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Uhoh, a Blog! And some ramblings about DST.

C James

Entry posted by C James

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Yep, I've decided to take the plunge and start blogging. My plan is to post on a variety of things, prety much anything. For example, my first real blog post will be sort of political as it will be about Daylight Savings time.

 

So, welcome everyone (assuming that anyone but me ever comes here! :lmao: ).

 

Now, on to my Rant of the Day: Daylight Savings Time!

 

I live in Arizona, and one of the things I love about Arizona is that we are not burdened by Daylight Savings Time. We don't have to change our clocks every spring and fall, and I love it. (note: on the Navajo Indian reservation, they do observe daylight savings time, though the rest of the state does not)

 

This begs the question: Why does anywhere bother with Daylight Savings Time? I can see some arguments for it, maybe, in more northern state where the Winter days are even shorter, but why have it anywhere in the Southern half of the country? We seem to get along just fine without it in Arizona, and the lack of it is exceedingly popular amongst residents.

 

The only issues that seem to ever arise are from occasional confusion with airline and train schedules, plus TV broadcasts on some stations, due to the rest of the nation changing its clocks twice a year. It can get slightly confusing when making long distance phone calls, too, but that is quite minor.

 

With DST, each year there is one 23 hour day and one 25 hour day, causing all kinds of headaches in scheduling, record keeping, etc.

 

The most laughable reason given in support of DST is that "the farmers need it". Evidently, anyone saying that has never asked a farmer about it! Farmers need to be up at daybreak, regardless of what the clocks say. It is of no use to them, and some hindrance: the changes serve to put them more out-of-sync with their communities (everyone else can change their schedules to the DST, but farmers cannot).

 

Fuel savings are often mentioned as a reason for DST, and played a role in the recent extension of DST by three weeks (beginning next year). The fuel savings are quite negligible, and could be vastly exceeded by common sense: for example, allow and encourage urban businesses, where practical, to vary their work hours to avoid rush hour traffic. Instead of 9-5, try 8-4, or 10-6. This has been done with some success in Phoenix, and it does alleviate some traffic congestion, which in turn saves on both fuel and air pollution (not to mention time, frustration, and lives).

 

The energy savings often quoted for DST are based on a reduced need for electric lighting by having sunset one hour "later" each day during DST. This did have some truth decades ago, but now is largely if not completely ofset by workers coming hom in summer closer to the hottest part of the day (and thus increasing the use of power-hungry air conditioners.)

 

If energy savings are the reason, a far better argument can be made for having DST year-round; no changing of the clocks. California is talking about this for that very reason. However, in California's case, a better argument can be made for terminating DST: their power crisis is a peak-load shortage, and that is exacerbated, not helped, by having people return home closer to the hottest part of the day. So, in essence, one could argue that California would be better off observing DST in winter, and not in summer, the opposite of the rest of the nation. Also, the latest boondoggle, the extension of DST a few weeks beginning next year, will raise trouble with all the devices that adjust the time based on date, and many will thus show the wrong time.

 

My position is that, given the costs and hassles of DST and changing the clocks, either adopt it year-round, or do away with it. Schools and businesses that need daylight are quite capable af adjusting their schedules rather than their clocks.

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11 Comments

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Krista

Krista 14,646

Posted

Hey,

 

Well all I know about DST is that I always forget when to set all my clocks and I end up throwing a tantrum when I'm being woke up by a very cranky mother. Of course it's only when we lose an hour and the brats were late to school.. lol.

 

Now I don't have to worry about it as I'm not responsible for their transportation, but shew.

 

 

Anyway, DST, all I know about the History is that in Kentucky it really pissed the farmers off for some reason. I think it shortened their Harvest time in the Fall. I don't see any real reason to maintain DST, except people aren't to accustomed to drastic changes.

