Thaw And Frost By Puppilull

[LitLover]

Am I leading him astray? The drama siren calling seductively...? 

 

Hmmm you could be a bad influence

[Puppilull]

Hmmm you could be a bad influence

 

Oh, so nothing new then... LOL 

[LitLover]

Oh, so nothing new then... LOL 

 

You have to go with your strengths

[Puppilull]

You have to go with your strengths

 

The road to success! 

[Timothy M.]

Am I leading him astray? The drama siren calling seductively...? 

 

Hmmm you could be a bad influence

 

Oh, so nothing new then... LOL 

 

You have to go with your strengths

 

out of likes so      

 

Oh and I'm not excusing Lucas, hell no Talk about Unforgivable   I'm just searching for explanations.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Timothy M.

[Timothy M.]

Ha, ha! Tim, you make me sound like such a review hound!

 

Ehm, no, I think I make me sound like a review hound...

 

Ooops, sorry, I called Mason Matt in my review

my excuse is it's after midnight here. I need

Edited June 2, 2016 by Timothy M.

[LitLover]

 

Oh and I'm not excusing Lucas, hell no Talk about Unforgivable   I'm just searching for explanations.

 

Oh, I'm sure envy and jealousy that he doesn't know what's going on in Joel's life has something to do with it... I just don't think either are an acceptable excuse for that kind of accusation and Lucas needs a smack upside the head.  

Edited June 2, 2016 by LitLover

[Timothy M.]

Oh, I'm sure envy and jealousy that he doesn't know what's going on in Joel's life has something to do with it... I just don't think either are an acceptable excuse for that kind of accusation and Lucas needs a smack upside the head.  

 

yup, we're sharpening the pitchforks

[spike382]

out of likes so      

 

Oh and I'm not excusing Lucas, hell no Talk about Unforgivable   I'm just searching for explanations.

There may be an explanation, and I've theorized as much in my review, I just hope that's not the case. But I got a vibe from the way certain sentences were phrased, that leads me to believe that. Perhaps I'm way off, and Puppilull didn't intend that at all or its misdirection. Either way, Lucas is acting like a major dick, and it's sadly gotten to the point where I don't like him anymore. If this is how he was before Thaw, than it's unfortunate that all the character growth he made in that story is being undone by one stupid and ultimately meaningless court case.

[Puppilull]

OK, I know you all are just mad at Lucas and are ventilating your frustration, brought on by me...(Bad author!) But wy lawyer soul couldn't help but get its knickers in a twist. 

 

I feel a little more background is needed and I realize I have perhaps been too myopic as to general knowledge of a lawyer's life. Here's the thing. Lucas is 27-ish, just starting out in his career. He's worked for a few years, and he is still trying to find his way as a lawye in that rather cut throat environment. The firm he works for isn't the biggest or the best, but it's up-and-coming. So Lucas wants to make an impression and be the best he can be. He's good, but he's no wiz kid. He has to work for it.

 

Right now, Lucas and perhaps the firm too have bitten off more than they can chew. It's sink or swim at this point and they all want to swim... Working so much and usually so close with people you form a certain loyalty, not only to the firm but also to the client. So for Lucas, this case is anything but meaningless or stupid. It's a defining moment in his career. If they pull this off and win, he will be someone. He will have made an impression. The pressure is on. So while Lucas is being a shitty boyfriend, to me he's not evil incarnate. 

 

Hmm... Ranting in my own thread. Maybe I need to revise the story instead...? But I didn't want to get all "Court drama of the week" and bore you all to death with too much detail. Perhaps a Lucas POV chapter would have been good, but Frost turned out to be Joel's story. It would have broken the flow to do it as I did in Thaw. For some reason. I seem to have zero control over the voices in my head... I write what they tell me. 

[spike382]

I'm not a lawyer personally, so I'm not an expert by any means but I have known a few over the years. Granted most of the ones I know are men with families, and none of them were freshman attorneys except one. I know that they (like many people staring careers) have had to sacrifice a lot in the beginning to breed success. Dedication and hard work should be commended as far as I'm concerned. The lawyers I have known have done that, but not to the exclusion of all else. They also appeared to have fairly stable relationships (at least from the outside).

 

A good partner would presumably be understanding that there will be late nights and so forth. I think Joel has been more then flexible and understanding in this respect. But from the way the story is written, this is more than just someone working hard and being stressed. Lucas has completely checked out of his relationship. It's not about him being evil, it's about him being completely wrapped up in only himself and his work and nothing and no one else matters.

[Timothy M.]

Lack of time to be with Joel is not the problem, but the lack of attention to his partner is. Plus I'm sure Lucas would be able to work much more efficient if he had half an hour of relaxing time every evening, where he shared a meal with Joel and listened to him, rather than think abot the case or talk to Pierce on the phone. Like he did one evening with good results.

None of us begrudge Lucas the chance to make an impact or chide him for working hard, but his neglect of Joel has reached unforgivable levels. Should I go find quotes from your own text to prove my point ? In the latest chapter Lucas didn't even look at Joel most of the time !

[Puppilull]

I guess we all have different tolerance levels for when enough is enough, as in I'm breaking up with you. Lucas has been negligent and totally absorbed in his work for the past few months. My guess is he doesn't realise just how much and how it's affecting Joel (who isn't doing very much to clear things up, as is his nature...). At this point, his focus is due to circumstances elsewhere. Should he realise this? Yes, preferably soon. Will he? I guess we'll see.

 

Stress does different things to different people. Doing what is best isn't necessarily what you actually end up doing... Is that unforgivable?

 

Then the whole argument at the end is a different thing... Not good.

