Odyssey

[ricky]

A fantastic Chapter Mark and the timing was perfect. I actually had time to read it right that moment! A rarity.

 

Kingsdale's presence with his father was something I didn't expect. A nice touch. It'll be good to hear how that has changed things for him. And Winkler! How wonderful of a reunion. He still needs a gold watch for years of service and for him to keep better track of Granger.

 

Seems Granger's libido is going to get a welcome workout from all my favorites. It sounds like there may be a little royal trist with Freddie "in house" so to speak at Windsor. And the Prince of Wales stepping up. Now that really places him and his family in a powerful position.

 

Now, what does Freddie have to say. And we've not heard from Arthur. Now, how much will Granger make off of the smuggling by buying all that he brought back with him.

[ricky]

And I just noticed that ranger double booked himself after visiting the prince! Both Freddie Cavendish and Winkler now have appointments with his lordship. And What of Arthur? There is still the matter of Jardines. Was he killed? Can he be reconciled with London? With Arthur? A visit with the Duke of Clarence may be in order. Something tells me Granger's going to be sitting on one cheek a lot this week. And Grinning a great deal.

 

And what of his privateer? Has it brought fruit? And what about Ranger? Is he now eating Rats on Santa Clarita? And the mention of Mr Llewellyn means he's returning to the series. (At least we hope the little warlock makes an appearance.) And Winkler will have to confirm Granger's suspicions about Calvert and Gatling won't he. It'll once again cement Winkler's loyalties. 

So will Jacobs and Winkler be invited to join Cavendish and Granger in the baths tonight when he returns from the Prince's place?

 

And what will happen at the meeting between Glouster and Granger? It sounds like there is something further to be said. It would have been more interesting if Glouster's child had been a male. As a female there will be less that needs to be done. It's like Glouster got a freebie. No higher education, no military arrangements. And not legally being his, Glouster won't even have to cough up a dowry will he? Westie or someone in the know. How will that work?

[Daddydavek]

I can't think of anything that Ricky forgot except the guys at the Abbey and oh, Granger's new country house on the island.....

[ricky]

I can't think of anything that Ricky forgot except the guys at the Abbey and oh, Granger's new country house on the island.....

 

Oh right you are! Missed that one completely. Now that Maidstone is dead does that make Jackson free again? His accuser is dead. I'm sure he will remain with Granger. Perhaps he can offer some assistance for Caroline? A second more promising opinion perhaps? We never found our why the king invited Caroline into his chambers either did we?

[rjo]

I have a feeling that there will be a number of more chapters, I hope so. So far we have only seen the beginning of his homecoming. The Prince of Wales, Spencer are only the beginning. Time at Windsor maybe another gift from King? Getting his crew together and getting a new ship will come. The mob with not let him waste away. He is too good. For the first time other than Travis's death, I could be in the room with them see the interaction. I believe this has became your best story ever. Let us face it, it is a lot easier putting yourself into a story in 2001 than one in 1798 in England, but you have made that easy.  The last three chapters have been a joy. See him reunite with his wife. You could feel the love! Breaking all the rules to hug his father at court. Seeing Freddy. And then what I was waiting for seeing his brave loyal servant, Winkler, It was perfect, George knew how much they cared about each other. So much different than his last homecoming. In few more years, William maybe able to go to sea with his father. Now at home, surrounded by all his friends and family, honored by king and country he could become a country gentleman. But that is not George. The sea will call again, Spencer with be forced to find a bigger and better ship and he will be off.  our Hero!!  Words can not express what a great story this is. To bring us to that time, to make it real, so real we wonder if this is fact or fiction. Thanks for your second story, and how excellent it has become.

Edited January 5, 2014 by rjo

[ricky]

Well, I'll have to disagree on one point. I think the next chapter will probably be meaty and the final for this book. The Odessey ended when George returned home. The loose ends to tie up are few. The new positions and the time in London will be a good foundation for the next book allowing Mark to build the fabric of historic fiction and the mission for the next ship. And speaking of the next ship. I would see another Frigate in the works. He's too young to be saddled with a first rate. And everyone knows that the wolf of the seas is the place to be. And with Cavendish holding the King's ear as well as his purse strings, I suspect his next command to be a real prize and a real gem.

 

It might be interesting if they decide not to exchange him. Could he then resign his commission and be a privateer? Somehow I think he could make a great go of it. And be beholding to no one. Of course he would always be willing to attend the surreptitious whims of his sovereign or the First Lord. That could also make them wish to exchange him quicker were rumor to arrive in France. At least in the Admiralty there would be some control and recourse against him.

