Let the Music Play, Chapter 36

[wildone]

Hey Lurker, Welcome as well !!

 

It looks like you may have a lot of valuable input to keep our resident goat on his toes (hooves).

 

You do bring up an interesting point. CJ's last chapter said this:

 

Downtown Toowoomba had no warning. The first effect to arrive was the burning flash of the heat pulse. All flammable objects within three miles and in line-of-sight of the fireball burst into flame. People out in the open were no exception; their clothes ignited. The heat pulse also inflicted third-degree burns on exposed skin. The only mercy was that those within two miles of the bomb did not have long to suffer. Following on the heels of the heat pulse, the shockwave from the blast roared through the city at supersonic velocity, followed by winds in excess of five-hundred miles an hour. The initial shockwave was enough to shatter most of the structures in its path and the winds behind it turned the rubble into a burning maelstrom of death and destruction. No one within two miles of the blast survived. Further out, survival would depend on happenstance, though for those downwind, the living would soon envy the dead.

 

Now I know that J/S and Dimitri were twenty miles away, but I was wondering with the nuclear blast moving at five hundred miles an hour, were they safe at twenty miles?

Edited April 26, 2008 by wildone

[Bondwriter]

Now I know that J/S and Dimitri were twenty miles away, but I was wondering with the nuclear blast moving at five hundred miles an hour, were they safe at twenty miles?

Yes, I didn't wonder about this EMP issue Lurker brought up, that Benji said is of no concern, but I thought that The Scar and Dimitri were quite close to the explosion to be completely safe (we just had news last year of illnesses of military personnel who attended the nuclear testing in the Sahara and the Pacific). Of course, a fictional villain has to witness his crime, if only to utter the eponymous phrase the author had kept planned for him.

[GaryK]

So far CJ has remained firmly rooted in reality. To believe The Scar and Dimitri would be totally safe would require some willing suspension of disbelief.

 

That's why I mentioned that while EMP would not be a problem at 20 miles out, fallout could well be a problem depending upon the prevailing winds and how quickly the two of them got out of the area. Keep in mind these bombs were relatively low-yield and designed to inflict most of their damage via radioactive fallout.

 

Wouldn't it be ironic for The Scar to go through all this only to wind up dying from radiation-induced cancer?

[C James]

C James,

 

You have obviously done a lot of research here. And so far as I can tell, everything has been quite accurate. But I see the potential for a huge technical error in forthcoming chapters.

 

Have you considered EMP: Electromagnetic Pulse?

 

A nuclear blast sets off an EMP. An EMP, among other things, destroys any electronic device within range that is not properly shielded to a military level, which includes pretty much any civilian electronic device. An EMP is sort of like the inverse of a Neutron bomb. It disables anything electronic, but has no direct effect on people or animals. Things like cellular phones, computers, radios, TVs, would all stop working, instantly. And an EMP has a range much farther than the initial damaging blast.

 

Airplanes would fall out of the sky (except for shielded military aircraft, or older entirely mechanical aircraft that don't rely on electronics of any kind). The Scar's cell phone, laptop, and Range Rover would all cease to function. No way would he be flying out of Australia any time soon.

 

I'm no expert on EMP, so I could be off a bit here. What I vaguely remember was from papers describing the effects of a hypothetical airburst nuclear device detonated at a higher altitude. At a high altitude, an EMP wave would cover the entire continent of Australia. I know the effects would be considerably less from a ground-level detonation.

 

Nevertheless, I believe the Scar will be walking to Brisbane, not driving his now-dead Land Rover. (If he had an older, pre-electronic Rover, say earlier than 1970, he'd be fine.)

 

If you have already taken this into consideration in future chapters, or if my understanding of EMP is completely wrong, please forgive my intrusion.

 

Welcome, Lurker!!

 

Thank you for raising an excellent point! I did indeed consider EMP, but EMP effects are mainly caused by gamma and x-ray radiation causing a free-electron cascade. The optimal location for this is at very high altitude (over 10 miles but under 170)

At that altitude, you can have massive EMP effects for enormous areas (over a thousand miles across)

Wikipedia has an article on it here that is mostly accurate.

 

Generally speaking, EMP affects electronics in direct proportion to the exposure surface area. However, you can shiled electronics quite easily; placing them in a metal box (assuming the box is insulated from its contents) is one way (assuming they have no external components such as power leads or antena). Even foil would suffice. For something the size of a cell phone, the receiving area is so small that it would likly be unharmed even by a edge-of-space massive EMP.

