A request for feedback

[Dion]

*tosses out feedback like beads at a Mardi Gras parade*

For what it's worth, I do thank all the authors - and all those involved at GA - for doing what they do.

 

I try to follow the adage: 'Do unto others as you would have them do unto you'. I leave feedback for the stories I read in one form or another. I try not to leave inane comments (ie: 'Thanks for writing'). If that's the comment I wish to make, I elaborate - saying why I'm thanking them.

 

No matter how silly it sounds, I feel obligated to leave some sort of response for the stories I've read. If I'd had to buy it to read it, that in itself would be a response. Since the stories here are free (thank you GA) then leaving a review is the least I can do. The blogs... I guess I'm guilty of not reviewing as much in those because I don't know people. It has a lot to do with RL in that I cannot approach strangers, either. If I feel I 'know' someone, I'll leave a response. Otherwise, I sit and think of what I'd like to say... and don't say it.

 

I just haven't reviewed much lately because I haven't really been in the mood to read.

 

These are my own thoughts, however. I don't mean to push my opinions on anyone.

[Masked Monkey]

*tosses out feedback like beads at a Mardi Gras parade*

For what it's worth, I do thank all the authors - and all those involved at GA - for doing what they do.

 

I try to follow the adage: 'Do unto others as you would have them do unto you'. I leave feedback for the stories I read in one form or another. I try not to leave inane comments (ie: 'Thanks for writing'). If that's the comment I wish to make, I elaborate - saying why I'm thanking them.

 

No matter how silly it sounds, I feel obligated to leave some sort of response for the stories I've read. If I'd had to buy it to read it, that in itself would be a response. Since the stories here are free (thank you GA) then leaving a review is the least I can do. The blogs... I guess I'm guilty of not reviewing as much in those because I don't know people. It has a lot to do with RL in that I cannot approach strangers, either. If I feel I 'know' someone, I'll leave a response. Otherwise, I sit and think of what I'd like to say... and don't say it.

 

I just haven't reviewed much lately because I haven't really been in the mood to read.

 

These are my own thoughts, however. I don't mean to push my opinions on anyone.

 

If I may make a suggestion Dion. The newly reopend chat room is a good place to get to know a subset of the people here. You don't have to participate, you can just sit silently and watch the people there make idiots of themselves. When you feel comfortable, or have something to contribute, you can.

 

:snowy:

[old bob]

I hope you sleep well and feel better in the morning.

I did and I do

I'm still proud that my bad mood brought a lot of comments against me and supporting the necessity to encourage the authors.

Thanks Gary for your posts. I got the lesson .

Old bob

Edited June 20, 2008 by old bob

[Lugh]

Why do you say that Centaur, Rick, and Snoopy don't 'count'? Surely your 'dedicated fans' must count quite a bit. Indeed new faces are great, but it's my dedicated commenters/reviewers/PM-ers that often mean the most to me!

 

Heh... they are among my beta readers... so essentially I should be thanking them! AND I get their comments (sometimes) weeks before a story is posted, so I already know how they feel about it, usually in much more depth than what they post on the forums. What they put up on the forums is usually an attempt to intice others to read (and comment) and knock me out of my post-posted depression.

[Bandage]

First of all, great topic, Kevin!

 

I kind of grew in this subject... At first, after I read a story, I mostly didn't comment. Why? I didn't want to be noticed as a reader, because I was really deep in the closet! (Of course, this applies to the stories on GA) But, now that I'm coming to terms with myself, I try to comment on the stories I read. Why? I once wrote a story, got no replies or whatsoever and I just quit it. So I know somewhat how it means to not receive any comments.

 

In a way it is kind of frustrating as well to have all these stories here! And to see that some authors are bummed about not getting any/much comments! And that's because I have other duties and occupations as well, like studying, or going out with friends, going to school, etc... So I can't read every story! And so I can't comment on them! And it frustrates me to no end...

 

I do think, if you want more comments, you still need to sell yourself and your stories... Only then can we notice you really DID write something, and we get curious as to what kind of stories that person writes, and if they're any good, and if it might thrill us to wait for new chapters to be posted! So authors, if you're desperate for comments, become visible!

 

Cheers

 

Niels

[Lugh]

So authors, if you're desperate for comments, become visible!

