Timothy M.

Except I'm NOT talking about IQ at all. I'm talking about their emotional and social development and maturity, not their book learning intelligence. Very bright kids can solve mathematical problems but they're still kids without the mental experience to handle the hard choices and adversity of life. And just like alcohol pot is often used to escape from difficult situations. 'It soothes you or loosens you up.' Well, this sort of praise should tell you all about the influence on your emotional capacities. And I'm not saying I have a problem with the characters in CAP using pot. After all they do a lot of other stupid stuff too, which is usually what creates the drama.

and how do you know they aren't ? Seems to me a lot of the things wrong with the world today can be attributed to a bunch of old men being ruled by things other than their minds. and US politics and media comes across like the descriptions of high school I constantly read on GA. Not that it's any better over here.

Except I seem to recall that research has shown you stop aging mentally and emotionally if you smoke pot frequently. Thus while it may be no more harmful to adults than alcohol, for teens it can have devastating results. A thirteen year old guy smoking pot regularly may grow older in body but his mind will be forever at the maturity of early adolescens. And no matter how much your readers disagree about Will, I'm sure we all shudder at the thought of his mind never maturing beyond his present state emotionally and otherwise. Edited to add: This caught my eye after I posted.

I know you're right, Mark, but now you're scaring me. Wish I'd never brought it up.

What do you mean 'in Granger's time' ? It's still that way ! Even in tolerant Scandinavia.

As far as I recall Caroline cannot have any more children. Something about the last birth doing damage. However, nothing is certain and she might get pregnant but be unable to deliver the child. Could be another chance for Dr. Jack to the rescue

Ah so this was the secret Caroline was too embarrassed to reveal. Oh well at least George had a great time during his bath with Treadwell. Hope they become friends and George forgives his wife.

My guess is she let slip that George likes to be intimate with men. Maybe intentionally because she hopes Treadwell will keep him happy at sea. Afterwards she may have regretted as she realised her husband might be furious. I expect to be completely wrong, I usually am when it comes to figuring out Mark's complicated schemes

I suddenly recognized this story I've read the main one somewhere else, but it's a while ago, so now I can't remember what happened after this. Hope you'll eventually post the story of Jeremy and the other guys in the house here too. It was a relief, Paul got rescued, I was feeling sorry for him. But also annoyed he didn't realize what was happening with the photo sessions - and that the guys were doing something so illegal he could blackmail them back. But I suppose he's not trusting of police or other authorities. And threathening to expose them might have put him in danger.

Poor Brad having to choose between Sean and Kevin, not an easy decision. But knowing the twisted ways of your tales, Mark, he may end up with neither. Oh well as long as both guys help build Brad's confidence and fuel his libido, I won't complain. I'd forgotten how much fun a Brad on the pwowl is

I wondered why Will didn't tell or remind Tony to keep his relationship with Zach a secret. It is obvious to everyone how important it is not to say anything to destroy Zach's football career?

True. However, when you don't acknowledge people who make an effort to state when they agree with you or think you're right about something, and you ignore any reasonable arguments they make and rarely seem to accept anyone else's point of view, but prefer to latch on to anything that will let you go on telling them how wrong they are and how only you know what's going on, you shouldn't really be surprised that people consider you unreasonable and annoying. I'm sure you do not act like this on purpose, but it's how the other part in the conversation feels. So I've learnt my lesson and will stay away from any discussion you're involved in from now on. Quite right, I'm waiting to see him emerge too (as I've already said earlier). Over and out.

Sorry to contradict you, but Cody found Barry: quote from ch 11: Cody had done some research and helped Zach find a guy who specialized in high school athletes. His name was Barry Friedman, and he had all kinds of good references. He’d latched onto Zach in a heartbeat, which spoke volumes about how talented Zach was. Wally just hired him - or so he thinks, but later we learn that Barry works for and is paid by Zach.

As a matter of fact I was saying the exact opposite: that there was NO definite evidence of this being a plot, nor ANY way of telling whether the camp was important or not. The contradictions I was thinking of are these: Excerpts from the conversation with Will: That was Barry. There’s an exhibition that he wants me to go to. It runs from July 20th to the 25th.” “Tell him you can’t go,” I said, throwing down the gauntlet. “I tried to tell him that, but this one is pretty important,” he said nervously. -o- “Those fucking idiots think one exhibition is worth more than that? Colleges look at more than just how well you run. They look at your brain too.” “Barry knows that,” he said. “He thinks this one is that important.” -o- “This is a really important exhibition.” “Right,” I said sarcastically. “You telling me that Barry didn’t know about this deal before now? He’s supposed to know about all these important events, and this one, that is so fucking vital, totally slipped off his radar?” “He knew about this thing, but he didn’t know it was going to be as big of a deal as it’s turning out to be.” Zach switches from saying the exhibition is important (fact) to Barry thinks it’s important (opinion), back to ‘really important’ (fact) and ending up with it wasn’t important at first but now it is (shift in evaluation by Barry). My interpretation: Barry seems to have started out saying this was an important exhibition. Apparently Zach asked the same question as Will (why Barry hadn’t mentioned it before). The answer wasn’t that Zach suddenly got a chance to attend a top event, but that the exhibition turned out to be a bigger deal than expected. How likely is this? Barry sounds like he’s making up arguments as he goes along. Not necessarily because it's a plot, maybe just because he's made a mistake by forgetting this camp and wants to cover it up. In the conversation with Matt in the next chapter I noticed Zach doesn’t seem convinced the exhibition is as important as he tried to tell Will. Is this because Barry wasn’t actually convincing during their talk and Zach can see so in retrospect, or because Zach now wants to consider the exhibition of low importance ? To me the point is nothing in the text supports the exhibition as 'definitely important', since Barry says it wasn't at first, but nor can we conclude it isn't important at all (and thus a possible plot or Barry trying to gain power). Hope this makes sense

