Paternity

[rjo]

With this last chapter , I saw a change in Matt. Before Matt was the college jock, big man on campus totally oblivious to any thing and anyone even Wade. Now with one act, Matt holding Riley and telling Riley he will be there for him. Things have changed. I was pissed at Matt before. Now he was redeemed himself in my eyes. I must agree that relationships change over time, just as the people in them change. I do believe Wade is right, however, 20 years from now Matt and Wade will still be together. Maybe Riley will have a half brother or sister too. Of all the narrators in the saga I like Wade and Will the best. Wade has passion but balanced with a strong sense of duty. I think that what makes him so interesting. Wade maybe worried he is turning into his mother but that wouldn't happen. He isn't that selfcentered, even though he maybe reserved, he loves deeply. He would give his life gladly for Matt or Riley without even thinking.

 

As for Carl, I don't see him as a Brian, or Carson. He will go back to home and find someone bother. He is not in the same league as Matt or Wade. If he causes any problems in the future sick JP or Wade's mother on him, That should make short work of him.

[Mark Arbour]

With this last chapter , I saw a change in Matt. Before Matt was the college jock, big man on campus totally oblivious to any thing and anyone even Wade. Now with one act, Matt holding Riley and telling Riley he will be there for him. Things have changed. I was pissed at Matt before. Now he was redeemed himself in my eyes. I must agree that relationships change over time, just as the people in them change. I do believe Wade is right, however, 20 years from now Matt and Wade will still be together. Maybe Riley will have a half brother or sister too. Of all the narrators in the saga I like Wade and Will the best. Wade has passion but balanced with a strong sense of duty. I think that what makes him so interesting. Wade maybe worried he is turning into his mother but that wouldn't happen. He isn't that selfcentered, even though he maybe reserved, he loves deeply. He would give his life gladly for Matt or Riley without even thinking.

 

As for Carl, I don't see him as a Brian, or Carson. He will go back to home and find someone bother. He is not in the same league as Matt or Wade. If he causes any problems in the future sick JP or Wade's mother on him, That should make short work of him.

 

That was well said.

 

I think that Matt's doing that thing that a lot of us go through from time to time: he's having his priorities rearranged by uncomfortable jolts.

 

By the way, I'm not sure if you all caught this, but I wrote a short piece for the news blog. You can find it here.

[methodwriter85]

Hey, that was a really good chapter. I really liked how you built up to JJ's breakdown in the chapter- it felt pretty realistic and true-to-life. This kid lost the only parent that he's really bonded to- I'm sure Brad and Robbie care about the guy, but they don't have that kind of parental bond to him that Wade described. I don't think either of them would take a bullet for JJ like Brad would for Will, or Robbie would for Darius and Matt. The only one who JJ had that kind of bond with was Jeanine, going all the way back here:

 

We wandered through the halls of Claremont General until we found Jeremy's unit. He looked so small and vulnerable. Jeanine was with us, and I could feel the maternal instincts surge in her. I put my arm around her and she leaned into me, gestures of friendship.

Parenting one of the kids instead of all three worked well, but now you see the unintended consequence- Jeanine's out of commission, and JJ's not close enough to either Brad or Robbie to go to them, so he feels alone. That felt really organic and something that's been building for a very long time.

 

Now the question is...now that it's been acknowledged, are they going going to be okay with that or would Robbie and Brad pretty much try to build a better bond with JJ?

Edited February 10, 2012 by methodwriter85

[Daddydavek]

Loved the chapter. Will's being there for JJ was nicely done and his manipulation at the ending dinner scene was just bratty enough to keep his boozing the night before out of the conversation. It also accomplished some active family support for JJ which was cool. Ryan is turning into a much nicer character than his initial foray into the story ever foreshadowed.

 

[PrivateTim]

Hey, that was a really good chapter. I really liked how you built up to JJ's breakdown in the chapter- it felt pretty realistic and true-to-life. This kid lost the only parent that he's really bonded to- I'm sure Brad and Robbie care about the guy, but they don't have that kind of parental bond to him that Wade described. I don't think either of them would take a bullet for JJ like Brad would for Will, or Robbie would for Darius and Matt. The only one who JJ had that kind of bond with was Jeanine, going all the way back here:

 

Parenting one of the kids instead of all three worked well, but now you see the unintended consequence- Jeanine's out of commission, and JJ's not close enough to either Brad or Robbie to go to them, so he feels alone. That felt really organic and something that's been building for a very long time.

 

Now the question is...now that it's been acknowledged, are they going going to be okay with that or would Robbie and Brad pretty much try to build a better bond with JJ?

 

I disagree completely. Just because you are not as close to one child or show special attention, or even pay attention to them, doesn't mean when push comes to shove that paternal instincts kick in. Look at how Will's fraternal instincts kicked in.

