Paternity

[Mark Arbour]

Are JJ & Jenine competing for the Bitch Supreme award?

 

Jeanine wins.

[methodwriter85]

Jeanine wins.

JJ's tantrum was good, but for it to have reached a Jeremy-As-A-Teenager level, JJ really needed to have either thrown something at Will, or broken something while screaming his head off. Otherwise, there was the Level 10 tantrum I was waiting for! (Yes, before you ask, I underwent anger management when I was 17, leading to the calm and level-headed young man you see today.)

 

Over in reviews:

 

He tries to be nice to JJ only to get his bitchieness thrown at him. The whole thing with Evan was quite interesting. Maybe JJ likes him but is afraid to do anything or let someone outside the family become close to him.

I think JJ in general is one very repressed kid. I think he knew about Tiffany's Nicole Bobek story and was paranoid about it happening to him, so he overcompensated by making sure he fit the Disney Image to a tee. It works for now, but as Will noted, it won't be so easy when JJ is 17 and much deeper into puberty. Especially if JJ turns out to be anything like his biological father, or his eldest biological half-brother. Those two have at least three illegitimate children between them. (I wouldn't be surprised if there were more.)

 

I still don't see Will giving up Malibu and surfing and Ryan or his other H-W friends for Paly even if Jeannie is being crazy.

I'd hate to see all of the HW friends go to the wayside, because Mark did a really good job at making them interesting, but Paly might be a good option. Plus, we'll get to know John, Marie, and Ella better- I'm assuming if Will went to Paly, he'd go to Menlo with them.

Edited July 11, 2012 by methodwriter85

[sat8997]

I suspect there may be multiple reasons for why JJ is pissed off at Will. The biggest issue, though, is attention. JJ wants everyone to be focused on him, so when Will goes off and sleeps with guys, it steals his limelight. Even JJ would see that was a little to vain to say, so he's probably couching it in terms of being 'embarrassed.'

 

 

 

I'm not allowed to be rainbows and sunshine, not when my editor is the Queen of the Dark Side.

 

 

 

That's one possible parallel. Another is Janice/Brad and Jeanine/Will. Another possibility is there's no parallel at all.

 

 

 

Please do not bother Jeremy with facts.

 

[PrivateTim]

These are interesting clues.

 

Daddydavek (Chapter 50 Review)

 

JJ & Jeanine. Uptight and not fun to be around. Will may still be Paly bound.

 

 

Reply from Mark Arbour (author)

 

Smile.

PrivateTimm (Chapter 50 Review)

 

So I forget, are Brad and Jeannie legally married? I think Jeannie needs more time at Shady Pines.... maybe permanently.

 

I do think Will continues to show some bad judgment, especially with Evan and maybe even Shane. It is like he doesn't care about the impact that association with them could have on them, only on what is going to please him. It is more of the same self indulgent Will that bugged me when he ran away.

 

I still don't see Will giving up Malibu and surfing and Ryan or his other H-W friends for Paly even if Jeannie is being crazy.

 

 

Reply from Mark Arbour (author)

 

Brad and Jeanine aren't married.

 

I really think that Will is just being a teenager. It's really up to Evan and Shane to worry about that, and the impact. But you'll see that Will does care.

 

So it sounds like Mr. Arbour is setting up Will to move to Paly to give JJ some space, but I think Brad would kick out Jeannie (while buying her a house in the Colony) rather than let Will move because of her or JJ.

[B1ue]

This may be a shocker to you but BMW, Mercedes Benz and Range Rover are all European cars

 

I was also going to point that out when Jeremy first suggested "A mini or a European car" and you said no, but I let it go.

 

But I will say that if JJ wants to stand out, why would he get something relatively inexpensive and easy to get like a Mini, when the entire world is available to him? His dad is so stupidly rich, and recently enough has been given crap about not paying enough attention to him, that JJ could ask for absolutely anything to be shipped to his doorstep, and between Brad and Stef they'd make it happen.

