St. Vincent

[ricky]

Hey how about THIS for timing?

The HMS Victory to be recovered from the seabed.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16671444

[Westie]

What a great video depicting the damage caused by cannon fire. I also watched the 6 part bbc vids of the defeat of the Spanish armada. It too taught me a great deal about the naval battles of the time. It was a good investiment in time.

 

Then I searched for the battle of St Vincent and found "this" little nugget.

 

A great little 3 minute depiction of this great battle.

 

Loving this series Mark. I've saved every chapter so that I can convert it to mp3 ../..//public/style_emoticons/default/whistle.gif and listen to it on my long drives to DC. A true treasure from the net. ../..//public/style_emoticons/default/offtopic.gif(Don't worry. For personal use only. It's how this dyslexic reads effectively.)

Thanks!

 

This is one of Mark Thorburn's videos - he is a noted "Nelson enthusiast". Whilst a lot of "die hard historians" don't rate this kind of thing, I really applaud this type of work that brings history to the masses

[Westie]

Hey how about THIS for timing?

The HMS Victory to be recovered from the seabed.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16671444

 

This is a predecessor to the "victory" that is eventually commanded by nelson. There was one other that was called "victory" between this ship and the one Nelson commanded, but she was an 8 gun schooner and wasnt fit to carry the name quite frankly.

 

This version of "Victory" was lost in 1744, with a loss of over 1000 lives not a single survivor

 

The "Victory" that Nalson commanded is actually still a commissioned ship of the Royal Navy (strange but true) and is the current flagship of the Second Sea Lord. She is in dry dock at Portsmouth - and if anyone is ever in the area I can recommend it as a thoroughly satisfying day out. They have an exhibit nearby that tries to recreate the atmosphere of a ship afloat - including smells. Not something for the weak of stomach.

[centexhairysub]

They have an exhibit nearby that tries to recreate the atmosphere of a ship afloat - including smells. Not something for the weak of stomach.

 

Hmmm... just how much do they try and recreate????

 

I had such dirty dirty thoughts when I read this....

[Mark Arbour]

Well, the latest chapter of St. Vincent is up. I also wanted to add that I did an interview here on GA. In case you missed it and were interested, the link is here.

[ricky]

A great battle Mark! Well Done.

 

But interesting, No? Mr Lennox to confer for Jervis? What's that all about. Or is that to make sure that Granger gets his due as well with the admiralty.

 

Having Mr Lennox on board will be fun but I fear not until after Portsmouth when the ship is less crowded.

 

And shall we run into the dishonorable Conquistador again? I should hope when his capture occurs, his dishonor earns him a less than suitable accomodation home in his capture. Perhaps he will not be included in an exchange by request of his most Catholic majesty, opting for some of lessor rank and showing that they recognized his lack of honor. (I always wanted to find a place for this "most rare in usefulness" emoticon.)

 

Something tells me that Carlton house will test Grangers metal when Mr Fox implies Granger's lack of fortitude during this battle. I'm sure that when it is pointed out that the frigate was not involved by tradition and by a point of honor that fox will back down. Granger can remind him that he understands his confusion, after all, ignorance IS bliss right. (Lack of a question mark intentional.) He could also point out how there would be a lot fewer to fight had "HIS" hero Admiral Mann taken care of some of the fleet when he was oblidged to do so instead of seeking a holiday in the homeland.

 

Granger is running out of honors he could receive anyways right? So dumbing down his role in the victory is no biggie. It would perhaps brighten his day if the King did something subtle to recognize what Granger did like advancing his father's position or peerage by invitation rather than supplication. That would chap Freddies hide as well.

 

And what of Mr Clifton? Will he get the opportunity to test for the first Leutenant's position? And where will Mr Lennox end up? And how will Captain Granger feel when he is relagated to a floating bathtub ship of the line? You know it is coming. That would suck for a man like Granger,who was used to a smaller faster more actionworthy ship. And surely a ship of the line brought home much less prize money. Ships of the line were the "fatguys" of the sea. They can kick almost anyone's butt IF they can catch them. Great for blockading unless they are under Admiral Mann's command. I just can't see him completely gone. Even though he has been snubbed and put in drydock. Perhaps he needs to find a seat in the carriage with Freddie and his wife when the have their accident.