 

AND, I'm so proud of you for finally starting a blog. I mean how can one of the most PROLIFIC members of GA not have one? :blink:

 

Now we get to see how long winded you are. :P

 

I hope you have fun with your blog, and I'm glad to be one of the first comments :):great:

 

Krista

old bob

old bob 321

Posted

Hey Friend :music:

Welcome to the blog party :great:

take it easy, be happy and take care :worship:

Old Bob

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Graeme

Graeme 16,795

Posted

  • Site Administrator

The Australian state (pun intended) of daylight saving:

 

Queensland, Western Australian and the Northern Territory don't do it.

The rest of the country does, but Tasmania goes onto daylight saving three weeks before everyone else.

 

Now, normally, Australia has three timezones:

 

GMT+10: Queensland, New South Wales, ACT, Victoria and Tasmania

GMT+9:30: Northern Territory and South Australia

GMT+8: Western Australia

 

When daylight saving comes in, we have five timezones:

 

GMT+11: New South Wales, ACT, Victoria and Tasmania

GMT+10:30: South Australia

GMT+10: Queensland

GMT+9:30: Northern Territory

GMT+8: Western Australia

 

Yes, you're right -- when daylight saving starts, South Australia goes from 30 minutes behind Queensland to 30 minutes ahead of Queensland.

 

There are good reasons for Queensland, the Northern Territory and Western Australia not to go onto daylight savings.

 

In Perth (the capital of Western Australia), it is already light until 10pm. There is no need to extend the light by another hour.

 

In Queensland and the Northern Territory it is still warm in the evening. Extending the time before it cools down by another hour will make sleeping that much more difficult.

 

For the rest of the states, that extra hour in the evening for other activities is useful. If you like, it's a social enabler, by allowing more social activities in the afternoon and early evening than would otherwise be possible. Even if you can't put a monetary value on it, the intangible benefits are real.

 

It makes timetabling crazy at the changeover times, but I wouldn't want them to cancel it.

 

Just my opinion....

C James

C James 17,115

Posted

Now I don't have to worry about it as I'm not responsible for their transportation, but shew.

Anyway, DST, all I know about the History is that in Kentucky it really pissed the farmers off for some reason. I think it shortened their Harvest time in the Fall. I don't see any real reason to maintain DST, except people aren't to accustomed to drastic changes.

 

AND, I'm so proud of you for finally starting a blog. I mean how can one of the most PROLIFIC members of GA not have one? :blink:

 

Now we get to see how long winded you are. :P

 

I hope you have fun with your blog, and I'm glad to be one of the first comments :):great:

 

Krista

 

Hi Krista!!

Yep, DST is not popular with Farmers, which is why I always laugh when one of the reasons for it is given as "Farmers need it". The reason is that they often have to be working at sunup, regardless of what the clocks say, so the DST change puts them an hour further out of sync with their communities (where everyone else changes their schedules relative to the farmers twice a year).

 

And what? Me? Prolific? :o That's just a rumor! I'm just a quiet and shy lurker! 0:)

 

I've been thinking of starting a blog for a while, and finally took the plunge! And what, me, long winded? But I almost never have anything to say? 0:):D

 

Thank you for being my very first comment on my very first blog! :wub:

 

Hey Friend :music:

Welcome to the blog party :great:

take it easy, be happy and take care :worship:

Old Bob

 

Thank you Bob!! :great:

This looks like a lot of fun! :boy:

 

The Australian state (pun intended) of daylight saving:

 

Queensland, Western Australian and the Northern Territory don't do it.

The rest of the country does, but Tasmania goes onto daylight saving three weeks before everyone else.

 

Now, normally, Australia has three timezones:

 

GMT+10: Queensland, New South Wales, ACT, Victoria and Tasmania

GMT+9:30: Northern Territory and South Australia

GMT+8: Western Australia

 

When daylight saving comes in, we have five timezones:

 

GMT+11: New South Wales, ACT, Victoria and Tasmania

GMT+10:30: South Australia

GMT+10: Queensland

GMT+9:30: Northern Territory

GMT+8: Western Australia

 

Yes, you're right -- when daylight saving starts, South Australia goes from 30 minutes behind Queensland to 30 minutes ahead of Queensland.

