mmike1969 Posted June 21, 2010 Posted June 21, 2010 I am with B1ue on Stef's b-day being Bastille Day. Ever notice when we come to that day in the stories, JP always manages to call Stef to tell him "Happy Bastille Day!". Seriously, does ANY American call each other and tell them "happy president's day!"... And I am shocked at the negative attitute of the chance that Aaron/Steven being alive. With one more chapter left, I give hope that they are alive. Sure, they can't come back to the US without causing big problems for themselves, but it will fill a big hole that Stef has had over the years.
buba Posted June 21, 2010 Posted June 21, 2010 And I am shocked at the negative attitute of the chance that Aaron/Steven being alive. With one more chapter left, I give hope that they are alive. Sure, they can't come back to the US without causing big problems for themselves, but it will fill a big hole that Stef has had over the years. I think Aaron is (or at least was until some time) alive at Negros, but I'm quite positive that Steven is dead, since otherwise he would go and look for his baby.
ricky Posted June 21, 2010 Posted June 21, 2010 It'd be a neat trick for an Army officer to die commanding a platoon in a naval battle. I'm not certain enough to say it's impossible, but I don't see how. The newspaper article seems to imply he died in combat during the push towards the Rhine. You may be thinking of Steven's brother Billy, Brad's father, who died while part of a submarine crew. The Army was transported often by ship. "D" day for instance was one such example. They were also transported home by ship. Injured were often served on a hospital ship. Having said that, you are probably right that I was thinking of Billy.
methodwriter85 Posted June 21, 2010 Posted June 21, 2010 I think Aaron is (or at least was until some time) alive at Negros, but I'm quite positive that Steven is dead, since otherwise he would go and look for his baby. Right. If Steven hadn't known about Stefan, he might have considered it, but he knew, and there's no way he would have abandoned his child like that.
ricky Posted June 21, 2010 Posted June 21, 2010 I think Aaron is (or at least was until some time) alive at Negros, but I'm quite positive that Steven is dead, since otherwise he would go and look for his baby. If Tonto was in on it then he did and she facilitated it. Remember that she knew! And if he was presumed dead, they shared the same ill fate.
Canuk Posted June 21, 2010 Posted June 21, 2010 Mark M I find I am agreeing with you - (and sorry, I am going back a page or so here - the problem of living on the other side of the world - half the comments are written while I'm tucked up in bed with m'boy); I found the Box, while well written, was hard going at first, and a "filler" between Grainger stories, however recently I have become more intriged by it. As far as peoples comments; the level of detail some people recall about earlier stories truly amazes me!!
methodwriter85 Posted June 21, 2010 Posted June 21, 2010 (edited) You know what, guys? I agree with you. Mark Arbour, I think Stefan's birthday is Bastille's Day, 1945. Is that okay with you? It works for the period of time in which Stefan and Annette were having sex, as well as Stefan being 16 in April of 1962. (If you guys are wondering, Mark usually has me set birthdays for characters that didn't specifically happen in the story, like Darius and George Granger. I picked January 10th, 1776 as George Granger's birthdate because it was when Common Sense was published.) Edited June 21, 2010 by methodwriter85
rjo Posted June 22, 2010 Posted June 22, 2010 It seems like a lot of us are hoping maybe against hope that Steven and Aaron are living together all these years. Why Steve didn't contact Stef I don't know. Maybe for fear of imprisonment. Maybe he contacted Stefan's mom and gave her money. Even though Aaron and Steven can't return to the US can you imagine the reunion. A ending worthy of Mark. On another tone I think Stef was born on Bastille Day. JP always has a party on the day and Stef is always there. No day would be better. One more chapter to tie the loose end together. I can't wait.