 

Lord Kingsdale was an interesting readmission to the story as was Mr Llewellyn. And since Mark doesn't clutter a story with red herrings one could surmise that there is some naughtiness about. A couple little loose ends to tie up that we can all look forward to.

 

I think that Georges kiss to his wife and embrace to his father only endeared George to his sovereign even more. Remember that the King is big on family matters and George honored him by coming to see him before even his wife. To the King's vanity this had to be a huge stroke. And the kiss only told the king he respected him but also felt familial enough to show his affections in front of God King and Country. The gravity of such an action coupled with his raising the newest royal grandchild as his own had to move the king's heart significantly.

 

The key issues as I see them left to deal with are of course, Jardines and Arthur, the new home o the Isle of White and the monies to be made on the contraband. Freddie and Davina have to complicate things enough that Birdie is even preferred. Oh and we have to see that the child they bore is blond and blue just like George. But perhaps with just enough facial structure to keep them guessing. Caroline will need to be debriefed as to Granger's acceptance of Gatling and Calvert. He has to meet with Spencer, Glouster and Clarence yet. I suspect the King will also want to meet with him privately as well. And has anyone managed to push through that act calling for the beheading of Fox yet?

 

I suspect the next chapter will be meaty or possibly split in two. But I suspect it will answer all the open questions and leave us looking for the next book to answer the new questions he will present.

Just my suspicions.

[ricky]

Oh and when William is old enough to go to sea, it'll be on a ship other than Granger's lest jealousy and favoritism be suspected. And of course in only a year or so he'll start to be carried on someone's books. I think it's safe to assume it won't be on a Wilcox's or Mann's ship.

 

And Westie, never answered the question. What are the expected obligations for Glouster for the bastardette as opposed to what they would be for just a royal bastard?

[Mark Arbour]

You asked some questions, and I've been traveling.  Sorry I didn't respond sooner. 

 

It might be interesting if they decide not to exchange him. Could he then resign his commission and be a privateer?

 

 

No.  Granger's pledge for parole was not to bear arms against France, so he can't fight as a privateer. 

 

Lord Kingsdale was an interesting readmission to the story as was Mr Llewellyn. And since Mark doesn't clutter a story with red herrings one could surmise that there is some naughtiness about. A couple little loose ends to tie up that we can all look forward to.

 

 

 

 

 

That's true, I usually don't introduce a character only to never hear from him/her again.  But there's no telling when that character will reappear. 

 

 

Oh and when William is old enough to go to sea, it'll be on a ship other than Granger's lest jealousy and favoritism be suspected. And of course in only a year or so he'll start to be carried on someone's books. I think it's safe to assume it won't be on a Wilcox's or Mann's ship.

 

 

It is unlikely that William (or Lord Ryde as he is now known) would be sent to sea.  The eldest son and heir of a peerage would be more likely to enter politics, or perhaps the military.  Or maybe he'll go into the church ( ).  I would expect that if one of Granger's sons followed him into the navy, it would be Alexander. 

Edited January 5, 2014 by Mark Arbour

[rjo]

I am so glad you returned safely.

[ricky]

Thanks Mark,

I forgot that William is now the heir to a title. And how fitting that Lord Ryde would be associated with Granger's peerage. Or should it be Lord Ride?

 

I trust that you left Arizona in good stead. As did I when I left. Well, at least I remembered to turn off the lights.

 

So have you thought about a working title for the next book yet? I know you might be a little gun shy after Mutiney caused such an uproar.

 

And indeed, welcome back. May 2014 keep your prig well oiled.

[Westie]

Sorry, Sorry, Sorry;

 

At Christmas I tend to take a long break and absent myself from the internet a little. While I often slip back to read posts, I try not to post too much. It's all about getting myself on a stress-free and even keel for the start of the year. With some of my health challenges, this becomes especially important.

 

There's been a lot going on, but I will attempt to cover a lot in this post.

 

So... we still have a lot of loose ends. Remember though that what "looks" like a loose end now, might in fact be the start of a story arc for the next book. The quality of this story is probably one of the best in the whole "Bridgemont" series. It has been significantly longer, more detailed and more complex than any of it's predecessors. It has also been, I suspect, much more of a challenge for the author, with a huge amount of research going into it. You may not be aware just quite how much Mark will research seemingly small details of the story.