The saddest part is Corbin not being able to figure out why Pete was devastated to learn about Mike. For once I'm on Pete's side. If I had a guy who was trying to become my boyfriend (no matter whether I was in the closet or not), finding out he would have sex with other people while waiting for me to work out how I felt, would kill me. My immediate conclusion would be he wasn't serious about loving me. Will we ever know why Corbin had no clue how to go about falling in love and entering a serious relationship? How for most people you spend time getting to know each other and realizing you prefer to be with this person above anyone else. How you stay faithful to your feelings even before you know if it will lead to something. It seems to me every time Pete has opened up to the idea there was something between them, he's been confronted with Corbin being with someone else. No surprise he's jumped back and shut down. Poor Mike, I hope Corbin stays angry with Pete long enough for the English boy to go back home and end any chance of them getting together. At least Mike will have some part of the boy he loves, even if not his whole heart.

I went back over all the things Zach said to Will and Matt about the camp. I'm unable to conclude from what's said whether the exhibition would really be an elite camp and important. Are you basing your argument on speculation about Barry telling the truth about the importance of this exhibition ? There are a few contradictions to indicate it wasn't complete logical, but nothing to prove it was a plot. However, I'll concede Will had a fit before he even asked about why Zach would give in to Barry. If he hadn't and they'd discussed it rationally and looked up information to determine the relative importance of the exhibition etc etc, Zach could have made a decision without the pressure of Will's anger. But he'd still have had a conflict with his parents, if he'd chosen Europe. Or are you assuming the choice would have been football no matter what ? Or just saying Zach should always choose anything with football over Will ?

Is this a hint of future chapters ? Because to me it looked as if Will understood how he should have reacted to solve the situation and be supportive of Zach. We haven't yet seen him act with his new more mature attitude. Of course I'm confident he'll manage, but even I am not Will fan enough to declare him improved before I see it happen.

Well to me the first domino was Barry disrupting the plans he'd originally endorsed (enthusiastically with the words 'go for it' as far as I recall). But I'll admit to having no clue about US football and college stuff, so I cannot refute the argument that the exhibition would mean more for Zach's career than going to Europe. And I'm guessing pointing to the opinions voiced by Matt and JP (and by Mark in replies to comments) won't make a difference to you. Nor will I cite any of the passages which to me supports my 'speculations'. Because they won't matter either. To you Will will always be the bad guy. And actually it's fun to have you take this position, as it leads to interesting reviews and heated discussions on the forum. Such as this one In fact, I sometimes suspect Mark of letting Will win or be vindicated so often just to tease you. Which is so for us Will fans So please keep up the anti-Will crusade

Yes, I think it does, but in fact Brad wasn't right in thinking the trouble was Will's fault this time. Or at least I think Mark and a fair amount of his readers think Will wasn't to blame for this particular problem. Yes he overreacted emotionally when Zach wanted to break his promise, but he didn't force Zach to do anything. Matt was the person who made Zach work through the problem and make the decision to choose the trip wih JP. And let's not forget that JP and all the other adults agreed this was the correct choice. Plus Brad did not repeat his thought about blaming Will this time, so apparently he's come to the same conclusion. And the point I'm trying to make, is that the reason there was a conflict is that Barry wanted to excert his control over Zach. He roped Wally and Clara into the fight, and in a way I feel sorry for them, because they'll pay the price even more than Barry. Getting 'fired' as parents (guardians) is surely a lot worse than getting the sack as advisor. Saying Will is to blame for this conflict seems completely unfair to me - unless just the fact he's in love with Zach and has made Zach love him in return is the main reason for all of Zach's problems with his parents. Will is doing his best to help Zach have his dreams of a football career come true, and Barry already agreed to the deal with the trip to Europe with JP, so Will was justified in thinking this was yet another ploy to keep them apart - or at least a stupid manipulative move by Barry. Zach's failure to see this was a large reason they got into a fight - if he'd asked Will to help him get out of the exhibition, things would have gone differently. Will's anger with Zach didn't help solve the matter, but it didn't create the problem in the first place. And if he'd given in, this would have shown Barry (and Zach's parents) they could do the same thing again and again. It would have destroyed the relationship of Will and Zach. For those of us who like those two characters such an outcome would have been terribly sad. It may still happen, but at least it won't be due to Barry being an idiot PS and it's no good repeating the argument that there wouldn't have been a conflict if Will had 'just' accpted Zach being persuaded to drop the trip. What if Zach had called JP and been told in his polite and logical manner that he would be wrong to drop the trip to Europe (both from an educational viewpoint and in relation to Will), and Matt had gone through the same conversation leading to Zach choosing to fire Barry etc. It would have been exactly the same basic conflict of Barry and Zach's parents trying to manipulate him into what they want rather than what's best for Zach.

