interest in our shared humanity.

This is your felicity with words again, dugh. :lol: Observations from you, drought, @Jaro_423 (for the first book) and @Will Hawkins (the same), amongst so many others are both informative and humbling in equal measure. That my simple story should strike chords like this is a revelation.

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12 hours ago, Timothy M. said:

In the best version it would be like going to the supermarket, but not paying.

Yes, because Eric already has the suspicion what's on offer is most of his usual weekly shopping trip.  ;)  I suspect his cross-grained sense of pride will get in the way. Getting round it will be tricky.

12 hours ago, Timothy M. said:

why hasn't Eric said something about the tea?

Because being a guest, he doesn't want to be disruptive. There's the added thing that after a few evenings of drinking it,  he'd be too embarrassed to mention it, even if it occurred to him. 

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14 hours ago, Timothy M. said:

In the best version it would be like going to the supermarket, but not paying.

At San Jose State (the oldest campus of the California State University, the less prestigious sibling of the University of California system) in Silicon Valley, they’ve set up a food bank on campus. They discovered that a significant percentage of their students were skipping meals because they couldn’t afford food as well as their other expenses like housing (another major difficulty many struggle with), tuition, and books. Students are allowed to take food not only for themselves, but also their family members.

San Jose State alumni include John Carlos & Tommie Smith of the Black Power Salute at the 1968 Mexico City Olympics, Ray Dolby of Dolby Labs, Doug Clifford & Stu Cook of Creedence Clearwater Revival, Tom Johnston & Patrick Simmons of The Doobie Brothers, Lindsey Buckingham & Stevie Nicks of Fleetwood Mac, Paul Kantner of Jefferson Airplane, Amy Tan (Joy Luck Club), and numerous business and political leaders.
 

Edited by droughtquake
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6 minutes ago, dughlas said:

Food insecurity is a major issue for many college students.

Yet it's seen as a rite of passage in a way. Somehow not as significant as when it happens to anyone else. Even something to joke about.  :huh:

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I'd love to see Eric do a short video. I think he would be surprised at how well he would do. Good to hear them reflect on how they have helped each other, especially for Eric to hear it's not one-sided. 

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28 minutes ago, Puppilull said:

I'd love to see Eric do a short video.

Yes, to see a genuine person in front of the camera, rather than someone rehearsed to within an inch of their lives. Even if Eric felt awkward or tongue-tied while doing it, editing can make things look a lot better.

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I love Eric’s pride , his sense of self worth the absolute certainty that anyone and everyone should be able to live within their means. 

Also his candid and sincere recognition of the benefit wrapped in his association with Andy and subsequently Adam. How his world has expanded and his boundaries become less rigid. 

Im not sure that he was intimidated by Claire , more wary of her innate sense of what people would need and her general application of that sense across the board. I feel this rubbed up wrongly against Eric’s pride. 

 

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On 5/17/2019 at 10:57 PM, Timothy M. said:

In the best version it would be like going to the supermarket, but not paying.

On the one hand, allowing clients to select exactly what they want and need is a more efficient use of resources since there will be less waste. On the other hand, how do you ration out the most desired and least available items? There is a fear that a few would take all the best stuff and sell it to others, subverting the whole purpose.

I’ve seen a story on the news about one food bank that’s set up like a grocery store. I’m not sure how they handle the issues I mentioned above, but the only clients allowed in must be referred to by outside agencies. That would minimize some of the widely reported problems when large agencies (like Glide Memorial) give away bags of food for the holidays (people going through the line multiple times, throwing out undesired items, and selling the best stuff instead of using it as intended).

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20 hours ago, deville said:

anyone and everyone should be able to live within their means.

Few people of younger generations would be prepared to live as he does. Sometimes, no matter how hard you try, the ends don't meet. He's just starting to get a sense of what the necessities of life are to someone Andy's age or younger.

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