methodwriter85 Posted June 22, 2010 Posted June 22, 2010 (edited) Guys, I really honestly love the idea that Stefan's birthday is Bastille's Day, but because Stefan isn't about birthdays, JP has instead made Bastille's Day a covert way to celebrate Stefan's birthday without making him feel old. Awesome idea! Edited June 22, 2010 by methodwriter85
Mark Arbour Posted June 22, 2010 Author Posted June 22, 2010 I decided after seeing all the postings over the last few months to take a peek at Bloodlines once Mark posted the final chapter. Needless to say that I've gotten sucked into the CAP series and finished reading all the parts of the series except If It Fits as I can't seem to get into this one. I actually like the use of the diary as a way to explore the past. I especially agree with the sentiment of "why doesn't Robbie get off his ass and call Frank". It may be because (at least until the end of the current chapter) knowledge about the diary was being kept secret. If Robbie called Frank about Nathan and Aaron, the logical question for Frank to pose, especially if he does have knowledge, is where did these questions come from. I'm in the camp of Aaron actually being alive somewhere in the Pacific but what I can't figure out is how would Steven pull off the great escape since I didn't get the impression that he was unrecognizable after his death and it also leads to asking whose body did the Schluter's bury in the family plot and why didn't his squad notice it wasn't him who died? I'm thinking that Aaron lived alone in the Pacific somewhere... can't wait to find out how this turns out. As for where to go from here, there are enough illegitimate children born by the gay characters in CAP there is no end to options. I especially liked Bitty's comment about the only good Hayes are the one who like to get #$@. Thanks for a great read Mark! Steve I'm glad you're enjoying it! Welcome to our world! I am with B1ue on Stef's b-day being Bastille Day. Ever notice when we come to that day in the stories, JP always manages to call Stef to tell him "Happy Bastille Day!". Seriously, does ANY American call each other and tell them "happy president's day!"... And I am shocked at the negative attitute of the chance that Aaron/Steven being alive. With one more chapter left, I give hope that they are alive. Sure, they can't come back to the US without causing big problems for themselves, but it will fill a big hole that Stef has had over the years. I like Bastille Day for his birthday as well. The holiday would be more analogous to the US' 4th of July than President's Day. Mark M I find I am agreeing with you - (and sorry, I am going back a page or so here - the problem of living on the other side of the world - half the comments are written while I'm tucked up in bed with m'boy); I found the Box, while well written, was hard going at first, and a "filler" between Grainger stories, however recently I have become more intriged by it. As far as peoples comments; the level of detail some people recall about earlier stories truly amazes me!! And it keeps me on my toes!
Tiger Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 That was a good final chapter. It seems that everyone got the closure they needed. The saddest parts are that Aaron and Steven never had a chance to reunite and that the Hayes family hasn't really healed from Aaron's actions. While I understand why he did it, I still can't help but feel like he was being a selfish bastard for doing it.
Canuk Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 (edited) The saddest parts are that Aaron and Steven never had a chance to reunite and that the Hayes family hasn't really healed from Aaron's actions. While I understand why he did it, I still can't help but feel like he was being a selfish bastard for doing it. I disagree, I don't think it was at all selfish what Aaron did, at least from his perspective. It only looks selfish from an era where being gay and gay realtionships are accepted, etc. From Aaron's 1940's view there was no way on earth that his sexuality or relationships (be it with Steven or anyone else) was going to be accepted. He had no way of knowing that his father's latent bastardry would come to the fore with his (Aaron's) "death". One question of my own - if Tonto knew of the diary, we have to assume that she didn't figure out the riddle of Los Negros..... second, while this is the end of the Box and Aaron has decided not to change things, hopefully he'll get some assistance from Steph/JP/Nathan etc.... - even today outside main town (Lae, Port Moresby) medical services are limited and at 70+ he's likley going to need some help in that area if only to make sure that when the time comes death is as pain free as possible .... Edited June 27, 2010 by Canuk
rjo Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 (edited) Over the last 20 chapters I have grown to love Steven a lot. When the guys open the Box for the first time none of them knew that they would find. Maybe JP knew a little about the man who was Stef's father. As we hear Stef read the pages we have grown to love Steven, Aaron and Nathan even Jim after a while. As the chapter posted I hope that maybe Aaron and Steven would be living together. But that was not meant to be. Steve was too much the honorable man to run away. It is even now hard to be mad a Aaron. He just wasn't a strong as Steven. In the end , Mark was right and gave us a man, a father a friend to be proud of. Stef got to know his father better than most sons do. And we got a lot of answers to some questions which have been out there. Then I saw the final chapter I was almost afraid to read it. I am glad I did. Thanks again Mark, another awesome ending to a great story. Edited June 28, 2010 by rjo
ricky Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 An Excellent end to this book. And ending with a 1941 yellow Packard convertible . . . well what could be better. I mean, what could be better, really! As for finding him. A lot of things come to mind. Years of loneliness, desperate depression I am sure. Remember that back then it was considered a mental illness to be gay. You could be locked away, given shock treatments or drugged into submission. No, I couldn't condemn him. As for the family being angry, Frank made the choices to beat his wife and kids. Another great reason for Aaron to rush home right? No, he isn't to blame for the years of misery his father laid upon the family. More than likely if not for that then he would simply find another reason or do it with no reason at all. Sorry, I could not possibly make him responsible for the actions of someone else. As I heard it put so eloquently years ago in a similar situation. "Just because I screwed you once, does not mean I am the father of all your children." I was a little disappointed that we didn't find out who was screwing the deals over for Stefan and JP, but I suppose that will find resolution in the next book which Mark is calling . . . . ? ? ? Well done Mark and company.
