Canuk

perhaps no hanky-panky, but have you seen the shower-on-deck scene.... Ioan Griffud is to bloody die for..... also there is a fair amount of fanfic about that puts the hanky-panky back where the BBC (and Forester!) obviously edited it out!

I am sorry, but no matter how poor I have been, I never got to the point of having to do a cost/benefit on the lube I use! (I suppose if one were poor enough one would make do with spit'n'passion - fortunately I never was that poor!!)

i think "refudiate" is a Palin-ism???? and that, for me, puts it out of contention as a word Oxford or no Oxford

"The elephant in the room had found a place to hide".......

editing George Grainger is my fantasy........

excellent points " you can only attempt to help someone so often before you just become a facilitator for their poor choices" is particularly valid in this instance. I suppose the ultimate question is how do you force a person to "know thyself"..... not possible, I fear

I agree with you ..... as I said elsewhere, punish the bastard for being the evil dickwit he is, but treating him worse than a dog...... not nice, not civilised and it just lowers you to his level.

not the feeling I was trying to express. There is no doubt that Bard et al are the victims of a truly screwed up Brian. The point I was trying to make was that by seeking physical revenge, the family show themselves to be little better than him. I was trying to suggest that by isolating Brian from the family, ensuring he has no ability to do further mischief, but ensuring his physical well-being (a Napoleon-at-StHelena scenario) they would show themselves to be bigger than he is.

Sorry, can't agree with the treatment of Brian. Yep he is evil, bad, wicked and deserves considerable time in purgatory /hell or where ever he feels least comfortable, but to deprive him of all human comforts and sustenance brings them all down to his level. By all means work out some level of separation from the family and deprivation of all the things he enjoys, but to tip him into the gutter and leave him there is small minded vindictiveness. I would have thought Brad and the rest of the family were bigger than that.

so Granger has a toy!!! the multilingual Carlos. jeez Mark all you do is play with our fantasies, but you do it soooooo well. I'm in lust:devil: All that said, I get the feeling that at some point in the future Grainger's luck is going to run out, or at least partially run out and it's going to take all the talents of his wonderful wife and political contacts to save him......

thank god it's oran, way more interesting than the sins of onan.......

if he looks half as good as Devlin, he'd do me (or vice versa, as the case and opportunity demands)

M'writer85, you're such a romantic!!!! Your comments on his chances at the winter olympics '02 are spot on. He's too young in his head when up against some of the hard'asses in competition ice

not sure the link works outside the US...... or is it just me?

The issue I have with statements made by Preachers such as those in the link is that the Preacher inserts the word "God" where he means "I". Reread with that change and the bigot really shines.....

unfortuantely I can't see the image.....

Awesome! bliss!!! many many thanks....

I think that one key is that children/young adults need to have an established relationship with a person (ideally their parent(s)) where there is a "tradition" of free, frank and open communication. then, should bullying (or anything else) occur there is already somewhere to go. If there is no established relationship, then trying to start one in the midst of a crisis is difficult-verging-on-impossible. I made it quite clear to my two boys that they could talk about ANYTHING with me and I repeated this again and again ad infinitum. I thought my eldest put it quite succinctly to a mate who had just crashed his father's car and they had come to me to work out what to do - my boy's comment was that the only thing worse than telling me what they had done would be not telling me! from a parents perspective it is impossible to protect your children from everything, but it is essential that you are there when they want you and they have to know that you will be there then.

M'writer85, I have to disagree tho' I understand where it is possible to get the impression that JP's "softened". JP seems to be as inward focussed as ever however as he is not now the focus of the last few chapters we only seem him when he does interact, or more appropriatly he is forced to interact with others. This, to me, shows JP to be the same as ever with only the slightest of changes due to age and his expanding family. He is the same great mate, awful acquaintance and truly scary enemy he has always been.

frankly, I am just sorry I asked........:wacko:

OK so we have sorted out the cuffing.... but why Alfredo sauce?

I realise that in certain parts of the world "taking people out" or "whacking" them is still an option, however I would hope that JP is able to come up with a far more intelligent response to this man's villianry.... I think punishments where people have the rest of their lives to reflect on the decisions they made is a FAR better result than a simple period to said life.....

and you wouldn't think it would be hard to be like that. After all, what he has done is accepted his own child for what she is. How hard is that?

the high percentage of condom use among the young fits in with the annecdotal evidence of my two sons (now 23 & 26) and their friends /cohort. I am not sure whether it was school, friends, or the attempts by their father to guide them , but I am astounded by the level of understanding of the need for protection, the dangers of drink-driving and issues around recreational drugs. Now neither of my boys are angels (far bloody from it), but them and their mates seem to have a FAR more mature approach to these issues than, dare I say it, I did at that age. it does give me some hope for the future......

in my own situation, even with the benefit of hindsight, I am not sure what I knew about myself and when I knew it. . As a 12-14 year old I recall be fascinated by greek and roman sculptures of naked men. but then I used to thoroughly enjoy going to "dancing classes" (I went to a single sex school, dancing classes and french conversation clases were done with the girls school on the next hill). through the latter part of senior school a girl I had known since kindergarten and I were considered a "couple". When at university (in a different city) I had brief physical relationships with both sexes (while maintaining the "relationship" with the girl "back home"). I considered myself straight....I think, if in fact I thought about it at all. at the end of university I married a girl , we had two children. we bought a small business that after 5 years became a real stressor, causing the marriage to fail. six month after seperating I was picked up by a bloke in a coffee shop and had a 4 year affair with him (bloody disasterous, abusive relationship) at that point I figured I must be gay. 11 years ago I met my current partner and we have lived happily ever since. Now when did I think I was gay? not sure. The only thing I insist is I am NOT "bisexual"; at this point in time i am not attracted to women in any shape or form. For all the time I was married (to the mother of my children) I was never attracted to any man..... I never announced to the world I was gay on facebook or any other medium (I did tell my mother a year or so into my first gay realtionship, however as we were trying to fix a photocopier at the time, she replied that that was fine, but it wouldn't help fix the photocopier!) "knowing" when I was gay - I really don't know....... and I am not sure it matters, to me anyway.....