[Andrew_Q_Gordon] The Trial of Jordan Colmar

[TrevorTime]

Yay !!!

 

Andy, I knew you were not going to pull a Dom Luka on us !!

 

So two more chapters right? I count an epilogue as a real chapter. And anything quality is always worth the wait.

 

Anyways, now is as good a time as any to explain why I want Jordan to pay. Where I'm from (Maricopa County, AZ), these 4 assholes from a gang called the Devil Dogs (a White Power nazi-type gang) jumped this gay kid outside of a Taco Bell. They didn't pull a "Pete Gregory" on him, but they still messed him up pretty bad. Luckily someone got a license plate number, and to cut right to the chase, the Maricopa County DA charged them all as adults with a hate crime attached. Their new home is now the Florence State Prison in Arizona.

 

So yeah, I have somewhat of a hidden agenda when it comes to these two stories (SS and Trial). If I ever got jumped just because I am gay, I would definitely want justice.

[Daddydavek]

It was worth the wait!

 

I think your writing captured some of the cadence and passion as I really was picturing it all in my mind. While I originally wanted you to finish it all in one go, it was a satisfying chapter. Thanks again for sharing some of your 'real' world experience.

Edited October 26, 2011 by Daddydavek

[Benji]

.............. Yea Q-man!! It was a pleasure to read and I'm looking forward to the 'Verdict' and sentencing. An epilogue to see Jordan's father charged with witness tampering, bribery and the other crimes he has committed.

[Andrew Q Gordon]

DaddyD - thank you for those comments, the image of Martin addressing them was what I was hoping to show.

 

B-man - more charges and a new trial?? there's no pleasing some folks.

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Okay so this is something I was going to save unless and until Jordan gets convicted.

 

In 2008 Pennsylvania's hate crime law was overturned by the PA Supreme Court. Kinda fuzzy on the details, but I think it had to do with it being an enhancement and not a separate crime. - Don't quote me on that.

 

So while the trial speaks of a hate crime, that is my own little fictitious little slice of my little fictitious world where Graydon University exists and the boys live their lives. I bring this up now, because I'm sure someone will write in about how PA doesn't have a hate crime law at this time. So yeah I know, but it makes for better fiction, or at least I thought so.

 

Andy

[comicfan]

Okay Andy you got me to come to your thread. After you posted your little reply I figured I needed to add my two cents. I don't think any of your readers are hoping Jordan gets off. Face it, I think we all read the original and some, I don't think I need to mention who, have read it multiple times. We have come to love and care about the characters you created. Some of us poor schmucks are hoping the jury sees what we know happened and convict the little ..... bugger, We know the justice system isn't perfect but after all of this, we are hoping for a little justice. We might not get it, but hell, like believing in Santa, some of us still hope.

[Benji]

DaddyD - thank you for those comments, the image of Martin addressing them was what I was hoping to show.

 

B-man - more charges and a new trial?? there's no pleasing some folks.

 

[Benji]

Okay Andy you got me to come to your thread. After you posted your little reply I figured I needed to add my two cents. I don't think any of your readers are hoping Jordan gets off. Face it, I think we all read the original and some, I don't think I need to mention who, have read it multiple times. We have come to love and care about the characters you created. Some of us poor schmucks are hoping the jury sees what we know happened and convict the little ..... bugger, We know the justice system isn't perfect but after all of this, we are hoping for a little justice. We might not get it, but hell, like believing in Santa, some of us still hope.

 

 

I think Jordan will likely do at least 25 years, if not more, Daddy's money will not help as Daddy is about to be in big time doo-doo himself.

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Wayne, Benji,

 

Not gonna comment on what happens, but I can say I've finished chapter 7 already. I'm going to review it today and send it off to be looked over. Look for it, on schedule , next Sunday

[Daddydavek]

Well at least we have the MLB game 7 to distract us.....

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Haha Dave, well you do, I tried to watch the game last night and alternately fell asleep or had angry baby to deal with.

 

But go Cards, definitely rooting for Albert and Co.