 

I'm sorry Zilar, I do not agree with this statement. The author should not have to "become visible", the reader should buck up and comment if they read the story. Besides, there are a few of us who are visible, but quietly so, and others who prefer not to attract too much attention (good or bad) for a lot of other reasons than writing. I write well. I know I write well. I shouldn't have to shove my stories in your face with huge banners in my sig line or other despirate means to attract your attention. Sighs... read if you want to read, don't if you don't, you probably won't like it anyway.

[Tiger]

I'm sorry Zilar, I do not agree with this statement. The author should not have to "become visible", the reader should buck up and comment if they read the story. Besides, there are a few of us who are visible, but quietly so, and others who prefer not to attract too much attention (good or bad) for a lot of other reasons than writing. I write well. I know I write well. I shouldn't have to shove my stories in your face with huge banners in my sig line or other despirate means to attract your attention. Sighs... read if you want to read, don't if you don't, you probably won't like it anyway.

Lugh, the good thing is that there are so many types of stories to read. Yours are rather unique. I, for one, am definitely a huge fan of your poetry. I also know that for me there are die-hard fans who can't get enough of my stories. At the end of the day, that makes me feel better about what I do.

[Bandage]

I'm sorry Zilar, I do not agree with this statement. The author should not have to "become visible", the reader should buck up and comment if they read the story. Besides, there are a few of us who are visible, but quietly so, and others who prefer not to attract too much attention (good or bad) for a lot of other reasons than writing. I write well. I know I write well. I shouldn't have to shove my stories in your face with huge banners in my sig line or other despirate means to attract your attention. Sighs... read if you want to read, don't if you don't, you probably won't like it anyway.

 

The reason why I said that Authors should become visible, is the fact that we (potential) readers don't always find these stories! And we can't comment on something we didn't read because we didn't find the story (yet)!

 

You don't need huge banners to attract my and other's attention... But I'll give you an example.. Kevin just started writing his story BMAD. One of the reasons I started reading his story was because I already knew him from the forums, and knew something about how he thinks about certain things and so on...

 

And who said I won't like your stories? I never read one of yours, I don't know what style you write in, and I hope that I can read one in the near future! But like I said before, it's really hard to keep up with all stories posted here!

[Lugh]

The reason why I said that Authors should become visible, is the fact that we (potential) readers don't always find these stories! And we can't comment on something we didn't read because we didn't find the story (yet)!

Herm... there is a line in my sig... there is a forum in the e-fiction forums...

 

You don't need huge banners to attract my and other's attention... But I'll give you an example.. Kevin just started writing his story BMAD. One of the reasons I started reading his story was because I already knew him from the forums, and knew something about how he thinks about certain things and so on...

 

See, and I'm not all over the forums like Kevin. Which is probably why you don't know me. (grinz)

 

 

And who said I won't like your stories? I never read one of yours, I don't know what style you write in, and I hope that I can read one in the near future! But like I said before, it's really hard to keep up with all stories posted here!

 

What do you read? I've written a little of everything. There are over 100 poems of mine in e-fiction and 20+ short stories. I'm sure you will find something you like. If not the link will give you more options.

[Bandage]

Herm... there is a line in my sig... there is a forum in the e-fiction forums...

 

See, and I'm not all over the forums like Kevin. Which is probably why you don't know me. (grinz)

 

What you wrote in your sig is good, it's all we mostly need... But if you don't post (a lot), I won't see it, now would I?

 

 

What do you read? I've written a little of everything. There are over 100 poems of mine in e-fiction and 20+ short stories. I'm sure you will find something you like. If not the link will give you more options.

 

Well, I'm not really into poems, more into stories... But I'll certainly check your site out now that I know it

[steph]

I kind of grew in this subject... At first, after I read a story, I mostly didn't comment. Why? I didn't want to be noticed as a reader, because I was really deep in the closet! (Of course, this applies to the stories on GA)

Nils makes a good point. Due to spam filters for eFic, the reader needs to be logged in to leave a review. This is also true for the forums and sending a PM. I wonder if the read counts in eFic could be seggragated into members (logged in) and guests. I'd be curious to see if the majority of readers are those who are not frequenting the forums are the majority of the readers... thus causing this plea not to hit the right audience either.