 

In any event, Granger is going home. Can he help but get a grand reception? Will he find a prize between portsmouth and London? I think that somewhere along the way he should find the conquistador in the night and board her and sieze her colors while her captain sleeps. Caulder would be totally pissed to wake up and find one more ship of the line in their convoy with Granger's name on it. And imagine a Frigate taking an 84 gun ship of the line without a shot fired. (I don't know if this is a warrior emoticon or a viking cheerleader.)

 

As for the upcoming book Mutiny, even the word is scary. I hope Granger is the solution and not the problem. Hanging your own is so very distasteful. And if it is Granger who mutiny's against the likes of Admiral Mann . . . . well, some things are worth the swing, don't you think?

[Westie]

A particularly good chapter.

 

I think I have some ideas why two messengers are being sent by Jervis, because of the politics and history that went on after the battle. However, I wont spoil the suspense by going into detail here.

 

I really am enjoying this story, in my view Mark, its the best you have written. the time and effort that goes into these "bridgemont" stories obviously pays dividends in quality for you.

[centexhairysub]

Well, the new chapter is out and it is as invigorating as the battle that it explored. The way that Nelson used one ship to bridge to the other actually was named after him. In a battle involving ships of the line it was really considered bad form for a ship of the line to fire on a frigate, the fact that it happened in the context of this story seems telling.

 

I am glad that Granger is on his way home, we can tie up some family issues now before the next story begins. I still am hoping for a carriage accident with Freddie and Davina.

 

Well, I am truly glad that Roberts and Gatling survived and are still together. Glad to have Lennox back, is it just for the voyage home or will be stay around??? Clifton had done well but there is no way someone that junior will stay first Lt.

 

Granger has never been the type to need to blow his own horn, and allowing the reports to highlite the ships of the line will earn him more than a few thanks. Too many people know what Granger did so you can beat he will still get something for his action but it will be more behind the scene.

 

I have to say I am hoping that when Granger returns to London there is some serious fraternization with a certain army brigadier...

[Daddydavek]

I like how Mark tied up some loose ends. The battle descriptions were clear and concise. Two messengers and the one to be let out at Plymouth is a bit full of himself. That Jervis asked George to delete his part in splitting the fleet more clearly squares with the historical account and of course Jervis would make sure the admiralty knew of his little contribution. They all come out winners and George gets to go home and find out the latest on his home front.

 

Great job Mark!

 

Perhaps this part of the Granger series is coming to a close soon.

[ricky]

Granger was instructed to leave out the fact that splitting the fleet was devisive towards the victory. His report will still state that he came upon the fleet and created havoc as he passed through in the middle of the night. After all he has to state that he used the kings powder and shot. So I am sure many will put together the effect it had on the battle without that part being cited. Granger has always been a bit of a wild cowboy at heart.

 

Perhaps the King will advance his father's peerage just on this act. We shall see. The King seems aware of the behind the scenes events as well as what the public sees. And the brotherhood has people who have the king's ear as well.

 

As for Mutiny. Wouldn't it be great if he assumed the role of Captain on a ship where they mutinied against a Wilcox? Pardon all the men and hang the captain? Works for me.

 

Mr Lennox may be young but he is Granger trained and we know how fast Granger advanced. Perhaps Mr Lennox will be the youngest new LT.!

 

I wonder if Mr Llwelyn is going to buy a used 18 pounder for his bedroom when he grows up and retires. Perhaps he and Winkler can start a little something. Captain Sommers has been around long enough after all. All I know is that there will be rats in the chartroom no matter what ship Granger is in command of.

[Mark Arbour]

A particularly good chapter.

 

I think I have some ideas why two messengers are being sent by Jervis, because of the politics and history that went on after the battle. However, I wont spoil the suspense by going into detail here.

 

I really am enjoying this story, in my view Mark, its the best you have written. the time and effort that goes into these "bridgemont" stories obviously pays dividends in quality for you.

 

You'll have to share your reasons with me. Thanks for your compliment! It does take time, but it's enjoyable.

 

Well, the new chapter is out and it is as invigorating as the battle that it explored. The way that Nelson used one ship to bridge to the other actually was named after him. In a battle involving ships of the line it was really considered bad form for a ship of the line to fire on a frigate, the fact that it happened in the context of this story seems telling.