 

Ryan is behaving the way I would expect a Harvard-Westlake kid to behave. Not every kid at H-W is a saint, but they don't stay at the school long if they don't behave properly. 99% of the kids I've known from there were very high quality individuals. Granted I knew mostly athletes and those involved in drama, music, dance, etc., but even so I knew a lot of their friends who were not involved in those things and they too were pretty solid kids.

[centexhairysub]

Just cannot tell you how much the latest chapter of Paternity rang true from start to finish, JJ's breakdown was so well written. It is so easy to see why this family makes it, because in the end they are always there when it matters.

 

Ryan is acting to me like how he wishes someone in his family would act toward him. Is he an only child, has that ever been made clear? I think that what happened with Shiloh is that Ryan's father either said or did something that either made her break up with Ryan or made Ryan feel he couldn't be with her. You can tell that maybe he still has some type of feeling for her.

 

I loved how Will dealt with Sean, that was just priceless. Plus, I have to wonder sometimes who the parent is between Will and his dad??? I mean a couple of times in this story he has been a better parent to JJ than Brad has been.

[methodwriter85]

I disagree completely. Just because you are not as close to one child or show special attention, or even pay attention to them, doesn't mean when push comes to shove that paternal instincts kick in. Look at how Will's fraternal instincts kicked in.

 

Yeah, but when have we ever really see Brad display those instincts for JJ? It's only ever really been for Will, and maybe Darius. I'm not saying Brad doesn't care about JJ, but I am saying that Brad only really felt that parental instinct when Will was born, and it was only really Jeanine that had it for JJ when he was born. As Darius put it, having one parent getting taken to one of the kids worked out well, but the end result is that JJ really isn't all that bonded to either Brad or Robbie. It's not necessarily a bad thing- it would just mean that if we get around to JJ's point of view, the kind of father-son scenes that we saw with JP/Brad in Be Rad or Brad/Will now just wouldn't really work for Brad/JJ. It would feel fake, because I don't think JJ would see Brad as some kind of mentor to look up to. Those kinds of scenes would have to be with Tiffany or Jeanine, or Matt.

 

That's where JJ fits into the Paternity theme- his biological dad pretends that he doesn't exist, while his adoptive dads care about him, but they're better bonded to his brothers. He had some pretty good maternal figures in Jeanine and Tiffany, but not some much on the paternal side.

Edited February 11, 2012 by methodwriter85

[rjo]

We have not seen JJ, nor don't really know him. Here we have a middle child, small for his age, the only parent he really knows or cares about him is out of the picture. That must be hard on him. I though he was just a diva, not knowing what he was really feeling. Now we maybe understand him better. That sweet happy child is still there. Now is the time for this family to support him. Will and Ryan have stepped up. Will Brad and Robbie? I hope so. Long ago, they lost Billy at 15. The family is still hurting from that. How much worse would it be if they lost JJ? That thought is too aweful to think about.

Edited February 11, 2012 by rjo

[PrivateTim]

We have not seen JJ, nor don't really know him. Here we have a middle child, small for his age, the only parent he really knows or cares about him is out of the picture. That must be hard on him. I though he was just a diva, not knowing what he was really feeling. Now we maybe understand him better. That sweet happy child is still there. Now is the time for this family to support him. Will and Ryan have stepped up. Will Brad and Robbie? I hope so. Long ago, they lost Billy at 15. The family is still hurting from that. How much worse would it be if they lost JJ? That thought is too aweful to think about.

 

I agree partly, I would modify "only parent he really knows or cares about him is out of the picture" to "the parent we have seen interact with him the most". Just because Mark hasn't had the inclination to write more about JJ due to limitations of time, space and not wanting to have too many storylines going, we don't know what JJ's day to day inteactions with Brad and Robbie are. We've seen a lot of conversations between Will and Brad, a couple where Robbie was involved. We haven't seen such conversations with JJ and I am sure they have existed, maybe different , but I am sure they are still there. Brad and Robbie are simply not the type of men who would completely ignore one of their children.

 

I get that Brad or Robbie wouldn't go to his ice skating practices, but I find it highly unlikely, based on the character of Brad and Robbie that Mark has painted that they would miss too many of his competitions. I know he said something to the effect that they didn't go to JJ's competitions, or maybe it was implied, but that would at odds with the characters he has created. Certainly more than just Jeannie would have gone to St Gervais, that is how the entire Schluter-Crampton clans are. Certainly Stef would never pass a chance to go to France.

 

As to Will's reaction and actions. That is more of what I am talking about as to how this family really is a tight family and why it would be inconsistent for Brad and Robbie to be too competely detatched as some people would paint.