[Nephylim]

Well, let me put my controvertial tuppence worth in here. The crime was apalling no doubt about that. We've all read about it and we've all felt the desire for justice. But is it justice or is it revenge. Peter picked up his life and moved on. The assault will always be a shadow of him no doubt but he has picked up his life.

 

The attackers are all young men and they deserve to be punished for the crime; of course they do. But do they deserve to give up their lives for it. I'm not talking about capital punishment i am talking about spending the rest of their lives in prison at the tax payer's expense. What good is that doing to society? Where's the productivity.

 

I think that he should certainly do hard time, but not in a place where his hatred is allowed to simmer and to explode again, either when he is released or in the influencing of someone else who is released. But then I think he should be released into the community on conditions that will last forever. Conditions that make it impossible for him to have anyone in his life who is unaware of what he did. I think he should have to report every day to a bail station and justify everything he has done that day. He has to have a list of things to achieve... get a job, community service etc and get no money to live unless he has achieved it. He has to live in accommodation chosen by the bail service so he can never better himself and a portion of his wages has to go to the state. he should not be able to open a bank account other than one administered by the bail service and he should not be allowed to benefit from his father's money... that will punish the family too... the shame.

 

That way he still suffers but he puts something back into the community and into the state.

 

Just my thoughts.

[TrevorTime]

The attackers are all young men and they deserve to be punished for the crime; of course they do. But do they deserve to give up their lives for it. I'm not talking about capital punishment i am talking about spending the rest of their lives in prison at the tax payer's expense. What good is that doing to society? Where's the productivity.

 

Well, the other 5 turds took a plea from what I understand. So they will be more or less middle aged when they get out.

 

But as to Jordan, well, I just can't buy into that train of thought, sorry. He was clearly the mastermind of this whole thing. In my opinion, had he killed Pete, he would not have shown an ounce of remorse. So I feel that he deserves to suffer, he deserves to be someones' prison bitch. And it's total Karma, since he hates homosexuals so much. Now he's going to know how it feels to take it up the ass (sorry for being so graphic).

 

I know both stories are fictional, but I would imagine that gay-bashing happens a lot more often than the media shows us.

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Well, let me put my controvertial tuppence worth in here. The crime was apalling no doubt about that. We've all read about it and we've all felt the desire for justice. But is it justice or is it revenge. Peter picked up his life and moved on. The assault will always be a shadow of him no doubt but he has picked up his life.

 

The attackers are all young men and they deserve to be punished for the crime; of course they do. But do they deserve to give up their lives for it. I'm not talking about capital punishment i am talking about spending the rest of their lives in prison at the tax payer's expense. What good is that doing to society? Where's the productivity.

 

I think that he should certainly do hard time, but not in a place where his hatred is allowed to simmer and to explode again, either when he is released or in the influencing of someone else who is released. But then I think he should be released into the community on conditions that will last forever. Conditions that make it impossible for him to have anyone in his life who is unaware of what he did. I think he should have to report every day to a bail station and justify everything he has done that day. He has to have a list of things to achieve... get a job, community service etc and get no money to live unless he has achieved it. He has to live in accommodation chosen by the bail service so he can never better himself and a portion of his wages has to go to the state. he should not be able to open a bank account other than one administered by the bail service and he should not be allowed to benefit from his father's money... that will punish the family too... the shame.

 

That way he still suffers but he puts something back into the community and into the state.

 

Just my thoughts.

 

Nephy,

 

you touch on a very interesting debate - does punishment really work or is there a better way to deal with criminal acts?

 

Given my position, I'm probably more on the side of 'maybe it doesn't work' than people believe. I often wonder if what we do is working or are we just locking up people with other like minded people and teaching them to be better at being a criminal when they get out. The Quakers founded the penitentiary system with a Penitentiary in Philadelphia. The idea was for those sent there to be penitent and to see forgiveness from within and from God and to find a way to be better people when they got out. Clearly that is not what we do now.

 

But without an alternative, my feeling more and more is warehouse the criminal and let him get out when he's too old to do any more harm.