 

I am glad that Granger is on his way home, we can tie up some family issues now before the next story begins. I still am hoping for a carriage accident with Freddie and Davina.

 

Well, I am truly glad that Roberts and Gatling survived and are still together. Glad to have Lennox back, is it just for the voyage home or will be stay around??? Clifton had done well but there is no way someone that junior will stay first Lt.

 

Granger has never been the type to need to blow his own horn, and allowing the reports to highlite the ships of the line will earn him more than a few thanks. Too many people know what Granger did so you can beat he will still get something for his action but it will be more behind the scene.

 

I have to say I am hoping that when Granger returns to London there is some serious fraternization with a certain army brigadier...

 

Actually, this was an historical accuracy. St. Vincent was one of the first actions in this war where frigates were fired on by ships of the line, and indicated a change in the culture of battle. Nelson and Napoleon illustrated this change in culture, as both went for victories of annihilation. Jervis will be lauded for capturing 4 ships of the line, while at the Nile, Nelson will destroy or capture all but a few of the French ships. The gentlemanliness of battle is fading into the background.

 

I like how Mark tied up some loose ends. The battle descriptions were clear and concise. Two messengers and the one to be let out at Plymouth is a bit full of himself. That Jervis asked George to delete his part in splitting the fleet more clearly squares with the historical account and of course Jervis would make sure the admiralty knew of his little contribution. They all come out winners and George gets to go home and find out the latest on his home front.

 

Great job Mark!

 

Perhaps this part of the Granger series is coming to a close soon.

 

Yep. I wanted to create a way for Granger to be involved in the victory, and that seemed like a good way to do it!

 

Granger was instructed to leave out the fact that splitting the fleet was devisive towards the victory. His report will still state that he came upon the fleet and created havoc as he passed through in the middle of the night. After all he has to state that he used the kings powder and shot. So I am sure many will put together the effect it had on the battle without that part being cited. Granger has always been a bit of a wild cowboy at heart.

 

Perhaps the King will advance his father's peerage just on this act. We shall see. The King seems aware of the behind the scenes events as well as what the public sees. And the brotherhood has people who have the king's ear as well.

 

As for Mutiny. Wouldn't it be great if he assumed the role of Captain on a ship where they mutinied against a Wilcox? Pardon all the men and hang the captain? Works for me.

 

Mr Lennox may be young but he is Granger trained and we know how fast Granger advanced. Perhaps Mr Lennox will be the youngest new LT.!

 

I wonder if Mr Llwelyn is going to buy a used 18 pounder for his bedroom when he grows up and retires. Perhaps he and Winkler can start a little something. Captain Sommers has been around long enough after all. All I know is that there will be rats in the chartroom no matter what ship Granger is in command of.

 

LOL. I think that Granger is quite happy to let his role in creating chaos in the fleet go unreported. He knows that Nelson will be the hero of the hour, and he's smart enough to realize that stealing Nelson's thunder is NEVER a good idea. As long as the First Lord and powers-that-be know what he did, that's enough.

[ricky]

I completely forgot, Thanks for the great pictures as well. It really adds to the story.

Thanks!

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Replying to you one sentence response to my review -

 

Or maybe he won't have anyone. :-)

Whatever!

 

 

I was going to leave it at that, but please, do I look that stupid - wait, don't answer that. What I mean is that's like saying you won't come in. . . err. . . maybe that's not a good analogy, what I really mean is this is a Mark Arbour story with the Randy Captain George who is banging or getting banged by a ship full of hot hung horny seamen. He's gonna have more than one, it's just a question of who and when and where.

 

There, that's the right response.

[Mark Arbour]

Replying to you one sentence response to my review -

 

 

 

Whatever!

 

 

I was going to leave it at that, but please, do I look that stupid - wait, don't answer that. What I mean is that's like saying you won't come in. . . err. . . maybe that's not a good analogy, what I really mean is this is a Mark Arbour story with the Randy Captain George who is banging or getting banged by a ship full of hot hung horny seamen. He's gonna have more than one, it's just a question of who and when and where.

 

There, that's the right response.

 

I figure if I can't be good (that reviewer that skewered poor Dom would undoubtedly skewer me worse), I can at least be quirky and unpredictable.

[JimCarter]

Okay, I'm going to show my ignorance, but it is something that I have not figured out for myself.

