No cheating

A small sized one person IT department costs $100k a year to run?

I dont know too much about American charities, but I know a HUGE amount about the management and running of an IT department, and even more about IT procurement and compliance. If charities are paying such costs for a one man band IT solution, then quite frankly they are loosing money through incompetence.

A small sized one person IT department costs $100k a year to run?

 

I dont know too much about American charities, but I know a HUGE amount about the management and running of an IT department, and even more about IT procurement and compliance. If charities are paying such costs for a one man band IT solution, then quite frankly they are loosing money through incompetence.

The average costs of US non-profit IT has been going up. Salaries for IT personnel goes about 50-60K, then contracts for data warehousing, licenses with Microsoft/Oracle/Cisco (These guys charge for everything you do), and external servers around another 50K, and I have not even factored in the costs of Computer and Telephone equipment refresh, which usually would be considered a capital factor, not a direct expense.

In Europe and UK, you guys have basically created fixed prices for data management based on what I heard about your data regulations, which is not true for the US as we don't regulate data flows.

The average costs of US non-profit IT has been going up. Salaries for IT personnel goes about 50-60K, then contracts for data warehousing, licenses with Microsoft/Oracle/Cisco (These guys charge for everything you do), and external servers around another 50K, and I have not even factored in the costs of Computer and Telephone equipment refresh, which usually would be considered a capital factor, not a direct expense.

 

In Europe and UK, you guys have basically created fixed prices for data management based on what I heard about your data regulations, which is not true for the US as we don't regulate data flows.

You are assuming something about my experience (and about the European and UK procurement model) that isnt true.

I am familiar with the US market, because it's my job to be familiar with it. In the UK we actually use a very similar model as the US use, and in any event companies I have contracted or worked for have US parents. I'm telling you WL, based on my professional expertise, that you are wrong.

You are assuming something about my experience (and about the European and UK procurement model) that isnt true.

 

I am familiar with the US market, because it's my job to be familiar with it. In the UK we actually use a very similar model as the US use, and in any event companies I have contracted or worked for have US parents. I'm telling you WL, based on my professional expertise, that you are wrong.

Based on my accounting experience and the costs associated with non-profit health care organizations, I would counter that you are wrong. Data costs beyond the lower level analyst and data input positions are not cheap, nor is contracting on an annual basis, because these costs are not capitalize. (Now if you were creative, and used a cost to completion method to tie these things together, then yes you could cost them out at a cheaper rate on the books at least. I hate it when people do this as they are basically lying through their teeth, cost of completion method only pushes costs forwards, not account for full contract costs.)

Now all this is also dependent on US geographic area, major metropolitan areas are much more expensive than rural areas in terms of these personnel staff, though not contracting.

Take for example a simple data warehouse, how much does it cost in the UK? I've got a cost quotes of $10K on average in my quotes ranging between $20K Cisco and $6.5K INX systems, a local based IT provider. Even if I chose the lower cost provider, it is a big annual costs to maintain with infrastructure maintenance costs.

In addition, I would like to see how you can place a challenge that the costs of data is inherently the same between both of our systems as European regulators operate on a different precept than American industries.

I've worked in this field far longer than you have in specialty on costs within modern legal and regulatory frameworks as defined by American States and Federal law, along with industry guidelines, I feel you don't understand where costs are coming through within the system.

PS: I graduated at age 20 with bachelors and 21 with master's while working. Even though you're 1 year older than me, I actually have seen a lot more of the industry.

Edit: Need to avoid getting a confrontation over topics in my own blog, unless I want to Rename this WL's Soapbox

Based on my accounting experience and the costs associated with non-profit health care organizations, I would counter that you are wrong. Data costs beyond the lower level analyst and data input positions are not cheap, nor is contracting on an annual basis, because these costs are not capitalize. (Now if you were creative, and used a cost to completion method to tie these things together, then yes you could cost them out at a cheaper rate on the books at least. I hate it when people do this as they are basically lying through their teeth, cost of completion method only pushes costs forwards, not account for full contract costs.)

 

Now all this is also dependent on US geographic area, major metropolitan areas are much more expensive than rural areas in terms of these personnel staff, though not contracting.

 

Take for example a simple data warehouse, how much does it cost in the UK? I've got a cost quotes of $10K on average in my quotes ranging between $20K Cisco and $6.5K INX systems, a local based IT provider. Even if I chose the lower cost provider, it is a big annual costs to maintain with infrastructure maintenance costs.