 

There are good reasons for Queensland, the Northern Territory and Western Australia not to go onto daylight savings.

 

In Perth (the capital of Western Australia), it is already light until 10pm. There is no need to extend the light by another hour.

 

In Queensland and the Northern Territory it is still warm in the evening. Extending the time before it cools down by another hour will make sleeping that much more difficult.

 

For the rest of the states, that extra hour in the evening for other activities is useful. If you like, it's a social enabler, by allowing more social activities in the afternoon and early evening than would otherwise be possible. Even if you can't put a monetary value on it, the intangible benefits are real.

 

It makes timetabling crazy at the changeover times, but I wouldn't want them to cancel it.

 

Just my opinion....

Hi Graeme!

 

Western Australia confuses me a little: if Perth (the vast majority of the WA population is in that area, right?) is the deciding factor, why does New South Wales have DST but WA does not? Sydney and Perth are at roughly the same Latitude.

 

If ACT means Australian Capitol Territory, that would be Canberra and Jervis Bay which are in effect islands surrounded by NSW (except that Jervis Bay is on the coast), so it would make sense that they follow NSW.

 

If the extra hour in the evening is useful, wouldn't it make sense to go with DST all year round in those areas that presently have it?

 

What is bothering me the most here (in the US), though, is the change in dates for it beginning next year. It's been pushed back to early November for the end of it, which is about six weeks prior to the winter solstice (in the Northern hemisphere). That means that around 65% of the natural change in day length between winter and summer solstices has already occurred, so why not just make DST year-round and save the hassles of the changes? Also, the change in DST start and end dates in itself bothers me, because it will play merry heck with a lot of self-adjusting electronics and software.

Just my opinion... :boy:

 

Thank you all for commenting! I wasn't expecting to have any readers, let alone comments!! :D

  • Site Administrator
Graeme

Graeme 16,795

Posted

  • Site Administrator

Hi, CJ!

 

The difference between Western Australia (WA) and New South Wales (NSW) is that in WA, most of the population is on the western edge of the timezone while in NSW most of the population is on the eastern edge of the timezone. The time that the sun sets is later in the west of the timezone compared to the east and so it stays light later in Perth than it does in Sydney.

 

The extra hour in the evening is balanced against the loss of the hour in the morning. If we tried to extend daylight saving all year around then we'd have kids going to school in the dark in the middle of winter, which many parents (including me) would find unacceptable. During summer, the overall longer day means it is still light in the morning, even with the time shift.

 

There is a proposal for the year after next to align all the states with Tasmania and start daylight saving at the start of October instead of the end. New Zealand also goes onto daylight saving at the start of October, so that would also bring more consistency to the region. They aren't talking about doing it for next year because timetables for airlines, etc., are already done out to October next year. They want to give everyone plenty of warning.

knotme

knotme 588

Posted

First, welcome to the blogosphere!

 

As I kid, I wondered idly what was magic about setting the clock. I mean, who needs a sprung-forward clock to get us up earlier? The biggest reason in my little world was school. School started at the same clock time every day. I can recall going to school in twilight just before fall-back and just after spring-forward. Once I left high school, day-light savings became merely a temporary inconvenience twice a year.

 

I didn't care much one way or the other until I began to socialize and work over the Net across time zones and continents. Now daylight savings is a real pain. Here in Hawaii, we don't do daylight savings. A couple of weeks ago, planning a trip to the mainland for mid-November was complicated by the changes to the time differences between zones that would take place between my planning date and my trip date. Apple iCal kept me straight. Otherwise, I would have botched an auto reservation for sure.

 

I think we should reexamine whether, as Graeme says, daylight savings really gives us an extra hour in the evening. What is forcing us to conform to a fixed time on the clock? Fixed closing times of restaurants? Fixed times for shows? Would it be so hard on everyone if restaurants, opera houses, and theaters changed their hours with the seasons? Would that be less hassle than daylight savings time? If you add in factory hours for workers, I can see that the answer might be "No". As someone not tied by others to fixed times of day, I'd rather get rid of daylight savings altogether, but I can see the other side of the argument.