 

The Land Rover's electronic ignition would be more vulnerable, but at twenty miles from a one hundred killoton ground burst, my guess is it would be unaffected. The EMP at that range would be real, but quite weak (from a ground burst). If the detonation had occured in the stratosphere of higher, you are quite right, the EMP damage would have been over an enormous area.

 

And thank you very much for joining us, and this is certainly not intrusion, but rather a point I'm delighted to see. (and the same would be true if I'd made a technical goof; that's how i learn.

 

Yes, I didn't wonder about this EMP issue Lurker brought up, that Benji said is of no concern, but I thought that The Scar and Dimitri were quite close to the explosion to be completely safe (we just had news last year of illnesses of military personnel who attended the nuclear testing in the Sahara and the Pacific). Of course, a fictional villain has to witness his crime, if only to utter the eponymous phrase the author had kept planned for him.

 

I originally had them at 30 miles, but after mulling it over decided that twenty would be safe enough.

 

 

So far CJ has remained firmly rooted in reality. To believe The Scar and Dimitri would be totally safe would require some willing suspension of disbelief.

 

That's why I mentioned that while EMP would not be a problem at 20 miles out, fallout could well be a problem depending upon the prevailing winds and how quickly the two of them got out of the area. Keep in mind these bombs were relatively low-yield and designed to inflict most of their damage via radioactive fallout.

 

Wouldn't it be ironic for The Scar to go through all this only to wind up dying from radiation-induced cancer?

 

Hey Lurker, Welcome as well !!

 

It looks like you may have a lot of valuable input to keep our resident goat on his toes (hooves).

 

You do bring up an interesting point. CJ's last chapter said this:

 

 

 

Now I know that J/S and Dimitri were twenty miles away, but I was wondering with the nuclear blast moving at five hundred miles an hour, were they safe at twenty miles?

 

Yep. The blast wave would diminish with distance, massively. It could knock down a building at a mile, but not even break a window at 5 miles. We'll see what the effects are at twenty miles.

 

Yes, I didn't wonder about this EMP issue Lurker brought up, that Benji said is of no concern, but I thought that The Scar and Dimitri were quite close to the explosion to be completely safe (we just had news last year of illnesses of military personnel who attended the nuclear testing in the Sahara and the Pacific). Of course, a fictional villain has to witness his crime, if only to utter the eponymous phrase the author had kept planned for him.

 

The biggest danger (not counting fallout) at that distance would be being blinded by the flash if they were looking directly at it. That's why they turned around. The personel who have been affected would have either been far closer, or would have been affected by fallout rather than the blast itself.

 

So far CJ has remained firmly rooted in reality. To believe The Scar and Dimitri would be totally safe would require some willing suspension of disbelief.

 

That's why I mentioned that while EMP would not be a problem at 20 miles out, fallout could well be a problem depending upon the prevailing winds and how quickly the two of them got out of the area. Keep in mind these bombs were relatively low-yield and designed to inflict most of their damage via radioactive fallout.

 

Wouldn't it be ironic for The Scar to go through all this only to wind up dying from radiation-induced cancer?

 

The fallout issue is why Dimitri checked the weather for wind direction. For the sake of simplicity I omitted the fact that he'd also be wise to check high-altitude winds (which are often different in direction from surface ones) but he did check the winds and basically the wind is to the north, and they are to the south.

 

To give an idea of the safe distances, many of the observers at the Bikini and Nevada test sites observed tests from five miles away. Most of the resulting health damage came from the fallout, not the blast itself.

 

Another example is the Castle Bravo test. Some observers, out in the open, were less than 25 miles from it. The test (the first test of a solid-furled (Lithium-deuteride) thermonuclear, was expected to yield around four megatons. However, due to an oversight on the calculations (A reaction was missed) the yield was 15 megatons. The fireball alone was four miles wide, but it was survivable at 25 miles, *IF* you weren't in the fallout. (and even for most of those that were). To give an idea of the size difference here, the device in LTMP is 102 Kilotons, and Castle Bravo was 15 megatons (15,000 kilotons, a megaton is 1000 kilotons).

CJ

[Lurker241]

Ah. Well, I'm glad you have taken EMP into consideration, and have obviously researched it more than I have. I was just going from memory regarding EMP, and didn't realize there was that great a difference between a higher altitude detonation and a ground level detonation. I was in the Navy many years ago, and just remember that all of our electronic equipment had to be shielded against EMP.

 

Carry on. :-) I'll look forward to future chapters.