[LitLover]

I've worked with and for lawyers for a long time and I do understand that some cases can be extremely time consuming. I've even known lawyers (mostly articling students and juniors) who've had to sleep on the couch in their office and have a friend or significant other bring them a change of clothes the next day.  For me, the lack of physical time spent together isn't my issue.  Well that's not entirely true... I don't think Lucas adequately prepared Joel for the time commitment he was facing.  To be fair, he may not have realized how much time would be spent, so I'm willing to let that one go.  

 

My issue with Lucas, as I said, is not with the lack of physical time spent together, it's the mental 'check out' he's done since they've been in New York.  Especially in this last chapter, Joel has tried to tell Lucas how he feels, and has made efforts to involve him in his life, but Lucas's behaviour tells me he just isn't interested.  Joel talks, and Lucas doesn't look up from his phone.  He comes in talking about some 'bitch' at the office with Pierce, but can't spare 5 minutes of one on one for his boyfriend that same day.  There is such a thing as feeling like you're alone in a room while sitting next to someone, and that's where Joel is right now.  There are times Lucas might physically be there, but not mentally.  After a while that will wear on any relationship.

 

I have a friend who married a truck driver.  They actually 'saw' each other face to face maybe one and a half days a week... sometimes less, but they made an effort to talk, and catch up on their lives for at least 10 minutes every day.  They have one of the happiest relationships I've ever seen.  With Joel, I think he would have been satisfied with 10 minutes every couple of days, as long as he had Lucas's full attention during that time.  The fact that, after all of those weeks, Lucas still didn't know about Mason and about the time Joel was spending with him is very telling about Lucas's priorities.  It doesn't take much to let your partner know they still hold an important place in your life, even if you can't be there physically as much as you would like.  

 

About Lucas wanting to make an impression and a name for himself in his career.  That's great, if he was staying... but he's told Joel that this is only for six months.  Would anyone care in Sweden if Lucas worked all night a few times, and worked his ass off on a file for a firm they've never heard of?

[LitLover]

Stress does different things to different people. Doing what is best isn't necessarily what you actually end up doing... Is that unforgivable?

 

 

The unforgivable part for me didn't have anything to do with Lucas's neglect of the relationship.  Neglect can be always be fixed if its caught and a real effort is made to rectify that neglect.  Unforgivable was the insinuation that Joel would even contemplate touching a sixteen year old.  As Def said in her review.. this is Joel, he's one of the good guys.  

Edited June 3, 2016 by LitLover

[Puppilull]

The unforgivable part for me didn't have anything to do with Lucas's neglect of the relationship.  Neglect can be always be fixed if its caught and a real effort is made to rectify that neglect.  Unforgivable was the insinuation that Joel would even contemplate touching a sixteen year old.  As Def said in her review.. this is Joel, he's one of the good guys.

 

Yes, that was not Lucas' finest moment...

[Timothy M.]

Hmm, reading the ending once more, I wonder whether Lucas simply meant to say that it wasn't appropiate for Mason to be in their place with only Joel as company. Perhaps he worried about Mason having a crush on Joel and eventually throwing himself at the innocent Swede, makng him freak out?

 

Of course, the really important part is what happens next. Does Joel rush after Mason - which might prevent an ugly scene between the two men? Does Lucas wake up to the fact he's overstepped and join Joel in catching up with the boy, and apologize to both of them for overreacting?

 

skriva snabbt, snälla Puppi

[Puppilull]

Pleading with me in Swedish! You must be desperate. LOL But will Sister Sweden be considerate of your begging...? You know what to say...

 

Chapter is practically done. Perhaps a little tweaking needed after reviews.

[spike382]

Hmm, reading the ending once more, I wonder whether Lucas simply meant to say that it wasn't appropiate for Mason to be in their place with only Joel as company. Perhaps he worried about Mason having a crush on Joel and eventually throwing himself at the innocent Swede, makng him freak out?

 

Of course, the really important part is what happens next. Does Joel rush after Mason - which might prevent an ugly scene between the two men? Does Lucas wake up to the fact he's overstepped and join Joel in catching up with the boy, and apologize to both of them for overreacting?

 

skriva snabbt, snälla Puppi

I'd almost be willing to believe that if not for this line from Lucas, "Well, what do you expect me to think? I come home to find some lost boy sleeping in my office... And find out he’s been hanging out with you, all alone at night!”

 

It really seems like there isn't any other way to take that.

[Timothy M.]

I'd almost be willing to believe that if not for this line from Lucas, "Well, what do you expect me to think? I come home to find some lost boy sleeping in my office... And find out he’s been hanging out with you, all alone at night!”

 

It really seems like there isn't any other way to take that.

 

No, it seems quite obvious.

but it's just so hard to believe Lucas would genuinely suspect Joel of molesting a teen. 

Pleading with me in Swedish! You must be desperate. LOL But will Sister Sweden be considerate of your begging...? You know what to say...

 

  I know...

Edited June 3, 2016 by Timothy M.

[LitLover]

I'd almost be willing to believe that if not for this line from Lucas, "Well, what do you expect me to think? I come home to find some lost boy sleeping in my office... And find out he’s been hanging out with you, all alone at night!”

 

It really seems like there isn't any other way to take that.

 

No, I tried to see it as a misunderstanding, but that was the line that did it for me too.  

[spike382]

It goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway, all this drama makes for a pretty good story. I mean look how much we talk about it.

[LitLover]

It goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway, all this drama makes for a pretty good story. I mean look how much we talk about it.

 

That's true... we wouldn't care about the characters if the story wasn't good 

[Puppilull]

Now you're making me blush...

[glitteryantlers]

Now you're making me blush...

You can blush?