 

So Granger has at last returned to these shores, and it looks like he will be land-bound for some time. It would be a grave dishonour for him to fight in any wing of the military until he has been exchanged, and one thing we do know about Granger is that he would hate to have a smear on his honour. Luckily though, Arbour has created a situation where Granger will be in the middle of intrigue. He is now a courtier and member of the royal Household. He is actually that rare thing, that cannot exist in the United States - he is a member of all three wings of "sovereignty". Firstly, he is an officer of the crown and personally answerable to the King as Governor and Constable of Windsor. Secondly, in that role of Governor and Constable, he is a Judge of Record and therefore a member of the Judiciary. Finally, as a Member of the House of Peers (house of Lords) he is also a member of the legislative branch. That makes him a powerful political player in his own right.

 

We then have, in addition, his Wife - whose influence has not diminished. A shrewd businesswoman, political player, society hostess and networker (before the days of "networking") she has an independent power base that is not entirely dependant on her husband. We also have the Duke of Bridgemont - Some "old money", with renewed influence and favour with the King.

 

And we have enemies. As I have said before, the Guild did not die with Maidstone. Undoubtedly, there are powerful forces out there who will be none too pleased that they were thwarted by a young upstart such as Granger. We also have those in the Navy who feel that Granger has been rewarded too fast and too far.

 

When we consider Granger's next command, I suspect that Mr Arbour will have to balance LOTS of different considerations. Firstly, there will be Lady Granger, The Earl and Countess, and even the King who would prefer the George stay's closer to home. While supporting his career, they might not be in too much of a rush for Granger to be exchanged. Moreover, those enemies that Granger has accumulated might think it safer if he were on dry land.

 

Ricky mentions that Granger should get another frigate - but if we look at the "whole board" for a moment, his enemies might think it safer that he is assigned to a first rate. A frigate captain has lots of opportunity for glory, whereas the captain of a first rate is tied to the apron strings of the fleet. It LOOKS like an honour, but most post-Captain's would have dreaded being posted to such a ship. There is a lot to balance there. I don't know how this will end up... but I wouldnt think that Granger getting a frigate is a "done deal".

 

When Granger does return to active duty, we know that his mentor - the Earl St Vincent - will soon be returning to command the Home Fleet. Does that mean we will see Granger based out of Spithead or some other home port?

 

I'm not sure the issue of a bastard son is really an issue. There might be some payment - discretely - for the boy and his welfare, but I suspect that now that would be done through the Stipend as Governor and Constable of Windsor. In fact, it might have already happened... We know that Granger got the "unexpected" bonus of the Admiral's share of the prize-money. Beyond that, the natural father would have no obligations to the boy.

 

Freddie and Davina... I'm sure their money issues are not over. Especially if they are tying up their funds in non-liquid form. I suspect even the vast Bridgemont fortune will not be enough to sustain Davina's spending. Speaking of that fortune, it would not be surprising if Granger's own wealth has started to eclipse that of his father in the same way that Bertie's wealth has.

 

Finally, we have Granger's standing with the Brotherhood to consider, and the lobbying on behalf of Jardines. This is something we will return to in the future. The Duke of Clarence will undoubtedly play a role here.

 

That's all I can think of for now. I for one don't mind where this story wraps up, because the next will undoubtedly follow in short order. But for the moment, I think the best I can say is "bravo" to the author for what has been a thrilling tale of adventure, intrigue, battles won and loves lost.

 

West

[ricky]

Thanks so much Westie. One question is slightly screwed. Caroline had a girl, not a boy sired by Glouster. My question was what Glouster's obligations would be for his daughter and how they would be different since it was a female birth instead of a male. In short, what benefits of birth would she be entitled to during her life.

[Westie]

Thanks so much Westie. One question is slightly screwed. Caroline had a girl, not a boy sired by Glouster. My question was what Glouster's obligations would be for his daughter and how they would be different since it was a female birth instead of a male. In short, what benefits of birth would she be entitled to during her life.

Apologies. One of my (endearing ) Faults is that I rarely pay attention to Children. Either in real-life or in stories.

 

As a daughter of a Viscount, the grand-Daughter of one of the premier Earl's of England on one side, and Lord Heathford on the other, she wouldn't exactly be without advantages. More to the point, she will have suitors queuing for her hand, especially with a chunky dowry.

 

It is unlikely - for the sake of honour if nothing else - that the prince would have anything to do with the child.