 

So it sounds like Mr. Arbour is setting up Will to move to Paly to give JJ some space, but I think Brad would kick out Jeannie (while buying her a house in the Colony) rather than let Will move because of her or JJ.

 

No, I don't think Brad would do that. That'd touch off way too many bad memories, and would smack of exiling JJ for daring to complain. I don't think JJ is out of line here. His response, maybe, but not the anger and frustration itself. It's Will that's unintentionally causing the problems. Will would be the appropriate one to exit from the situation, and Brad would realize that just moving out without moving schools is just asking for more problems, should a move be required at all.

 

But I don't think we're there yet. We'll have to see how things go.

Edited July 11, 2012 by B1ue

[methodwriter85]

But I will say that if JJ wants to stand out, why would he get something relatively inexpensive and easy to get like a Mini, when the entire world is available to him? His dad is so stupidly rich, and recently enough has been given crap about not paying enough attention to him, that JJ could ask for absolutely anything to be shipped to his doorstep, and between Brad and Stef they'd make it happen.

It's not about the car being easy to get; it's about the car not being something that a lot of the SoCal kids would be rocking. I was thinking mini-Cooper because, like I said, it's fitting for JJ's personality- small, compact,Euro-centered, flashy colors, kind of odd.

 

Maybe he'd get something classic, like an Austin Healy? What kind of car are you thinking of, Blue?

 

No, I don't think Brad would do that. That'd touch off way too many bad memories, and would smack of exiling JJ for daring to complain. I don't think JJ is out of line here. His response, maybe, but not the anger and frustration itself. It's Will that's unintentionally causing the problems. Will would be the appropriate one to exit from the situation, and Brad would realize that just moving out without moving schools is just asking for more problems, should a move be required at all..

 

I do think it would be good for Will to go off to Palo Alto and attend Menlo School with John, Marie, and Ella, at least for a semester so people can get things sorted out. Of course, it would be hilarious if Will STILL was having a lot of problems, and he started to realize that it might not be his parents that are entirely the problem here.

 

Back to the reviews, I stated that I didn't think JJ would ever wind up inviting Will to come out to his competitions, and Mark responded with:

 

I think JJ will definitely invite Will back. I think part of the dynamic is that Will serves as JJ's whipping boy. Besides, I think that if Will wants to go, there's not much JJ can do to stop him

I didn't really read Will and JJ's relationship as having that "whipping boy" element to it. Mainly because Will has never given into JJ's tantrums or humored them, or taken any of his crap, which isn't how a "whipping boy" relationship goes. And if we're talking about how the parents treat them, with the exception of Jeanine, Brad and Robbie don't let JJ slide on everything while piling on Will. Because really, other than JJ being a bit of a bitch, he's a generally harmless kid who's pretty much kept in line by that dream of being on a Wheaties box someday. Other than the fact that JJ's been a bitch to Gathan, seriously, what exactly would Brad and Robbie have to get concerned about? Meanwhile, Will toked up and got wasted on his school camping trip, trashed his parent's house and went on a vacation to Hawaii, and everyone felt sad and contrite when he got back, and he got rewarded with a fun trip to Norway, ostensibly to be supportive of his brother. Exactly how would you characterize everything that's happened lately as Will getting dumped on by his parents while JJ gets away with murder?

 

I'm just really not seeing how or why JJ and Will's relationship can be described as "JJ the Prince and Will His Whipping Boy". That just doesn't jibe with what you've depicted so far in CAP. It's more like "Will the Golden Boy Prince Everyone Fawns Over and The Bitchy Ignored Middle Child No One Cares About."

Edited July 12, 2012 by methodwriter85

[B1ue]

It's not about the car being easy to get; it's about the car not being something that a lot of the SoCal kids would be rocking. I was thinking mini-Cooper because, like I said, it's fitting for JJ's personality- small, compact,Euro-centered, flashy colors, kind of odd.