[Benji]

Yes, I didn't wonder about this EMP issue Lurker brought up, that Benji said is of no concern, but I thought that The Scar and Dimitri were quite close to the explosion to be completely safe (we just had news last year of illnesses of military personnel who attended the nuclear testing in the Sahara and the Pacific). Of course, a fictional villain has to witness his crime, if only to utter the eponymous phrase the author had kept planned for him.

 

 

.............I said what?? Where??

[wildone]

In hopefully less than 24 hours, Fire in The Sky should be released by our Nucleoitumaniac.

 

Anyone else nervous after that last chapter?

 

We all know that the titles are usually something different than what is spelled out in it, but what do you think Fire in the Sky refers to.

 

I might be the other two bombs going off in the US, although up to last week I would never expected the goat to kill off that many innocents, he has proven that he can, and he will.

 

I guess another possibility is that the plane that is carrying Brandon, Chase, Eric, Jon, Helen (Barbara and Joe??) and Gunter blows up in the sky .

 

The most pressing issue in my mind though is the poor goose. How is Mario going to use a goose? Be forewarned CJ, if you harm, maim or kill any Canadian (or animal associated with Canada) in your story, well I"ll...I'll...

Edited April 28, 2008 by wildone

[Benji]

In hopefully less than 24 hours, Fire in The Sky should be released by our Nucleoitumaniac.

 

Anyone else nervous after that last chapter?

 

We all know that the titles are usually something different than what is spelled out in it, but what do you think Fire in the Sky refers to.

 

I might be the other two bombs going off in the US, although up to last week I would never expected the goat to kill off that many innocents, he has proven that he can, and he will.

 

......Doubt that scenairo! If he did his bargaining chips are gone!

 

I guess another possibility is that the plane that is carrying Brandon, Chase, Eric, Jon, Helen (Barbara and Joe??) and Gunter blows up in the sky .

 

.........That would be tacky, and a cliffhanger, which the goat never does

 

The most pressing issue in my mind though is the poor goose. How is Mario going to use a goose? Be forewarned CJ, if you harm, maim or kill any Canadian (or animal associated with Canada) in your story, well I"ll...I'll...

 

 

..........Canadian or not WTF is with a goose??

[Bondwriter]

.............I said what?? Where??

Oops, sorry, this was Gary. No offense, hopefully...

[Drewbie]

If a newer truck, car or any electronic device is turned off and a emp is let activated, wouldn't the electronic system be safe?

[Benji]

If a newer truck, car or any electronic device is turned off and a emp is let activated, wouldn't the electronic system be safe?

 

 

.........Good question!! But I'm not even sure if Scar & Dimetri were able to escape the EMP blast from their distance. Vlad did such a great job, the yield was more than they had hoped for, unfortunately so was the EMP's perimeter.

[C James]

Ah. Well, I'm glad you have taken EMP into consideration, and have obviously researched it more than I have. I was just going from memory regarding EMP, and didn't realize there was that great a difference between a higher altitude detonation and a ground level detonation. I was in the Navy many years ago, and just remember that all of our electronic equipment had to be shielded against EMP.

 

Carry on. :-) I'll look forward to future chapters.

 

Thanks!! And you're very much correct; military gear has to be hardened and that inclues isolation switches, etc.

 

 

In hopefully less than 24 hours, Fire in The Sky should be released by our Nucleoitumaniac.

 

Anyone else nervous after that last chapter?

 

We all know that the titles are usually something different than what is spelled out in it, but what do you think Fire in the Sky refers to.

 

I might be the other two bombs going off in the US, although up to last week I would never expected the goat to kill off that many innocents, he has proven that he can, and he will.

 

I guess another possibility is that the plane that is carrying Brandon, Chase, Eric, Jon, Helen (Barbara and Joe??) and Gunter blows up in the sky .

 

The most pressing issue in my mind though is the poor goose. How is Mario going to use a goose? Be forewarned CJ, if you harm, maim or kill any Canadian (or animal associated with Canada) in your story, well I"ll...I'll...

 

Fire in the Sky will be posted soon. (an hour ago is soon, right?) I just haven't announced it yet. It's a large chapter, larger than 36, twice normal size.

 

If a newer truck, car or any electronic device is turned off and a emp is let activated, wouldn't the electronic system be safe?

 

Yes, no, and maybe. The area of metal that's part of the circuit (the vehicle body in this case) is large enough to cause major trouble. So, the best answer I can give is a guess; the vehicle being off would make it more resistant to EMP, but a strong EMP might still do damage. I'm guessing here, but I think the ground circuit from the electronics would conduct part of the received pulse.