[AFriendlyFace]

*tosses out feedback like beads at a Mardi Gras parade*

For what it's worth, I do thank all the authors - and all those involved at GA - for doing what they do.

 

I try to follow the adage: 'Do unto others as you would have them do unto you'. I leave feedback for the stories I read in one form or another. I try not to leave inane comments (ie: 'Thanks for writing'). If that's the comment I wish to make, I elaborate - saying why I'm thanking them.

 

No matter how silly it sounds, I feel obligated to leave some sort of response for the stories I've read. If I'd had to buy it to read it, that in itself would be a response. Since the stories here are free (thank you GA) then leaving a review is the least I can do. The blogs... I guess I'm guilty of not reviewing as much in those because I don't know people. It has a lot to do with RL in that I cannot approach strangers, either. If I feel I 'know' someone, I'll leave a response. Otherwise, I sit and think of what I'd like to say... and don't say it.

 

I just haven't reviewed much lately because I haven't really been in the mood to read.

 

These are my own thoughts, however. I don't mean to push my opinions on anyone.

First of all, great topic, Kevin!

 

I kind of grew in this subject... At first, after I read a story, I mostly didn't comment. Why? I didn't want to be noticed as a reader, because I was really deep in the closet! (Of course, this applies to the stories on GA) But, now that I'm coming to terms with myself, I try to comment on the stories I read. Why? I once wrote a story, got no replies or whatsoever and I just quit it. So I know somewhat how it means to not receive any comments.

 

In a way it is kind of frustrating as well to have all these stories here! And to see that some authors are bummed about not getting any/much comments! And that's because I have other duties and occupations as well, like studying, or going out with friends, going to school, etc... So I can't read every story! And so I can't comment on them! And it frustrates me to no end...

 

I do think, if you want more comments, you still need to sell yourself and your stories... Only then can we notice you really DID write something, and we get curious as to what kind of stories that person writes, and if they're any good, and if it might thrill us to wait for new chapters to be posted! So authors, if you're desperate for comments, become visible!

 

Cheers

 

Niels

 

 

How sweet you both are!

 

And I for one would like to personally say thanks to you both!

 

 

 

Heh... they are among my beta readers... so essentially I should be thanking them! AND I get their comments (sometimes) weeks before a story is posted, so I already know how they feel about it, usually in much more depth than what they post on the forums. What they put up on the forums is usually an attempt to intice others to read (and comment) and knock me out of my post-posted depression.

Ohh, well that does make much more sense then

 

 

I did and I do

I'm still proud that my bad mood brought a lot of comments against me and supporting the necessity to encourage the authors.

I was in a lovely mood all day...and now I'm as grumpy as a wet hen with sunburned feet! (not because of this thread or any of the posters in it) So I should probably go and have my own nap.

 

Nils makes a good point. Due to spam filters for eFic, the reader needs to be logged in to leave a review. This is also true for the forums and sending a PM. I wonder if the read counts in eFic could be seggragated into members (logged in) and guests. I'd be curious to see if the majority of readers are those who are not frequenting the forums are the majority of the readers... thus causing this plea not to hit the right audience either.

I assume that the majority of readers and viewers, regardless of whether we're talking about eFiction, author pages, the archive, or the forums are 'guests'. So I'm just sort of hoping the same guests that view this thread are the ones who read in eFiction.

Edited June 21, 2008 by AFriendlyFace

[Dion]

I was in a lovely mood all day...and now I'm as grumpy as a wet hen with sunburned feet! (not because of this thread or any of the posters in it) So I should probably go and have my own nap.

Do you mean to say you're as grumpy as a wet hen who has sunburned feet? Or that you're as grumpy as a wet hen and you have sunburned feet?

 

You must elaborate for us newbies...

[Graeme]

I for one know I do not get feedback for a variety of reasons -- the main one being my stories are geared to a very narrow audience, and of that audience very few persons wish to admit they LIKE that kind of stuff. That's fine. I accept any and all comments, private or public.

 

I think one big thing that has me way down is that for the last couple anthologies I've written I've gotten almost 0 feedback. And no, Centaur, Rick, Snoopy, NOR the person who volunteers to critique it counts..... that has just bummed me out, so I don't even want to write any more. (I'm sure some of you are applauding, and others are growling, but it's true.)