 

You're asking the absolute wrong person for advice on what a bitchy rich teen that wants to stand out would buy. My favorite car so far has been a pick-up truck. And not some lifted or lowered prettified dickmobile either. Mine looked exactly like it was, a never-washed rustbucket (though good running) hand-me-down that had 200000 miles on it and had tagged eight deer, innumerable rodents and avians, and one mountain lion.

 

I miss my pickup. I will own one again one day. Not one just like it, sadly, but another.

 

I'm just really not seeing how or why JJ and Will's relationship can be described as "JJ the Prince and Will His Whipping Boy". That just doesn't jibe with what you've depicted so far in CAP. It's more like "Will the Golden Boy Prince Everyone Fawns Over and The Bitchy Ignored Middle Child No One Cares About."

 

Will seems to. Care about JJ, that is. He doesn't express it in the same way that Jeanine does, but Will has no real reason to put up with JJ's bullshit. Yet he does anyways, even if they're utterly baffled by the rules the other follows. To him, that he'd eventually make a play for Evan was quite obvious and should have been assumed by JJ, and to JJ "I don't want to deal with your crap" should have meant WIll should have had the sense to go chase other boys.

Edited July 12, 2012 by B1ue

[Mark Arbour]

You're asking the absolute wrong person for advice on what a bitchy rich teen that wants to stand out would buy. My favorite car so far has been a pick-up truck. And not some lifted or lowered prettified dickmobile either. Mine looked exactly like it was, a never-washed rustbucket (though good running) hand-me-down that had 200000 miles on it and had tagged eight deer, innumerable rodents and avians, and one mountain lion.

 

I miss my pickup. I will own one again one day. Not one just like it, sadly, but another.

Dickmobile.

 

 

Will seems to. Care about JJ, that is. He doesn't express it in the same way that Jeanine does, but Will has no real reason to put up with JJ's bullshit. Yet he does anyways, even if they're utterly baffled by the rules the other follows. To him, that he'd eventually make a play for Evan was quite obvious and should have been assumed by JJ, and to JJ "I don't want to deal with your crap" should have meant WIll should have had the sense to go chase other boys.

 

This is one of the best commentaries on their relationship I've seen.

[rjo]

Relationships between brothers can be very difficult. Also being the middle child is not a easy position. The major problem with looking at this relationship , the one between JJ and Will, is that we don't know what JJ really thinks. We have gotten inside Will's mind, but not JJ's. If we look at when Will ran away, and even before that JJ was very supportive. Maybe it was in JJ's self interest to do that. Brad and Robbie weren't there for him too. I believe they love each other, however at times they have a very hard time putting that into words or actions. Part of that is their age, and part is the family they live in. Will is Brad's son and Stefan's grandson. Both of them have not been celibate in the past. I have just reread some of the Brad's past history so we can say that Brad can many partners in the past. Who or what is JJ? So far we can only guess, Why is he reacting the way he does? I think reacting is the best word for it. Then throwing Jeanine into the mix only muddies the water. I believe she is much sicker than everyone thought. Her interaction will Will was hard to understand. Maybe she is causing some the JJ's problems too. Long ago Claire liked Brad better than Ace. Because Brad treating her as a person and Ace did not. I don't think JJ understands that yet, but Jeanine is holding him back. She doesn't want him to grow up. If he does she will lose her last child, or maybe better said control of her last child. I don't think she ever had Darius and now he's gone. Will was never totally her's, more Brad's kid. JJ is it. In her mind her only and last kid. What else does she have? Her whole purpose was been to raise these kids. I understand Maddy is there but there are people who can take care of Maddy. Brad and Robbie have big important jobs. What does Jeanine have? Her relationship is not what she wants. She sees no purpose in her life. That is a frightening thought for anyone, even people who are a lot stronger

Edited July 13, 2012 by rjo

[methodwriter85]