 

W

[ricky]

Thanks so much for that. That's exactly what I wanted to know. If it was a bastard son then there would be favor like Darby without the conflict of the brothers. As a Royal Bastard "he" would have favor but little credence was given to the females carrying the royal blood.After all, the male's blood can not be corrupted and remains true while the female must be corrupted to procreate. So Glouster got a freebie. How fortunate.

 

A male could bring honor where a female only a cost. A good reason to give him the additional honors. Govenor of Windsor, Col of the Marines. Certainly it would offset the cost of hiding the royal discretion with a thank you stipend to boot. Quite civilized for the time. Even if the discretion was well known.

 

I too see the honors bestowed as part of the story arc for the next book. And I fully agree, it has to be a frigate. I'm not familliar enough with UK history to know what the next great naval events are to determine where he may be stationed. But I don't see him tied to a fleet. That would be like hobbling a race horse.

 

The question for me is really how will Mark keep us entertained on land without this becoming another CAP. Not that there is anything wrong with CAP, not at all, but this is a story of the high seas and swash buckling on land lacks a certain something. For one thing, the ship is a microcosm where Granger controls every aspect save that of the wind. Even with his wealth and power being on land drops Granger quite a few rungs on the food chain. He'll have to depend on those around him in a more direct fashion that them just watching his back.

 

Can Granger exist without a crew to issue orders to? Can he exist under the scrutiny of London wags? Look how irritated he was over the politics of the mutiny. He has a low threshold for gridlock. Especially when the driver next to him is a Wilcox or Fox. And as I recall from comments made some time ago, Fox becomes a person of power shortly and Wilcox is part of the Admiralty. I think the only way Granger will be comfortable on land is if a couple of 9 pounders can be mounted on his well sprung carriage!

[Westie]

I too see the honors bestowed as part of the story arc for the next book. And I fully agree, it has to be a frigate. I'm not familliar enough with UK history to know what the next great naval events are to determine where he may be stationed. But I don't see him tied to a fleet. That would be like hobbling a race horse.

 

 

Well, my point was more that while GRANGER would want a Frigate, there will be a lot of subtle and not-so-subtle power games going on that might work to secure him a first rate, and a posting to the home fleet. While a frigate would be great for us readers, a life less "adventurous" might be something others would fight for - friends and enemies alike (though for differing reasons). A Granting a Frigate is far from a mortal lock.

 

With regards to the fleet, there is very little action in 1799 of note. There is the battle of Abukir, but basically that involved Napoleon looking on helplessly as the Ottomans surrendered to the French. Other than that, not much excitement goes on until the Battle of Copenhagen (April 1801) and the Algeciras Campaign (June-July 1801). These were the last sea-battles of the War of the First Coalition.

 

The question for me is really how will Mark keep us entertained on land without this becoming another CAP. Not that there is anything wrong with CAP, not at all, but this is a story of the high seas and swash buckling on land lacks a certain something. For one thing, the ship is a microcosm where Granger controls every aspect save that of the wind. Even with his wealth and power being on land drops Granger quite a few rungs on the food chain. He'll have to depend on those around him in a more direct fashion that them just watching his back.

 

Can Granger exist without a crew to issue orders to? Can he exist under the scrutiny of London wags? Look how irritated he was over the politics of the mutiny. He has a low threshold for gridlock. Especially when the driver next to him is a Wilcox or Fox. And as I recall from comments made some time ago, Fox becomes a person of power shortly and Wilcox is part of the Admiralty. I think the only way Granger will be comfortable on land is if a couple of 9 pounders can be mounted on his well sprung carriage!

Of course, we don't know what will take place "off story". In CAP, the latest story jumped 6 months after its predecessor ended. If Granger is on land, the crowning glory for us might be that we don't have to see it.

[Mark Arbour]

Well, my point was more that while GRANGER would want a Frigate, there will be a lot of subtle and not-so-subtle power games going on that might work to secure him a first rate, and a posting to the home fleet. While a frigate would be great for us readers, a life less "adventurous" might be something others would fight for - friends and enemies alike (though for differing reasons). A Granting a Frigate is far from a mortal lock.