Since I've done a fair amount of the critiquing of the anthologies recently, I have to object to the highlighted phrase. I review the anthologies because I want to. I'm not a great one for providing feedback personally. There are a few reasons for that. One big one is I've learnt that, as an established author, people seem to place more emphasis in my comments than are warranted. I have to be careful about what I say, because some people seem to think that if I say something, I have to be right (as an aside, I originally wrote that word as write -- which shows you how wrong I can be at times ).

 

Doing the reviews for the anthology stories allows me to encourage authors, while doing it in a way that doesn't place excessive emphasis on what I say. I will say now and publicly, I like Lugh's stories And I think my comments on his stories should count

 

Now, getting back to the matter at hand....

 

Feedback is a personal thing for both the author and the reader. I have recently learnt of an author who does NOT want his stories discussed, except in select forums where he wants them to be discussed. I personally find that weird, but I accept his decision.

 

Other authors like feedback, but aren't fussed too much by its absence. I'm personally in that category. I love feedback when I get it, but I'm not discouraged when I don't. I've heard from other established authors that the quantity of feedback they get decreases the longer they've been around -- readers seem to get the impression that because they've been around longer, feedback is either not needed, or had to be at a sufficiently high level that a 'I liked it' type comment would be unwelcome. While that may be true, that's not usually the case. Almost all authors like feedback -- even the 'I liked it' comments.

 

Some authors crave feedback. These authors need to work on their marketing skills, because to get feedback they need readers, and they need to get their stories noticed above the crowd of other other stories out there. There are a LOT of stories out on the internet. Even here at GA, there is a multitude of stories competing for readers. Without some advertising and marketing, stories can be lost. If you, as an author, desperately desire feedback, you're going to have to work to make sure your story is noticed and read. Sitting back isn't going to do it.

 

From the readers point of view, we are writing in a genre that readers are not as comfortable with responding as they might be in other genres. I know personally that until I accepted myself, I would NOT give any feedback to any stories I read because I was deathly afraid of leaving any trail as to what I had been reading. There is, and probably will be for the foreseeable future,, a certain percentage of readers that are too afraid to leave comments, because of the genre of the stories. Authors have to accept that.

 

Other readers don't want to sound dumb. If they can't think of something more than 'I liked it', they won't leave a comment because they've seen reviews and comments by others that, to them, sound intelligent and insightful. They don't want their comment to be held up in comparison. If an authors still wants to get comments from these readers, they need to encourage them. They need to tell the readers that they're happy to receive those sorts of comments.

 

CJ has touched on the issue of negative comments. An author should try to make it clear if they want these. I personally feel that if they indicate that they do, they'll get more feedback because some people won't comment if they can't point out any negatives. But that's just a personal feeling on the subject -- I don't really know.

 

Good luck, everyone: Readers and Authors alike. This is a touchy subject for a lot of authors, but I don't think it is any easier for a lot of readers. They are scared at offending the person who wrote the stories they like, and would often prefer to remain silent than to risk upsetting someone who has impressed them.

Edited June 21, 2008 by Graeme

[TalonRider]

I agree that it can be a touchy situation with some authors. I for one, like to hear back from the author. Granted, sometimes they maybe busy to do so. But if I write to an author 3 or 4 time, for different chapters, and I don't get a reply, I quit writing and continue to read. There have been times that I wait for the next chapter before I write something.

 

I've written to one author who seemed to pick my email apart every time I wrote to him. I wasn't fond of this of course. After awhile I figured out that that was just the way he is, even in the forums.

 

Then there's the author's that reply each time I write them. I've had many a conversation with one author in particular who happens to write my favorite Sci-fi/Fan story. And he's challenged me many a time to go back find an answer to my own questions.

 

I will occasionally give some feedback to the authors I work with.

[steph]

as an established author, people seem to place more emphasis in my comments than are warranted. I have to be careful about what I say, because some people seem to think that if I say something, I have to be right.