[Daddydavek]

Mark wrote in reply to a review by another faithful follower:

 

"Will is such a teenager. He's actually fun to write these days. Kind of like Tonto, only young and cheeky instead of old and crusty."

 

I found that link to Tonto delightful and it would be fun to see if someone would mention it sometime in the future, perhaps during one of the famous dinner session at Escorial; perhaps by Isadore?

[Mark Arbour]

I agree partly, I would modify "only parent he really knows or cares about him is out of the picture" to "the parent we have seen interact with him the most". Just because Mark hasn't had the inclination to write more about JJ due to limitations of time, space and not wanting to have too many storylines going, we don't know what JJ's day to day inteactions with Brad and Robbie are. We've seen a lot of conversations between Will and Brad, a couple where Robbie was involved. We haven't seen such conversations with JJ and I am sure they have existed, maybe different , but I am sure they are still there. Brad and Robbie are simply not the type of men who would completely ignore one of their children.

 

I get that Brad or Robbie wouldn't go to his ice skating practices, but I find it highly unlikely, based on the character of Brad and Robbie that Mark has painted that they would miss too many of his competitions. I know he said something to the effect that they didn't go to JJ's competitions, or maybe it was implied, but that would at odds with the characters he has created. Certainly more than just Jeannie would have gone to St Gervais, that is how the entire Schluter-Crampton clans are. Certainly Stef would never pass a chance to go to France.

 

As to Will's reaction and actions. That is more of what I am talking about as to how this family really is a tight family and why it would be inconsistent for Brad and Robbie to be too competely detatched as some people would paint.

 

You all made some really good points, and I think there's a lot of things going on in JJ's little psyche. Certainly the middle child thing could be a factor. I quoted Tim's response because I think he's got the right approach here. I think that Brad and Robbie aren't neglectful, but they are very busy. We would like to think of them in terms of the typical family, where they work 9-5 and are home every night. That's not going to be the case. They're both in high-powered and demanding jobs, and they're going to have limited time to spend, whether it's no themselves, their kids, or each other. Brad has been able to build a stronger (emphasis on the 'er') bond with Will because of their similar personality styles and because they share a passion for surfing (and men). That doesn't mean that he's neglected JJ or Darius, it just means his bond with Will is stronger.

 

Will wasn't calling them on being bad parents, he was pointing out to both of them that they have to step it up more on JJ's account now that Jeanine is down for a bit. I'm not sure that the meet in LA would have been vital for them to attend before, but the event in France would have been, and so is the upcoming gig in Norway.

[Mark Arbour]

Rjo raised the issue of ECT(electric shock therapy) treatment in the reviews, noting that ECT was what JP had specifically forbade them from doing to Jeff in "1968." I noted that it there is a lot less electricity used these days than there was in earlier days. Here's a quote from the Wiki article:

 

In 1976, Dr. Blatchley demonstrated the effectiveness of his constant current, brief pulse device ECT. This device eventually largely replaced earlier devices because of the reduction in cognitive side effects, although some ECT clinics in the US still use sine-wave devices.

[methodwriter85]

I'm not saying at all that Brad and Robbie completely ignored JJ. I'm saying that Brad and Robbie used their limited time to each focus on one child- Brad focused on Will, Robbie focused on Darius, and they left the primary raising of JJ to Jeanine. It worked fine as they were growing up, but this is the end result- there just isn't that tight of a bond between them. JJ learned to depend on Jeanine, and eventually Tiffany, but not really depend on Brad and Robbie for much because he had his two big maternal figures. And because JJ, diva bitchiness aside, is well-behaved because he pretty much can't do anything except practice and school, Brad and Robbie didn't see any reason to pry into what was going on with JJ because they just assumed he was fine. Tiffany's the only one who got it.

 

And like I said, it might not necessarily be a bad thing- it would just mean that when/if JJ gets a turn at narrating, it wouldn't make sense to write the kind of father/son scenes that Mark has written in the past for JP/Brad and Will/Brad. That kind of stuff would have to be with Jeanine, Tiffany, or Matt. Not everyone has a tight parental bond with their Dad, and it'd be okay for JJ not to have one with Brad or Robbie.

 

You all made some really good points, and I think there's a lot of things going on in JJ's little psyche.

I thought that breakdown was just a buildup of so many things. Aside from Tiffany and Jeanine being gone, Darius is away at college so he doesn't have his big protective older brother around anymore. Darius kinda seemed like the glue between the Schluter brothers, best evidenced by the road trip scene to Bakersfield in PMS, and now he's not around. Will's been struck hard by the pubescent drive for sex and fun, and is off into this world that JJ can't really follow into, and can't relate to. And he doesn't really go to either Brad or Robbie for advice. I think he likely disengaged himself from Brad and Robbie during the events of Millenium, and didn't really re-engage himself again.