 

BUT there are a certain class of people I feel no sympathy for. Not quite sure Jordan would fit into it, but white collar criminals who prey on others are not worthy or release. Bernie Madoff is perhaps the most glaring example, but really why would we want him out again? Jordan - being one of the rich and privileged had every reason not to get in trouble and no reason to do what he did. he is not a sympathetic defendant at sentencing; more so for his lack of remorse.

 

Well, the other 5 turds took a plea from what I understand. So they will be more or less middle aged when they get out.

 

But as to Jordan, well, I just can't buy into that train of thought, sorry. He was clearly the mastermind of this whole thing. In my opinion, had he killed Pete, he would not have shown an ounce of remorse. So I feel that he deserves to suffer, he deserves to be someones' prison bitch. And it's total Karma, since he hates homosexuals so much. Now he's going to know how it feels to take it up the ass (sorry for being so graphic).

 

I know both stories are fictional, but I would imagine that gay-bashing happens a lot more often than the media shows us.

 

Ekkk - youse a hard man Trev, better hope I never get in trouble when you're on the jury panel.

 

I think you initial outrage is valid - but the other side is, what are we really doing? Straight up punishment? Rehabilitation? Protecting Society? I'm not sure the three are compatible. If we want to protect the public, locking up people where they learn to be brutal to survive is hardly a service to society when we release them. Again, I don't have the answers, just point out where I go back and forth on this.

[Daddydavek]

Years ago, kids who committed serious crimes were sent to reformatories. Adults who committed serious crimes were sent to penitentiaries. Society really doesn't have the patience or the money to really rehabilitate so those convicted serve time and along the way pick up additional expertise in ways to run amuck and wreak havoc. Society finally caught on and that lead to the so-called 3 strikes and your out with huge sentences served in sequence so the perps never get out again.

 

The U.S. has the largest prison population on earth and the highest as a percentage of the population. Many of these con's can con any social worker and will never be rehabilitated even if society really tried. Funny, as our society became more concerned with the rights of the accused, the number of people breaking the law keeps going up.

 

Now if a parent spanks their child in public for misbehaving, they get hauled off to jail and charged with child abuse. When I was growing up, the neighborhood cop was kind but firm. If he thought you needed a swat he gave you one. If he really thought you were being a little shit, he then took you home to face your parents. Teachers were the same. If you got punished at school and your parents were told, you were punished again, much worse at home. Now, everyone has rights and we have a society full of itself and its rights and no responsibility to behave. What is worse, the current system in some ways protects bullies and bullying. Teachers don't want to get involved because of the hassle, the other kids don't want to get involved and the jerks proliferate. The so-called zero tolerance rules are another bad idea. One size never fit every situation and certainly doesn't in the ever more complex world we live in today, so some things that shouldn't be allowed are ignored and others are made an example of and of course that's fair. NOT.

 

To get back to Nephy's point, it is sad that these young lives were essentially ruined by a singularly stupid and vile attack on a guy because he was gay. But in the end there really are consequences and unfortunately, they can be much more painful than a spanking one should have got as a child.

 

P.S. Verbal spankings backed up by actions like loss of privileges can work as well when a child misbehaves. And yes it is child abuse to spank a child under the age of 5 IMHO.

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Getting close to the end here. Chapter 7 - Verdict is done and Nephy approved. That means Sunday I'll post the next to last chapter. The epilogue will be two weeks after that - Baby Q willing.

 

For those who can't wait, I'll reveal the verdict in the spoiler below. Don't read it if you're gonna get mad at me.

 

 

 

 

 

Did you really think I'd give away the ending NOW? Tsk tsk tsk some folks are soooo gullible.

 

 

 

There.

 

Now to finish the epilogue and put this and the saga of Jason and Peter to rest.

 

Andy

[Andrew Q Gordon]

Chapter 7: Verdict is posted.

 

So this is it, the end of the trial. Only an epilogue left to go.

 

Read it and weep or not. Reviews now that this is over are welcome.

 

Andy

[Benji]

.......... Great chapter! Should not have been a shock to Jordan though, I'm sure his lawyer clued him in. I'm surprised there was no outburst by his family though, maybe they were in shock as well. Jordan is facing some serious time here, with luck he may be out in 20 years, but I doubt it. His family is ruined along with his fated future behind bars for a very long time, which I gather will not be pleasant for someone his age and youth.