I don't think JJ understands that yet, but Jeanine is holding him back. She doesn't want him to grow up. If he does she will lose her last child, or maybe better said control of her last child. I don't think she ever had Darius and now he's gone. Will was never totally her's, more Brad's kid. JJ is it. In her mind her only and last kid. What else does she have? Her whole purpose was been to raise these kids. I understand Maddy is there but there are people who can take care of Maddy. Brad and Robbie have big important jobs. What does Jeanine have? Her relationship is not what she wants. She sees no purpose in her life. That is a frightening thought for anyone, even people who are a lot stronger

 

I definitely agree that in a lot of ways, JJ was "hers" in a way that Darius and Will weren't. He was the preemie newborn with a crack-addicted mother and a dad for whom his existence was an inconvience to be ignored. How could your heart not go out to him? Brad didn't develop those paternal instincts for JJ in the same immediate way that Jeanine developed those maternal instincts for him, and he was, for the most part, wholly her child all throughout his childhood.

 

I think once JJ became a figure skater, Jeanine's identity went into being a figure skater mom, and her whole being was dedicated towards making sure that JJ's a future Olympian. I mean, remember when Jeanine was telling Brad that JJ was considering dropping out of school to fully pursue skating? I don't doubt that Jeanine had something to do with putting that idea into JJ's head.

 

Although I don't think it's just Jeanine that doesn't want JJ to grow up- I think JJ himself isn't ready to grow up yet, either. He's in an environment that encourages you to at least put on the image of childlike innocence. And it's easy for JJ to do stay that way, because he's a latebloomer. Which makes a great contrast- you've got Will the 14-year old who wants to be 20, and you've got JJ the 14-year old who wants to stay 12.

Edited July 13, 2012 by methodwriter85

[GLH]

Dickmobile.

I thought it was common knowledge that any pickup that had oversized tires and a lift kit was generally referred to as "redneck penis enhancement", or compensating. Edited July 14, 2012 by GLH

[Westie]

Anyone else missing wade? Too much teen drama for my taste I guess....

[PrivateTim]

Wade who?

[Mark Arbour]

Anyone else missing wade? Too much teen drama for my taste I guess....

 

Then you'll want to relax for a few chapters. We have to get through Norway, then we'll switch back to Wade for the elections. Here's how it's looking:

 

Chapters 51 and 52: Will

Chapter 53: Wade

Chapters 54 and 55: Will

Chapters 56 and 57: Wade

[Daddydavek]

StoriReder had an interesting take on the Paternity characters in a review of Chapter 50. It's worth a read. (And the 400th review!)

 

However, his line quoted below has a word that looks glaringly out of place!

 

"It’s an interesting spin on the title Paternity you have here Mark, as the final stage of raising a child, as they reach and then cross the point where they no longer need the constant neutering and supervision of a young child, is the recognition of the type of adult person that child becomes."

 

The bolding was mine and I'm sure from the context of his remarks he meant nurturing. (At least I hope so!)

[Mari]

Then you'll want to relax for a few chapters. We have to get through Norway, then we'll switch back to Wade for the elections. Here's how it's looking:

 

Chapters 51 and 52: Will

Chapter 53: Wade

Chapters 54 and 55: Will

Chapters 56 and 57: Wade

 

 

I like this schedule! I like Wade's POV too since it does add a more mature outlook to the storylines and has an interesting political twist that we don't see with Will. I also like the way we can see Wade's view of Will and vice versa. Will is still right up there with Step and JP for me as absolute favorites, can do no wrong

[MJ85]

JJ needs a good dose of falling flat on his face - whether figuratively speaking, literally speaking, or both.

[methodwriter85]

JJ's not even 15 yet. There's plenty of time for that. Even then, I hope he stays a fierce diva bitch.

 

My thoughts:

 

1. It does seem like Jeanine's issues go way deeper than just

post-partum depression. On one hand, the cool chick we met in Man In

Motion doesn't seem like someone that would become that cold and distant

to her son. On the other hand...I can almost see how living as a

glorified live-in nanny for 15 years would slowly turn her bitter.