 

Why is there two captains aboard Victory? I know Captain Calder is the fleet captain and Captain Gray is the ship captain, but my questions are what are their responsibilities and why two Captains are necessary?

 

I enjoy this series so much, this just seems to be haunting me.

[Mark Arbour]

Okay, I'm going to show my ignorance, but it is something that I have not figured out for myself.

 

Why is there two captains aboard Victory? I know Captain Calder is the fleet captain and Captain Gray is the ship captain, but my questions are what are their responsibilities and why two Captains are necessary?

 

I enjoy this series so much, this just seems to be haunting me.

 

That's a great question. I tried to illustrate their roles and how they differed in "The Wardroom," but here's the breakdown.

The Flag Captain (Grey, in this case), is the captain of the flagship. He's responsible for the operations of the ship itself, much as Granger is for the Belvidera.

The Captain of the Fleet (Calder, in this case), is like the admiral's chief of staff. He's responsible for implementing Jervis' orders as regards the fleet, and managing Jervis' staff. So Lennox, as a Flag Lieutenant, would have worked directly for Calder.

[JimCarter]

That's a great question. I tried to illustrate their roles and how they differed in "The Wardroom," but here's the breakdown.

The Flag Captain (Grey, in this case), is the captain of the flagship. He's responsible for the operations of the ship itself, much as Granger is for the Belvidera.

The Captain of the Fleet (Calder, in this case), is like the admiral's chief of staff. He's responsible for implementing Jervis' orders as regards the fleet, and managing Jervis' staff. So Lennox, as a Flag Lieutenant, would have worked directly for Calder.

 

I remember that now. I guess I had an old man brain fart. Thanks for spraying air freshener on my brain fart.

Edited February 1, 2012 by JimCarter

[Andrew Q Gordon]

I figure if I can't be good (that reviewer that skewered poor Dom would undoubtedly skewer me worse), I can at least be quirky and unpredictable.

 

So Kerry and Sommers - both dumped poor George for each other - whatever! Two Power tops can NOT make a serious go of it, no matter how 'hard' they try. I give that a week or less, before one or both will be back begging for George's tail

 

But this is London and Freddy is still here and so is Lord Chartley. Lennox of course is there as well, but I sense his interests aren't quite as keen as the others. Of course there is always room for a new love to show up as the new 1st Lt.

 

But back to the original theme - I don't think we've seen the end of Sir Phillip.

[centexhairysub]

Well, just loved the newest chapter and so glad that Kerry and Somers found each other, their getting together and moving away from Granger will open him up for a more serious encounter with Lord Chartley. I have said since we got to met Brigadier Lord Charltey that he might be the one to take Travers place in Granger's life. He just seems to be perfect for the position. While I do agree that Granger will not settle down with just one woman, Caroline, and just one man, maybe Lord Chartley, he needs to have one main male lover and I nominate Lord Chartley...

 

I loved how Granger interacted and dealt with the other's on the voyage home. It seems that each of them saw what they wanted to in Granger each to their own beliefs. Granger is just the perfect social and political animal; and when you put him with Caroline, well damn just watch out...

 

I hope that we get to see and deal with some of the ending of the family drama. I am still pushing for a terrible carriage accident that will end both Freddie and Lavina's miserable existences but.....

[Mark Arbour]

So Kerry and Sommers - both dumped poor George for each other - whatever! Two Power tops can NOT make a serious go of it, no matter how 'hard' they try. I give that a week or less, before one or both will be back begging for George's tail

 

But this is London and Freddy is still here and so is Lord Chartley. Lennox of course is there as well, but I sense his interests aren't quite as keen as the others. Of course there is always room for a new love to show up as the new 1st Lt.

 

But back to the original theme - I don't think we've seen the end of Sir Phillip.

 

I think that both Kerry and Somers are flexible enough to enjoy each other, but we shall see. Either way, it's unlikely that they're out of Granger's life.

 

Lennox is basically a horny young guy. I see him playing out as heterosexual, but he enjoys blow jobs.

 

Well, just loved the newest chapter and so glad that Kerry and Somers found each other, their getting together and moving away from Granger will open him up for a more serious encounter with Lord Chartley. I have said since we got to met Brigadier Lord Charltey that he might be the one to take Travers place in Granger's life. He just seems to be perfect for the position. While I do agree that Granger will not settle down with just one woman, Caroline, and just one man, maybe Lord Chartley, he needs to have one main male lover and I nominate Lord Chartley...