 

I doubt the jury will talk to the reporters, but if they do what will they say? Hmmmm, was Jordan's lawyer privy to fact that Jordan talked to his co-defendant and about what? I doubt we will know as 'new daddy' Mr. Q is quite busy!!

 

Great Chapter Q!

[TrevorTime]

"Mr. Colmar." Jordan barely lifted his head when the judge addressed him. "As the jury has found you guilty on all counts, your bond is revoked and you are remanded to the custody of the sheriff pending sentencing. Mr. Rankin, we need to set a date."

 

Andy, I had a question about Jordan's bond. Since he made all his court dates (we assume), doesn't the court have to return that money to his family? I mean, I understand the whole point of bail; it's to make sure a defendant doesn't skip town (or flee the country).

[Benji]

........... Good question, as I understand it if cash bond was put up to the courts by family, friends or whatever it is returned. Yet I'm not sure of a bonding agent here, will they release some monies as they are in the business? Maybe 10-50% of the bond money posted?

[Andrew Q Gordon]

"Mr. Colmar." Jordan barely lifted his head when the judge addressed him. "As the jury has found you guilty on all counts, your bond is revoked and you are remanded to the custody of the sheriff pending sentencing. Mr. Rankin, we need to set a date."

 

Andy, I had a question about Jordan's bond. Since he made all his court dates (we assume), doesn't the court have to return that money to his family? I mean, I understand the whole point of bail; it's to make sure a defendant doesn't skip town (or flee the country).

 

........... Good question, as I understand it if cash bond was put up to the courts by family, friends or whatever it is returned. Yet I'm not sure of a bonding agent here, will they release some monies as they are in the business? Maybe 10-50% of the bond money posted?

 

Okay so here is how bond works - or at least in the jurisdictions I've worked in.

 

There are several kinds of bond. In Pa for instance we had:

 

Own Recognizance - basically you promise to come to court but if not you owe whatever the bond was set at - in theory at least,

 

10%, meaning if you or a family member posted 10% of the bond you got out, but if you skipped out, you lose the 10% automatically and the rest you would again in theory because I've never seen a judge say, okay 10% forfeited, you're locked up without bond and oh yeah, you owe the remaining 90%- but I'm sure it's happened.;

 

Full bond. On these cases, you could, if you or your family had the money, post the full amount yourself, or you could find a bondsman to post it. If you hire a bail bondsman, you pay them whatever they want, 10, 20, 20 percent and you NEVER get that money back. No matter what. If you skip out the bond is forfeited, but the courts generally give the bondsman time to drag the defendant in kicking and screaming so they get their bond back.

 

In this instance, because he made all court dates, the Judge didn't forfeit the bond - meaning the money goes back to whence it came - all he did was revoke the right to be on bond. If he'd wanted to keep the money - and he could have earlier when Jordan violated the stay away conditions, he'd need to say, bond forfeited in his ruling.

 

Can't say that is how it works everywhere, but that is generally how's it's handled. Does that help?

[Andrew Q Gordon]

.......... Great chapter! Should not have been a shock to Jordan though, I'm sure his lawyer clued him in. I'm surprised there was no outburst by his family though, maybe they were in shock as well. Jordan is facing some serious time here, with luck he may be out in 20 years, but I doubt it. His family is ruined along with his fated future behind bars for a very long time, which I gather will not be pleasant for someone his age and youth.

 

I doubt the jury will talk to the reporters, but if they do what will they say? Hmmmm, was Jordan's lawyer privy to fact that Jordan talked to his co-defendant and about what? I doubt we will know as 'new daddy' Mr. Q is quite busy!!

 

Great Chapter Q!

 

Thanks Benji,

 

Yeah you won't be seeing more legal stuff on this - too busy with too many other things. Time to move on from this plot line.