 

It almost feels like Jeanine is being prepped for an exit...I can't see

how she redeems herself at this point. Isidore and Brad had their

differences but Jeanine just seems to hate Will. It makes me think of Mary Tyler Moore's cold rage towards Timothy Hutton in Ordinary People.

 

2. Why didn't they bring up bisexuality as a possibility for JJ? I got

Mark's reasoning when he said Brad wouldn't think of bisexuality when he

was musing on JJ's sexuality in Millenium, but there's no way two openly

gay teenaged guys in 2000 wouldn't have thought of bi. I knew what the term "bi" was when I was 9 and watching My So-Called Life in 1994. There's no way Will wouldn't think of bi as a possibility. Especially since

Will's buddy Gathan is bisexual himself, and he's not a "confused" bastard.

 

3. JJ's attitude towards Evan...god, that kid is hard to figure out. It

might just be that JJ's bitchmeter is always on, even when it comes to

people he likes. I think JJ is probably charming in a superficial way-

traces of the happy cheerful kid he was pre-skating- but he can't

maintain interest in people long enough to be an actual friend. And

because Evan is competition for JJ(Evan places second at this meet), I

can see that the diva act being on high.

 

4. Claire, once again, being the voice of reason. I loved that.

 

5. Also, JJ has a relationship with Brad? Really? Wasn't the whole point

of Will slamming Brad and Robbie and shaming them into going to Norway

in the first place acknowledgement of the fact that JJ DIDN'T have much

of a relationship with his Dads? Wasn't the whole Norway trip Brad

basically acknowledging that he had to work on both Will and JJ? Then

again, teenaged pity parties aren't always the most logical.

[Mark Arbour]

JJ's not even 15 yet. There's plenty of time for that. Even then, I hope he stays a fierce diva bitch.

 

My thoughts:

 

1. It does seem like Jeanine's issues go way deeper than just

post-partum depression. On one hand, the cool chick we met in Man In

Motion doesn't seem like someone that would become that cold and distant

to her son. On the other hand...I can almost see how living as a

glorified live-in nanny for 15 years would slowly turn her bitter.

 

It almost feels like Jeanine is being prepped for an exit...I can't see

how she redeems herself at this point. Isidore and Brad had their

differences but Jeanine just seems to hate Will. It makes me think of Mary Tyler Moore's cold rage towards Timothy Hutton in Ordinary People.

Mental illnesses are complex and scary things. We'll see how this one resolves itself. The human ability to forgive is a wonderful thing.

 

2. Why didn't they bring up bisexuality as a possibility for JJ? I got

Mark's reasoning when he said Brad wouldn't think of bisexuality when he

was musing on JJ's sexuality in Millenium, but there's no way two openly

gay teenaged guys in 2000 wouldn't have thought of bi. I knew what the term "bi" was when I was 9 and watching My So-Called Life in 1994. There's no way Will wouldn't think of bi as a possibility. Especially since

Will's buddy Gathan is bisexual himself, and he's not a "confused" bastard.

I don't think they're really thinking about it hard enough to go down that road. It wasn't like they were psychoanalyzing him. Jeff used the term "straight" to describe his perception of JJ, but neither one of them concluded that he was gay. They got their point across without using too many labels.

 

3. JJ's attitude towards Evan...god, that kid is hard to figure out. It

might just be that JJ's bitchmeter is always on, even when it comes to

people he likes. I think JJ is probably charming in a superficial way-

traces of the happy cheerful kid he was pre-skating- but he can't

maintain interest in people long enough to be an actual friend. And

because Evan is competition for JJ(Evan places second at this meet), I

can see that the diva act being on high.

I think the stress at these competitions brings out the worst in him.