 

I loved how Granger interacted and dealt with the other's on the voyage home. It seems that each of them saw what they wanted to in Granger each to their own beliefs. Granger is just the perfect social and political animal; and when you put him with Caroline, well damn just watch out...

 

I hope that we get to see and deal with some of the ending of the family drama. I am still pushing for a terrible carriage accident that will end both Freddie and Lavina's miserable existences but.....

 

Chartley is an interesting character. I'll make sure to save some family drama for you, don't you worry.

[centexhairysub]

Chartley is an interesting character. I'll make sure to save some family drama for you, don't you worry.

 

 

Yes, love me some drama; what is that quote about tangled webs??? Hmmm....

[Westie]

Well, i thought this chapter was leading up to the "and they lived happily ever after" part? yeah, right!

 

Great chapter and great writing Mark as always. I can't wait for the next chapters, and the next story !

[Andrew Q Gordon]

I think that both Kerry and Somers are flexible enough to enjoy each other, but we shall see. Either way, it's unlikely that they're out of Granger's life.

 

Lennox is basically a horny young guy. I see him playing out as heterosexual, but he enjoys blow jobs.

 

 

 

Clearly you're aren't a power top, nor have you dated one if that is what you think.

 

As for them being out of Granger's life, maybe I misread things, but I got the impression that Phillip loved George more than George loved him. It felt like George liked him quite a bit and even may have loved him in a way, but it was not the same deep, Travers/Calvert/Freddy kinda feelings.

 

But this 'switchero' by Phillip, seemed - well forced. Sorry, but I'm gonna be critical for a moment. From the moment Phillip initiated George into the club, it seemed he was in love with him, in fact he said he'd been in love with George forever. Them, while George is giving it to him and Sommers is giving it to George, he has a moment with his cousin and wham, Goodbye George, hello cousin. And they'd been on the ship together for a while, so it's not like this couldn't have been worked out earlier or in a different way. It just felt like a way to get the love struck Phillip out of the way for whatever devious plans you have in the works for the next couple chapters.

 

Oh and as for Lennox, that was basically what I thought, so thank for confirming it. Guess he won't be getting an invite to the 'Branded Wrist' Gentlemen only club.

[Westie]

But this 'switchero' by Phillip, seemed - well forced. Sorry, but I'm gonna be critical for a moment. From the moment Phillip initiated George into the club, it seemed he was in love with him, in fact he said he'd been in love with George forever. Them, while George is giving it to him and Sommers is giving it to George, he has a moment with his cousin and wham, Goodbye George, hello cousin. And they'd been on the ship together for a while, so it's not like this couldn't have been worked out earlier or in a different way. It just felt like a way to get the love struck Phillip out of the way for whatever devious plans you have in the works for the next couple chapters.

 

Oh come on Q. Have you never been caught in a moment of realisation? Phillip has been holding back from something for SO long. obviously he felt that his position was more important than his own physical desires. Then a situation comes along that allows him to indulge in that oh so forbidden fruit. Dont you think that's something more real than anything else Mark might write about?

 

I think once back in London, "Sir" Phillip will reassert himself, but maybe allowing somers more than just a peek through the crack in the door

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Oh come on Q. Have you never been caught in a moment of realisation? Phillip has been holding back from something for SO long. obviously he felt that his position was more important than his own physical desires. Then a situation comes along that allows him to indulge in that oh so forbidden fruit. Dont you think that's something more real than anything else Mark might write about?

 

I think once back in London, "Sir" Phillip will reassert himself, but maybe allowing somers more than just a peek through the crack in the door

 

Nope Sorry Westie, I don't see it that way It didn't 'feel real to me. Sure you can have a 'moment' but that doesn't change supposed deep feelings. If he loved George the way he said - and showed in the story -and he said he loved George since they were young, he wouldn't have dumped him that fast and with no explanation either. So now we find out he also 'loved' his cousin for just as long?

 

Like I said, it felt like a convenient excuse to clear him out for something to come. Not that it kills the story, not by a long shot, it probably makes it more interesting overall, but SOMEONE has to tell the emperor . . . err Mark . . . he has no clothes