 

While you probably know this, I'm going to expand on this in case others out there don't know how this worked.  First rates were almost exclusively used as flagships.  Command of a flagship at this juncture was given to a flag captain, appointed by the admiral.  This was an incredible privilege of patronage for an admiral, as it let him pluck one of his favorite lieutenants and make that lieutenant into a post captain by virtue of their appointment to command the flagship.  That's how Berry ended up in command of Vanguard, and how Hardy got his promotion from lieutenant in command of the Mutine to captain of the Vanguard after the Nile.  Those of you who have read Alexander Kent's Bolitho series will note how he was totally unaware of this, by placing the admiral on the ship with the most senior captain.  CS Forester did this as well in Ship of the Line, as Admiral Leighton's flag captain (I think it was Elliot) was a man of great seniority.  My point is that it is highly unlikely that an admiral would eschew this privilege and opportunity to award a favorite lieutenant and appoint Granger (who is already a post captain) in his place.

 

I think that the only way Granger would end up on a first rate is if he were appointed as a staff member to an admiral, probably a commander-in-chief like Jervis, probably as a captain of the fleet.   In that capacity, he would be managing the admiral's staff, and I can't see Granger enjoying that one bit. 

 

With regards to the fleet, there is very little action in 1799 of note. There is the battle of Abukir, but basically that involved Napoleon looking on helplessly as the Ottomans surrendered to the French. Other than that, not much excitement goes on until the Battle of Copenhagen (April 1801) and the Algeciras Campaign (June-July 1801). These were the last sea-battles of the War of the First Coalition.

 

 

This much is true, with one exception:  the siege of Acre.  I was sorely tempted to try and figure out a way for Granger to make it back to the Mediterranean by April so he could help Sir Sidney Smith resist Napoleon's forces.  That would have been an interesting story arc, but virtually impossible at this juncture. 

[Westie]

This much is true, with one exception:  the siege of Acre.  I was sorely tempted to try and figure out a way for Granger to make it back to the Mediterranean by April so he could help Sir Sidney Smith resist Napoleon's forces.  That would have been an interesting story arc, but virtually impossible at this juncture.

Well, Firstly, on the quote you have from me, I said Napoleon looked on helplessly. I meant to Say Nelson. They both start with "N", easy mistake to make.

 

And you are of course right with the Siege of Acre... I had recalled this as a minor event from a Navy point of view... but re-reading the detail it does look a little more interesting than that.

 

Of course, there is court intrigue to have some fun with... Nelson is about to cause quite a scandal in society ...

[ricky]

Thanks for that Mark.

Perhaps the next two years will pass quickly with a bit of political intrigue. He's got an ironworks and a new home, a new position. Lots of options. Being a Col of the Marines, although not really intended to be an actual soldier, perhaps he can see a little land action. I mean, there is the Dutch as well as the Spanish he can still wage war with. Well perhaps not the Spanish as they are allies of the French.

 

A scandal? In England? I can't wait.

[Mark Arbour]

Well, Firstly, on the quote you have from me, I said Napoleon looked on helplessly. I meant to Say Nelson. They both start with "N", easy mistake to make.

 

And you are of course right with the Siege of Acre... I had recalled this as a minor event from a Navy point of view... but re-reading the detail it does look a little more interesting than that.

 

Of course, there is court intrigue to have some fun with... Nelson is about to cause quite a scandal in society ...

 

 Nelson looked on while at the same time he whined and bitched to St. Vincent and the Admiralty about having Smith be sent to Acre and NOT be placed under his command.     Nelson reminds me of one of our modern day divas, who are brilliant but temperamental and insecure. 

[Westie]

Nelson reminds me of one of our modern day divas, who are brilliant but temperamental and insecure.

Did you really just make a direct historical parallel between Admiral Nelson and Cher?

 

This just got too gay even for me....

 

{the video from "turn back time" notwithstanding}

Edited January 5, 2014 by Westie

[ricky]

Did you really just make a direct historical parallel between Admiral Nelson and Cher?

 

This just got too gay even for me....

 

{the video from "turn back time" notwithstanding}

 

No, Lady Gaga

ROTFLMAO 

[sandrewn]

Just wanted to make sure that this forum was still working, I guess it is. Who ever said silence is golden, is full of horse doo doo. I'm wondering if it is a secondment, in which case Cavendish would still be a Lt in the navy. Or has he resigned it?

[Westie]

I'm wondering if it is a secondment, in which case Cavendish would still be a Lt in the navy. Or has he resigned it?

The role is as part of the household, not a military position - it is not a secondment. Whether or not he resigned is another matter and largely depends on Spencer or the King. There were many members of the aristocracy who nominally held military positions without actively engaging them.

 

However, as an officer not on active duty, he would be on half pay at the very most.

[ricky]

Gotta be getting close, right?

[Mark Arbour]

Close