AFriendlyFace

AFriendlyFace 191

Posted

Hey CJ!

 

First off welcome to the blog world!! :great:

 

I've always thought you should have a blog!

 

Anyway as for DST I don't really like it that much, but I don't HATE it or anything either...I mostly just ignore it.

 

As for adjusting schedules instead of clocks that makes sense to me; however, personally I strongly favour a "24 hour" world. I really hate that places close AT ALL. I'd quite like to be able to go to the dentist at 2am (well actually I never want to go to the dentist :thumbdown: ), or see a movie at 5AM, or do my banking at 11PM or whatever. I just think everything ought to be 24 hours.

 

Anyway I personally never know when the time changes anyway. Fortunately my clocks and cell phone do it automatically.

 

I enjoyed this entry! Can't wait to read more! Have an awesome day!

 

Kevin

C James

C James 17,115

Posted

Hi, CJ!

 

The difference between Western Australia (WA) and New South Wales (NSW) is that in WA, most of the population is on the western edge of the timezone while in NSW most of the population is on the eastern edge of the timezone. The time that the sun sets is later in the west of the timezone compared to the east and so it stays light later in Perth than it does in Sydney.

 

Frankly, I'm appalled at Australia's lack of consistency! You insist on having Christmas in Summer, and July as a winter month, you even perversely insist upon having largely different constellations in your night sky, so why don't you have the sun rise in the West and set in the East to complete the package? :whistle:

 

Well, you could ease things a great deal with the DST problem. The fact that you have DST at such odd times compared to the Northern hemisphere makes for a time-table nightmare. I think the best solution is for you to begin DST in March and end it in November, in the interests of reducing the confusion. 0:)

 

First, welcome to the blogosphere!

 

As I kid, I wondered idly what was magic about setting the clock. I mean, who needs a sprung-forward clock to get us up earlier? The biggest reason in my little world was school. School started at the same clock time every day. I can recall going to school in twilight just before fall-back and just after spring-forward. Once I left high school, day-light savings became merely a temporary inconvenience twice a year.

 

I didn't care much one way or the other until I began to socialize and work over the Net across time zones and continents. Now daylight savings is a real pain. Here in Hawaii, we don't do daylight savings. A couple of weeks ago, planning a trip to the mainland for mid-November was complicated by the changes to the time differences between zones that would take place between my planning date and my trip date. Apple iCal kept me straight. Otherwise, I would have botched an auto reservation for sure.

 

I think we should reexamine whether, as Graeme says, daylight savings really gives us an extra hour in the evening. What is forcing us to conform to a fixed time on the clock? Fixed closing times of restaurants? Fixed times for shows? Would it be so hard on everyone if restaurants, opera houses, and theaters changed their hours with the seasons? Would that be less hassle than daylight savings time? If you add in factory hours for workers, I can see that the answer might be "No". As someone not tied by others to fixed times of day, I'd rather get rid of daylight savings altogether, but I can see the other side of the argument.

 

Hi Knotme!

 

I, too, encounter DST only when dealing with people in areas that have it, or when traveling. I'm delighted to live in a place that is free of it.

 

In the case of schools, for example, I'd much rather have the school change its hours with the season if need be than force everyone to do likewise.

 

Hey CJ!

I've always thought you should have a blog!

What? Me? But I never have anything to say!! Hmmm, maybe I should do a blog post on the merits of being a lurker? 0:)

 

But, fear not Kevin, even though i now have a blog, I'm still happy to offer fashion and grooming advice on yours. :whistle:

 

Anyway as for DST I don't really like it that much, but I don't HATE it or anything either...I mostly just ignore it.