 

BUT if I were to sum up what happens:

 

Peter doesn't sue - none of the defendants will be out of jail anytime soon - you have to expect Jordan is gonna get way more than Berimen who plead guilty and got 25 years so he'll gonna do a bit more - can't really sue the families so that leaves the school and you'd need to show they knew or should have known these 6 were likely to do this and did nothing to prevent it. So no civil suit was ever filed.

 

Hank Colmar was arrested tried and convicted of tax fraud/evasion. Rebecca ended up moving in with her daughter who got married, had a couple kids and lived on the wrong side of town. She and Barbara never spoke again.

 

Portman got half what Berimen got, so 12.5 years, tough but he is the one who hit Peter with the bat. He would have gotten 30+ years without the cooperation.

 

Berimen was charged, tried and convicted of Perjury. He recieved 2.5-5 years - the max but worse for him it will affect his release in 27.5 years. In PA you always get twice the minimum as a max sentence. 25-50 means you're eligible for release but you can be kept for the full 50 years. Lying on the stand is not going to impress the parole board when he shows up. In my mind, the Board will not release him first go round just because he lied. So figure he'll end up being released in 30 years.

 

Martin becomes D.A. with the support of Daniel Hember and the money raised by Ray Henry, and Royce Tellerman. - Mary of course becomes his First Assistant - i.e the #2 in the office.

 

Whew, there you go. No mention of the boys because -well I do have a few stories in mind for them one involving them directly the other involving others in their universe where they pop in from time to time.

[Enoch]

As I've told you before, I really like this story and the Jason/Peter story. I really fell for Jason and the way he grew up in a short period of time after meeting Peter. I guess that's because I can identify with him in a lot of ways. With some experience around a courtroom, I thought you did a very good job with this story in keeping it real and very entertaining. I loved it Andy!

[Daddydavek]

BUT if I were to sum up what happens:

 

Peter doesn't sue - none of the defendants will be out of jail anytime soon - you have to expect Jordan is gonna get way more than Berimen who plead guilty and got 25 years so he'll gonna do a bit more - can't really sue the families so that leaves the school and you'd need to show they knew or should have known these 6 were likely to do this and did nothing to prevent it. So no civil suit was ever filed.

 

Hank Colmar was arrested tried and convicted of tax fraud/evasion. Rebecca ended up moving in with her daughter who got married, had a couple kids and lived on the wrong side of town. She and Barbara never spoke again.

 

Portman got half what Berimen got, so 12.5 years, tough but he is the one who hit Peter with the bat. He would have gotten 30+ years without the cooperation.

 

Berimen was charged, tried and convicted of Perjury. He recieved 2.5-5 years - the max but worse for him it will affect his release in 27.5 years. In PA you always get twice the minimum as a max sentence. 25-50 means you're eligible for release but you can be kept for the full 50 years. Lying on the stand is not going to impress the parole board when he shows up. In my mind, the Board will not release him first go round just because he lied. So figure he'll end up being released in 30 years.

 

Martin becomes D.A. with the support of Daniel Hember and the money raised by Ray Henry, and Royce Tellerman. - Mary of course becomes his First Assistant - i.e the #2 in the office.

 

Whew, there you go. No mention of the boys because -well I do have a few stories in mind for them one involving them directly the other involving others in their universe where they pop in from time to time.

 

Interesting, almost a mini-epilogue in itself....

 

I really enjoyed the story Andy, looking forward to the Jason epilogue and thanks again!

[TrevorTime]

Andy, I wanted to reply to your reply. You wrote:

 

"Yes Jordan will deserve whatever he gets - every day of it - but I don't know too many judges who take delight in doing that to someone who's 20 years old."

 

Right, the judge doesn't have to take delight, but he should consider the victim's rights (especially in this case). And I just thought of something; what if Pete had been paralyzed in the attack and had to spend the rest of his life in a wheelchair? How is that fair to him? Would Jordan deserve any amount of compassion if Second Shot had played out that way?

 

On that last question, I think we both know how I feel about this.

 

And as a hypothetical; even if I were straight and totally hated gays, there is just no way I could have done what Jordan did. Forget about the jail time; if Pete posed no physical threat to me, why should I get physical with him?