 

 

4. Claire, once again, being the voice of reason. I loved that.

Yep

 

 

5. Also, JJ has a relationship with Brad? Really? Wasn't the whole point

of Will slamming Brad and Robbie and shaming them into going to Norway

in the first place acknowledgement of the fact that JJ DIDN'T have much

of a relationship with his Dads? Wasn't the whole Norway trip Brad

basically acknowledging that he had to work on both Will and JJ? Then

again, teenaged pity parties aren't always the most logical.

JJ has a relationship with Brad. It may not be a good one, but it's a relationship.

[MJ85]

JJ's not even 15 yet. There's plenty of time for that. Even then, I hope he stays a fierce diva bitch.

 

My thoughts:

 

1. It does seem like Jeanine's issues go way deeper than just

post-partum depression. On one hand, the cool chick we met in Man In

Motion doesn't seem like someone that would become that cold and distant

to her son. On the other hand...I can almost see how living as a

glorified live-in nanny for 15 years would slowly turn her bitter.

 

It almost feels like Jeanine is being prepped for an exit...I can't see

how she redeems herself at this point. Isidore and Brad had their

differences but Jeanine just seems to hate Will. It makes me think of Mary Tyler Moore's cold rage towards Timothy Hutton in Ordinary People.

 

2. Why didn't they bring up bisexuality as a possibility for JJ? I got

Mark's reasoning when he said Brad wouldn't think of bisexuality when he

was musing on JJ's sexuality in Millenium, but there's no way two openly

gay teenaged guys in 2000 wouldn't have thought of bi. I knew what the term "bi" was when I was 9 and watching My So-Called Life in 1994. There's no way Will wouldn't think of bi as a possibility. Especially since

Will's buddy Gathan is bisexual himself, and he's not a "confused" bastard.

 

3. JJ's attitude towards Evan...god, that kid is hard to figure out. It

might just be that JJ's bitchmeter is always on, even when it comes to

people he likes. I think JJ is probably charming in a superficial way-

traces of the happy cheerful kid he was pre-skating- but he can't

maintain interest in people long enough to be an actual friend. And

because Evan is competition for JJ(Evan places second at this meet), I

can see that the diva act being on high.

 

4. Claire, once again, being the voice of reason. I loved that.

 

5. Also, JJ has a relationship with Brad? Really? Wasn't the whole point

of Will slamming Brad and Robbie and shaming them into going to Norway

in the first place acknowledgement of the fact that JJ DIDN'T have much

of a relationship with his Dads? Wasn't the whole Norway trip Brad

basically acknowledging that he had to work on both Will and JJ? Then

again, teenaged pity parties aren't always the most logical.

 

It really seems like JJ's becoming nothing more than pure "diva" on two legs, with absolutely nothing else to his character at all, lately. Wouldn't that be a pre-cursor to falling flat on his face? It's how he handle picking himself back up that really matters.

 

2) JJ and Will are not you. In any case, I'm only two months older than you, and I didn't know what "bi" was at age 9, nor had I even heard the word, nor was I even watching So-Called Life. You mention Gathan...well, when was the last time Will even thought of Gathan for any reason?

 

3) I touched on this with the whole JJ being completely diva with nothing else to him thing. But maybe that's a side effect of Norway going on, and once it's over, he'll come unwound.

[centexhairysub]

Well, this chapter once again showed why Claire is the true successor to JP... Claire has always been my favorite person in the series with the exception of JP and Stef. I have always thought she was the glue that held her generation together more than anyone else. In many ways she is the one most like JP. I have made that argument before only to have someone point out that we don't really see enough of her to know, well, I think we should have her in every chapter... LOL... She sort of reminds me of Connie Corleone, more from the books than the movies; although I thought Talia Shire was great in them... Claire is the sort of person that in the end will do whatever it takes to protect her family...

 

I am really conflicted about JJ. On one hand, I do understand JJ's annoyance with Will's sex life seeming to interfere or overshadow his own life; but on the otherhand, Will has been the one most often there for him when he really needed someone. JJ is going to truly regret it if there is a rupture between him and Will.