PrivateTim Posted December 2, 2010 Posted December 2, 2010 Just finished The Box and I loved it, I think it is the best of the CAP series so far for the way it explains so many other aspects of the story. I am sorry Steven and Aaron never got the chance to have a life together. I also wish there was a way to have an alternative ending where Steven came home and built a life with Nathan only to have it dawn on him what Never Ever Grieve, Only Remember Steven meant. But even at that, If Steven had lived through the war he could never have had the life he would have wanted with Nathan or Aaron either for that matter. They would do what Nathan and so many other men who were gay in those days did; marry women they could love, have families and bury those awful yearnings as best they could or find ways to fulfill their needs as gay/bi men did for generations and still do in parts of the country. I mean, you all don't really believe those huts on frozen lakes are to catch fish in the dead of winter do you?
methodwriter85 Posted December 2, 2010 Posted December 2, 2010 It really was sad that at the time, there really was nothing Aaron and Steven could have done if they were in the U.S. I really like following Steven. He was a pretty cool guy. Crazy to think what he could've done if he had survived his teen years.
PrivateTim Posted December 2, 2010 Posted December 2, 2010 I am not sure why Aaron wants to enlist so bad. Maybe its just getting out of that house and away from his father. My feeling for Steve however, only continues to grow. He is a good friend, lover and partner. He is willing to sacrifice himself and his happiness for Aaron. That is something some people never learn. Steven at 17 has learned it. It will cause him great sadness in his short life. Stefan can be truly proud of his father. Something is still hidden in the background, JP knows what it is. We will just have it wait. Waiting to so hard sometimes. I totally get why Aaron was so hepped up to the join the fight in 1942. The world was a much more innocent place in the years before WWII. While 9-11 was horrible and fueled anger and resentment and sent a good number of young men down to their local recruiting off, it wasn't inconceivable. We knew there were Muslim extremists who wanted to kill us and harm us, we just hadn't figured they could be so successful at it. By contrast, most Americans had no idea the Japanese were mad at us and very few knew where Pearl Harbor was. The attack shocked and shook the country to its core. Steven's attitude is the more surprising one, not Aaron's. If you want to read an amazing book on Peleliu, try With the Old Breed by E.B. Sledge. Two other great books on the fighting in the Pacific are Goodbye Darkness by William Manchester and one not by a participant, One Square Mile of Hell, The Battle for Tarawa
methodwriter85 Posted December 2, 2010 Posted December 2, 2010 I totally get why Aaron was so hepped up to the join the fight in 1942. By contrast, most Americans had no idea the Japanese were mad at us and very few knew where Pearl Harbor was. The attack shocked and shook the country to its core. Steven's attitude is the more surprising one, not Aaron's. I think Mark has set the Schluters and Cramptons up as being a peace-loving, pacifist family. I think if they had been in Pennsylvania or New York instead of Ohio, they would have become Quakers. The Hayes family is written as being the type of guys that want to fight. Although it could be interesting if Darius breaks that like Billy Senior did by joining up with the military after 9/11. Or if Matt Carrswold's dormant Hayes side comes out and he wants to join as well.
Mark Arbour Posted December 3, 2010 Author Posted December 3, 2010 I think Mark has set the Schluters and Cramptons up as being a peace-loving, pacifist family. I think if they had been in Pennsylvania or New York instead of Ohio, they would have become Quakers. The Hayes family is written as being the type of guys that want to fight. Although it could be interesting if Darius breaks that like Billy Senior did by joining up with the military after 9/11. Or if Matt Carrswold's dormant Hayes side comes out and he wants to join as well. I don't see them as pacifists at all. Both JP's brother and father were in the military. Both of Tonto's sons were. Peace-loving, most definitely. Then again, a lot of military people are peace-loving. I think as it pertains to Tonto in this story, she wasn't opposed to Steven fighting, she was opposed to him going so soon, so young. Plus, I think it would be hard on any mother to have her son go off to war.
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