 

As for adjusting schedules instead of clocks that makes sense to me; however, personally I strongly favour a "24 hour" world. I really hate that places close AT ALL. I'd quite like to be able to go to the dentist at 2am (well actually I never want to go to the dentist :thumbdown: ), or see a movie at 5AM, or do my banking at 11PM or whatever. I just think everything ought to be 24 hours.

 

Heh! I'd like that! I love supermarkets that open 24 hours. One here does, as does Walmart. So, I can go both grocery shopping and clothes shopping at 2am! (and sometimes do). Of course, I'm about as fond of clothes shopping as you are of going to the Dentist, so for me the main attraction is a nearly deserted store that lets me get in and out fast.

 

Given that you live in a big city, you probably have lots of 24 hour places nearby? I live 40 minutes from the nearest store of any kind, so it is a hastle for me to get to a store no matter what the hours. In winter I often get snowed in for up to a week, which can get irritating.

 

Wow, thank you everyone! I was amazed to see that I had vews, let alone comments!! :wub:

  • Site Administrator
Graeme

Graeme 16,795

Posted

  • Site Administrator
Hi, CJ!

 

The difference between Western Australia (WA) and New South Wales (NSW) is that in WA, most of the population is on the western edge of the timezone while in NSW most of the population is on the eastern edge of the timezone. The time that the sun sets is later in the west of the timezone compared to the east and so it stays light later in Perth than it does in Sydney.

 

Frankly, I'm appalled at Australia's lack of consistency! You insist on having Christmas in Summer, and July as a winter month, you even perversely insist upon having largely different constellations in your night sky, so why don't you have the sun rise in the West and set in the East to complete the package? :whistle:

 

Well, you could ease things a great deal with the DST problem. The fact that you have DST at such odd times compared to the Northern hemisphere makes for a time-table nightmare. I think the best solution is for you to begin DST in March and end it in November, in the interests of reducing the confusion. 0:)

I'm sorry, C James, I really am. We tried to legislate to have the sun rise in the west, as you suggested, but there was an outcry that the American tourists wouldn't be able to cope, and tourism is still an important part of the economy.

 

We are already being considerate in letting the northern hemisphere think they are the top half of the world (simply logic would indicate that for the Earth to be stable, the largest landmasses and population would have to be on the bottom half, but we antipodeans have been too polite to point that out), but the politicians drew the line at copying an obviously inferior DST system from the USA (evidence to support this statement: C James's original blog entry....)

 

In the interest of full disclosure: this post is being made while I'm drunk....

 

Graeme :D

Maddy

Maddy 8

Posted

aaah, I have no idea what to say on DST, since I live in AZ and don't really care for it, but I do have something to say:

 

WELCOME TO BLOGLAND!!!!!

 

I'm lookin forward to your next entry :)

 

Birds

C James

C James 17,115

Posted

Hi, CJ!

Frankly, I'm appalled at Australia's lack of consistency! You insist on having Christmas in Summer, and July as a winter month, you even perversely insist upon having largely different constellations in your night sky, so why don't you have the sun rise in the West and set in the East to complete the package? :whistle:

I'm sorry, C James, I really am. We tried to legislate to have the sun rise in the west, as you suggested, but there was an outcry that the American tourists wouldn't be able to cope, and tourism is still an important part of the economy.

But Graeme, the thing that gives Americans the most trouble is the fact that you have winter in July! We find that incredibly weird, as well as very inconvenient! And then there is the whole "Christmas in summer" thing, well, that is just too strange. :P

In the interest of full disclosure: this post is being made while I'm drunk....

I've been told that my blog makes more sense when the reader is drunk. Perhaps I'b best add that to the title? "Best viewed when drunk"?

:wacko:

 

Oh, and a minor note of irritation: how come Graeme gets to make more sense while he's drunk than I do when I'm sober? It's not fair, I tell ya!

 

aaah, I have no idea what to say on DST, since I live in AZ and don't really care for it, but I do have something to say:

WELCOME TO BLOGLAND!!!!!

I'm lookin forward to your next entry :)

Birds

 

Thank you Birds!!

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