 

In addition, I would like to see how you can place a challenge that the costs of data is inherently the same between both of our systems as European regulators operate on a different precept than American industries.

 

I've worked in this field far longer than you have in specialty on costs within modern legal and regulatory frameworks as defined by American States and Federal law, along with industry guidelines, I feel you don't understand where costs are coming through within the system.

 

PS: I graduated at age 20 with bachelors and 21 with master's while working. Even though you're 1 year older than me, I actually have seen a lot more of the industry.

 

Edit: Need to avoid getting a confrontation over topics in my own blog, unless I want to Rename this WL's Soapbox

Again, you are making assumptions about when I started in my job, and how long I have worked in the industry.

I'm not going to argue with you on the specific detail. I will just say that you initially quoted "$100k for a one man IT department" - but then you start talking about data analysts and input staff. For all I know you may be right about the charity's costs. what I'm saying is compared to the corporate world for equivalent support, they are paying over the odds.

For the record, on my experience, I did all my qualifications while working, because I couldn't afford university as I was estranged from my parents at that time. I started work at 18, as an analyst/programmer, moving on to specialise in Management Information and Business Intelligence. I took a sidestep into Project Management and head of business unit (accountable for all costs), and then I was head of IT in a division with a £350m turnover. I was later headhunted and relocated to London, and now work in the City. So when you say you have "seen a lot more of the industry", you probably need to stop being so arrogant and consider that other people have been there too.

Again, you are making assumptions about when I started in my job, and how long I have worked in the industry.

 

I'm not going to argue with you on the specific detail. I will just say that you initially quoted "$100k for a one man IT department" - but then you start talking about data analysts and input staff. For all I know you may be right about the charity's costs. what I'm saying is compared to the corporate world for equivalent support, they are paying over the odds.

 

For the record, on my experience, I did all my qualifications while working, because I couldn't afford university as I was estranged from my parents at that time. I started work at 18, as an analyst/programmer, moving on to specialise in Management Information and Business Intelligence. I took a sidestep into Project Management and head of business unit (accountable for all costs), and then I was head of IT in a division with a £350m turnover. I was later headhunted and relocated to London, and now work in the City. So when you say you have "seen a lot more of the industry", you probably need to stop being so arrogant and consider that other people have been there too.

In terms of IT in the "For Profit" world, you have probably seen more, but in terms of the non-profit world, I have been all over, even more than you.

I come from a lower middle class background with a visual disability from birth. I started working in offices as administrative staffer since I was 18, starting at schools, then my college as part of paying off my tuition, and later climbed to be a manager right out of college at age 21. I am at the moment Interim Controller due to my drive towards making sustainability a possibility through operational assessments. Believe me, if IT could be cut down to less than 10%, or 15% in my organization's operating budget $30 million, I would want to implement it immediately.

My first job as an intern/staff was in Finance and Tax Strategy working with hospitals and health systems, all of which is non-profit by the way (In the US, especially in the Northeast, our health systems operate under a non-profit framework). Later, I worked with foundations raising capital for housing projects, food pantries, and children's after school programming figuring out how they can get their books organized properly and get themselves to be sustainable.

Not everything I touched was turned to gold, but in the heart of the 2008-2010 recession, I at least did what many other people did not have any incentive or desire to do, because I enjoy challenges.

I know how these places work and I know how their finances flowed. I also see quotes from them through the boards I have been on and worked with. IT in the US is significantly high portion of overhead costs.

A "one person" IT department is not only one person with a computer, it's one person in charge of several different applications, licenses, and data systems all running within a tight compliance infrastructure that is mandated. You also have part time contractors implementing periodic updates to your systems and back up costs for information. That is a "one person" IT Department, not what you were thinking Westie.

$100K is already a conservative estimate on IT costs in a standard $1 million dollar operating budget organization, it is probably even higher. Westie, when I say I have more experience than you, I mean it in terms of non-profit world, I have seen a lot more, whether it is education, health care, foundations, or charities.

The world of non-profit in the US is complex and unlike their "For Profit" counterparts have fewer choices in terms of operations..

My point is aimed at Non-Profits and Charities, not "For Profit" operations, which you seem to be comparing incorrectly.