Oh yes I certainly noticed Brad never voiced anything to betray his initial thought. And I'm assuming after Frank's explanation Brad will come to the logical conclusion about this new conflict not being Will's fault. Also I'm hoping Brad's clever enough never to reveal his 'knee-jerk reaction' to Will (though I can just imagine him going "what did you do NOW?" and the subsequent eruption of Will the Volcano). But I wonder how many of these fights between Zach and his parents we'll have to witness before Brad finally starts trusting his son. No matter what Will's faults are, I still find Brad's attitude illoyal and less than caring. Why isn't his first thought for Will's welfare (as relates to his relationship with Zach) rather than who is to blame? Oh well, you'll have to pardon my ranting on Will's behalf. I do like Brad and think you're right in saying he should mainly be judged on how he acts and speaks (like making a joke about Will liking going to court, when we all know how traumatic that episode was for his son ). And I'm certainly looking forward to Brad shipping Wally and Clara off to Siberia and dumping Barry somewhere nasty on the way.

Reading the latest chapter again, I noticed one sentence in Brad's part which made me annoyed with him: That got my attention, because if there was a problem with Zach, it most likely also involved Will. God only knew what he’d done to piss off Wally and Clara now. Why does Brad automatically assume any trouble between Zach and his parents is due to something Will's done ? Not the sign of a loyal parent, even if he knows Will so well including his faults. JP at least asked to be told in a neutral manner which did not reveal who he thought might be to blame. Not that Brad didn't ask fair questions too, but I wonder if his last question was another sign of him worrying about Will making Wally and Clara angry. Why doesn't he worry about how Will feels ? Is this because he think Will is smart enough to deal with this on his own ? Or am I being overly sensitive on behalf of Will ? I know I'm biased, so I'd like to hear the opinions of readers who're neutral or even antagonistic to Will. Did anyone else notice Brad's tendency to immediately think of Will being to blame ? Maybe just from agreeing with him ? (I won't argue with you if you did, I just want to know if you had the same thought as me )

You won't get any complaint from me for extending the story.We're definitely not done with Corey and Clinton and all the drama with the other high school kids. 40 is a nice round number too, you know I liked the interaction with Amber, it showed Corey is much better liked than he thought. And maybe the reaction of Cj's dad (a surprise since I thought he was a complete ass hole too) and some of the other parents has gotten back to Corey's dad who'll be secretly pleased his son is popular and well regarded.

Oh the irony of Matt helping Zach work through his issues logically rather than letting his emotions rule him. Such a neat chapter, I love it whenever Will and Zach manage to come to a deeper understanding of each other. It gives me hope for their future together. Asking Frank to be his guardian was a stroke of genius, even if it only remains a threat. Wally and Clara cannot dismiss Frank the way they would Will's family (JP; Stef and Brad). But I notice Frank didn't hesitate to involve the heavy guns Finally, Barry got fired - made quite a few of us happy

Certainly seems as if Dallas is determined to shed the nasty jock image. Cool the way he stood up for Damien and how August casually supported it and them. I liked the way they were on the same page (pun intended) with the way they thought of their relationship. Dallas must have been so frustrated about liking Damien and never getting a chance to get closer before now. And Dame may be kicking himself a bit for all the time lost where he could have indulged in lusting after Dallas - AND getting his desires fulfilled. Oh well better late than never

I agree. And Will has accepted this deal and has told Zach so. But he's also said, he needs to be the second most important thing. This means having his opinion weigh more than Zach's parents and agent. Especiall since Will is actually smart and his understanding of the latest issue is spot on (I assume we all agree on that ?). So if Zach doesn't catch on, he'll lose Will - not because he puts football first, but because he's unable to deal with his interfering and manipulating parents and his stupid agent. And the sad thing is that Zach has several people who are more than willing to help him if he asks: JP, Frank, Brad - probably even Cody. He can use them (especially JP) to check on whether Will is right about his analysis but also for backing him up or even to deal with the situation - mainly with Barry who already said going to Europe with JP was cool. So I agree with Headstall that the problem isn't Zach loving Will less than football, but his lack of a spine and a brain in function. I really look forward to seeing how this situation develops, I hope Will manages to avoid the 'Matt mistake' of reacting emotionally rather than rationally. Partly because the thought of Brad's reaction if Will gets his heart broken is rather scary