Graeme, it's not only that you're an established author, but that your online personna in the GA forums oozes maturity, intellect, and respect. It's part of what someone mentioned earlier that an author's presence in the forums can affect whether a reader will read and/or review the story. If the author's known as brash, than the reader may be apprehensive about making a comment. For example, before I joined the tech team, I would never have commented on one of Myr's stories, because he comes across as scary and unapproachable (which I've seen learned that he's not).

 

But again, I seem to be shifting blame... I don't mean to. I guess I don't know how to convince readers to leave a review. Partly, making the process easy to do is extremely important. Another part is having the feedback plea at the end of the chapter. This provides readers with guidelines for how the author wants to be approached (email, PM, forum) and what kind of feedback is welcome (criticism, "I've been here" notes).

 

As I mentioned earlier the reader needs to be logged in to leave a review everywhere on GA. It makes it harder to leave anonymous feedback. Had anyone noticed a decrease in feedback with the implementation of spam filters on eFic? Maybe it doesn't matter.

Edited June 21, 2008 by steph291

[kitten]

I agree that it can be a touchy situation with some authors. I for one, like to hear back from the author. Granted, sometimes they maybe busy to do so. But if I write to an author 3 or 4 time, for different chapters, and I don't get a reply, I quit writing and continue to read.

 

As far as I know most authors welcome feedback. Therefore unless an author specifically requests that readers don't send him comments then I think the odds are that they do want them. Many authors (e.g. me) specifically state that they welcome feedback.

 

Okay, everyone knows what an opinionated person I am but... in my opinion any author who does not want feedback should specifically say so. Any author who does not specifically say that they don't want comments and who then does not respond to comments is an ill-mannered sob and obviously has no idea how to behave in a civilised society.

 

Kit

[AFriendlyFace]

Do you mean to say you're as grumpy as a wet hen who has sunburned feet? Or that you're as grumpy as a wet hen and you have sunburned feet?

 

You must elaborate for us newbies...

 

I meant the former

 

 

I'm feeling much better now

[GaryK]

I agree that it can be a touchy situation with some authors. I for one, like to hear back from the author. Granted, sometimes they maybe busy to do so. But if I write to an author 3 or 4 time, for different chapters, and I don't get a reply, I quit writing and continue to read. There have been times that I wait for the next chapter before I write something.

I'm a little bit like you Jan. Except for the part about continuing to read the stories. I once wrote to a prominent author on GA who encourages feedback several times (once after each chapter) praising their story. I never got a reply. I was so disappointed that I lost all interest in their stories.

 

So, my tip of the day is, if you're going to actively solicit feedback please have the decency to send a reply to your readers.

 

Much like short reviews even something simple like "thanks" would have made my day and turned me into a huge fan.

[NaperVic]

...Except for the part about continuing to read the stories. I once wrote to a prominent author on GA who encourages feedback several times (once after each chapter) praising their story. I never got a reply. I was so disappointed that I lost all interest in their stories.

 

So, my tip of the day is, if you're going to actively solicit feedback please have the decency to send a reply to your readers.

 

Much like short reviews even something simple like "thanks" would have made my day and turned me into a huge fan.

 

Hi Gary,

 

This strikes me as odd. Are you saying that you rate stories and whether you'd continue to read them based off of how and whether an author replies to your feedback?

 

I guess I see the stories and how an author interacts with their readers as two separate entities. Like Jan, if a story is good, I'll continue to read it. It doesn't matter to me if the author is an engaging one or not. Heck, the author could be a conceited SOB but if the story is good, it's good

 

If an author is a nice guy and one of his/her stories isn't interesting to me, I won't continue to read it.

 

Regards,

 

Vic

[GaryK]

This strikes me as odd. Are you saying that you rate stories and whether you'd continue to read them based off of how and whether an author replies to your feedback?

Perhaps I am an anomaly Vic. If I'm mad at/disappointed with an author I can't get past that and enjoy his stories.

 

Fortunately there are lots of other authors to choose from and they've all acknowledged my comments. Perhaps none more so than Kit. He's an example every author should seek to emulate when it comes to reader feedback. He's never failed to reply to a PM. He's actively engaged in his forum and enjoys a lively debate. He writes great stories for a more mature audience. What more could I ask for? I'm sure there are lots of examples like Kit (and CJ ), but only having been here a few months (wow it seems like so much longer) I think I've only scratched the surface of what GA has to offer.