 

I think that Brad and Stef would have both acted when Jeanine and Will had their confrontation but it happened so fast and escalated so quickly that they were somewhat caught off guard. I think they were probably so shocked by Jeanine's behaviour that it caused them to freeze for that moment...

 

Jeanine has real problems... That being said, mental illness is often so insidious that you often can't know how or what to do to help those suffering from it. I do think that Will in the end will make an effort to repair the relationship.

 

I was really sort of against Jeff when the last few episodes started because of how he acted with Wade but after getting some of his backstory and seeing how he is with Will, I am fast changing my mind. I still think that there is more to his relationship or issues with Matt than we have seen but that maybe for a different story...

[MJ85]

Well, this chapter once again showed why Claire is the true successor to JP... Claire has always been my favorite person in the series with the exception of JP and Stef. I have always thought she was the glue that held her generation together more than anyone else. In many ways she is the one most like JP. I have made that argument before only to have someone point out that we don't really see enough of her to know, well, I think we should have her in every chapter... LOL... She sort of reminds me of Connie Corleone, more from the books than the movies; although I thought Talia Shire was great in them... Claire is the sort of person that in the end will do whatever it takes to protect her family...

 

I am really conflicted about JJ. On one hand, I do understand JJ's annoyance with Will's sex life seeming to interfere or overshadow his own life; but on the otherhand, Will has been the one most often there for him when he really needed someone. JJ is going to truly regret it if there is a rupture between him and Will.

 

I think that Brad and Stef would have both acted when Jeanine and Will had their confrontation but it happened so fast and escalated so quickly that they were somewhat caught off guard. I think they were probably so shocked by Jeanine's behaviour that it caused them to freeze for that moment...

 

Jeanine has real problems... That being said, mental illness is often so insidious that you often can't know how or what to do to help those suffering from it. I do think that Will in the end will make an effort to repair the relationship.

 

I was really sort of against Jeff when the last few episodes started because of how he acted with Wade but after getting some of his backstory and seeing how he is with Will, I am fast changing my mind. I still think that there is more to his relationship or issues with Matt than we have seen but that maybe for a different story...

 

With Jeanine...I can't help but think that maybe she just can't be fixed. She did receive electroshock as part of her previous treatment...I have to think that's playing a part somewhere. There's only so much that can be done to try to "fix" her, if the issues will just keep coming back again, and again, and again..so most likely, Jeremy would be right in that Mark's prepping her for exit.

 

As for Jeff...we haven't seen him around Wade at all since their fallout, which was only a few weeks ago in the timeline. It wouldn't be that hard for them to talk things out pretty soon, and unless Mark's planning to end this one with the election, there's even room for it to happen in this story.

[PrivateTim]

Help my memory here. Isn't Will Jeannie's natural child and JJ the adopted son of Bitty's? I mean I get that JJ is the only person who actually needs Jeannie, but I'd think there is more maternal instinct there than we have seen so far. I get Brad's mother's antipathy towards him since he was a reminder to her of the fling/affair she had with his father and she transferred her feeling for the father to Brad, but Jeannie is different.

 

Of course JJ has a relationship with Robbie and Brad,as much or more than most 14 year old kids of two high powered working parents. Just because it hasn't been a big topic doesn't mean it doesn't exist. We haven't seen a lot about the academic side of Brad and Robbie since graduating college, but both went to very high powered institutions with very strong alumni groups, especially Princeton with its eating halls, and to me it is inconceivable that both haven't maintained relations with the universities and fellow alums, but there just isn't space in the stories to show every aspect of their daily lives and interactions. We just have time and space to see slivers. I do think that two Ivy League fathers (with a grandfather who is a department chair and the second most prestigious university in the Bay Area) would be on their kids like white on rice about academics and their futures.

 

There have been comments in the past about Darius not being a scholar, but that can't be true. He got into a service academy that has very high standards and then he went to Santa Clara that while it isn't Yale, Princeton or Cal, is a hard school to get into with a good academic reputation and his decision wasn't based on being turned down by Cal or UCLA, but rather than on being close to his girlfriend.

 

Have Brad and Robbie been all over JJ's skating? No, but it has just gotten serious lately in the last year to eighteen months and there has been a lot going on. I do think JJ will come to regret driving a wedge between Will and himself, particularly if Jeannie goes away again and now Will, his best backer besides her, is estranged from him.

 

I don't find Stef's attitude unusual. I think he is a bit frustrated with his 14 year old grandson who thinks he is 24, but refuses to grow, mature and think before he goes off the deep end.

 

I think Will needs to realize how much he needs his family and he can't keep doing things to push them away. I hope Jeff reveals more to Will about what it is REALLY like to have "no parents" or family that give a shit about you and how he came to live in a youth shelter. We have seen flashes of Will recognizing this, but not the full slap in the face reality of Jeff's life or the other kids in Father Tim's care.

[Daddydavek]

Pvt. Tim makes some very valid points.

 

Jeanine however, is a mental case and has been for sometime. She should not be in charge of any aspect of any child's life as she is barely in charge of her own and everyone in that family should be clearly aware of that and make her aware that her job is get better control of herself. Not control others.

 

I think this feeds into Mark's theme about paternity. The men in this family have to step it up and really examine the roles of the extended family.

 

Claire's intervention with Will worked in that he is beginning to realize he has to take into account the consequences on the family. However, she too has not quite realized that asking a young teen to "fix" his relationship with a psychologically impaired parent is almost laughable. The family in essence is enabling Jeanine's behaviour and that has to be turned around.

[methodwriter85]

Have Brad and Robbie been all over JJ's skating? No, but it has just gotten serious lately in the last year to eighteen months and there has been a lot going on. I do think JJ will come to regret driving a wedge between Will and himself, particularly if Jeannie goes away again and now Will, his best backer besides her, is estranged from him.

 

If Will does wind up going to Menlo School in Paly, I think it would be a pretty good thing for him and JJ as brothers. When you're in the same grade and in the same school, it's really, really hard not to be biting each other's heads off. I've seen that a lot of times. It'll suck having wasted all that Harvard-Westlake research and development we did, though.

 

In any event, if Robbie does go through with trying to ban Jeanine from JJ's career...holy hell, I'd hate to be Robbie because the claws are going to come out.

 

In terms of "JJ the Empty Diva" stuff, I don't doubt for a second that Mark is going to add layers to the guy, but as it's only 2000 and Mark seems like he has a hell of a lot more stories planned, you can't develop JJ too much or you won't have anywhere to go with him. I do feel like 2006 is going to be a pivotal year for JJ- he's 20, it's the Olympics,and if he doesn't make these Olympics when he's at his peak, it's not likely he'll ever be good enough for the Olympics. How he deals with that should be pretty interesting.

 

As for the Darius stuff, I can see your point- but the other thing to keep in mind is that sometimes, people just aren't meant to be major scholars. Not everyone has that capacity, even if they try hard at school and get good grades. Just because someone's in a scholarly family doesn't mean they're actually scholar material themselves. It doesn't make them stupid- they're just not wired that way. Darius seems like he's very emotionally intelligent, in terms of being able to read people, which isn't something Will exactly excels at, and JJ flat-out sucks at. Even though Will was trying to be an ass in trying to call Darius stupid, I thought there was likely a kernal of truth there- that he's just not as smart as Will. The jury's still out on JJ- I think he probably could do well in school if he wanted to- but I could also see him thinking "Well I'm going to be a professional figure skater so what do I need with college?"

 

And I'm relenting on the relationship stuff with Brad- they do have one, just not a particuarly tight relationship because there's just not that much JJ has in common with Brad. And because, as Darius pointed out, each parent took a shine to one of the kids.

Edited July 15, 2012 by methodwriter85