 

And the one thing he has- the only thing he has- was just the source of a major embarrassment. It just boiled all over- the pain of seeing the one parent he's close to turn into a zombie, feeling left behind by his brothers, not really feeling like he had anyone to talk to, and humilating himself at what was supposed to have been a showcase of how awesome a skater he is...it was just too much.

 

I hope so. Long ago, they lost Billy at 15. The family is still hurting from that. How much worse would it be if they lost JJ? That thought is too aweful to think about.

JJ will turn fifteen in a little under ten weeks...

Edited February 11, 2012 by methodwriter85

[rjo]

I think that Jeremy has hit the nail on the head. Over this saga, this family history, there are a few times things could have been changed. The what ifs. What if Steven would have come back from the War. What if Jeff would have been able to beat the drugs and win JP back? What if Billy would not have died in the accident? What if Greg would have not gone back to the office? All these things changed the story. Thanks to Will I think Brad and Robbie understand they need to be there more for JJ. I also think JJ is starting to understand that the family is there when he needs them. His melt down was the best thing the could have happened.

 

While I was at work today, I had the idea rattling around in my mind. Many of you will think I am crazy but here it goes. In some ways both stories CAP and George are on the same track. JJ has lost his mother, Tiffany and has to deal with his up coming compition. George has lost his ship maybe his crew, and has to deal with his father and family. JJ has Will. George has Caroline. Both of them don't like the unknown. What do you guys think?

[Mark Arbour]

I think that Jeremy has hit the nail on the head. Over this saga, this family history, there are a few times things could have been changed. The what ifs. What if Steven would have come back from the War. What if Jeff would have been able to beat the drugs and win JP back? What if Billy would not have died in the accident? What if Greg would have not gone back to the office? All these things changed the story. Thanks to Will I think Brad and Robbie understand they need to be there more for JJ. I also think JJ is starting to understand that the family is there when he needs them. His melt down was the best thing the could have happened.

 

While I was at work today, I had the idea rattling around in my mind. Many of you will think I am crazy but here it goes. In some ways both stories CAP and George are on the same track. JJ has lost his mother, Tiffany and has to deal with his up coming compition. George has lost his ship maybe his crew, and has to deal with his father and family. JJ has Will. George has Caroline. Both of them don't like the unknown. What do you guys think?

 

I think there are a few surprises headed your way.

[PrivateTim]

No spoilers on the "George" stories, because once I got onto CAP I put George on hold.

[Daddydavek]

"I think there are a few surprises headed your way. "

 

 

What else would we expect? Mark's stories imitate life in that at the oddest moments, all hell breaks loose and surprises the crap out of us.

 

Enjoy the suspense is my motto as I wait for the other shoe to drop.

[sat8997]

Enjoy the suspense is my motto as I wait for the other shoe to drop.

 

Who knows, it may just start tap dancing as well.

[Daddydavek]

Who knows, it may just start tap dancing as well.

 

JJ skates, but tap too?

[methodwriter85]

He'd probably pick up dance quickly if he tried. I think I have JJ taking dance for his gym requirement.

[Daddydavek]

Chapter 18 is up and while there is no tap dancing, there is plenty of horizontal mamba.

 

The scene back at Escorial with Matt and Tyler and then with Matt in their room was especially done well.

 

Still waiting for the other shoe to drop and I expect Wade's mom to provide!

[methodwriter85]

Does anyone else feel like Mark's starting to foreshadow 9/11? There were the New York City trips in Millenium and Poor Man's Son, and then the mention of a Middle Eastern conflict in 1995.

 

We've got eleven months, one week, four days left in pre-9/11 America. God, I'm excited to see how 9/11 is going to hit everyone.

 

So I guess everyone's going to the Southwest Regionals then? Hmm. Should be interesting.

Edited February 16, 2012 by methodwriter85

[centexhairysub]

I thought the scene with Wade telling Matt about his uncle was just handled so perfectly. That relationship and how it ended impacted so much of how Wade handled himself and the world. This explained so much, maybe even more than the abuse by his Father. I just feel Wade and Matt are getting closer and more deeply involved even thought Wade is now starting to see other people. No matter what, I just can't see them not being in each others' life.

 

I know it is coming, but I just can't get excited about 9/11 being introduced into the story. I know that something that important will be covered by Mark in a really impactful and tasteful way but just can't look forward to re-living it at all.

[methodwriter85]

I know it is coming, but I just can't get excited about 9/11 being introduced into the story. I know that something that important will be covered by Mark in a really impactful and tasteful way but just can't look forward to re-living it at all.

 

Yeah. I do think Mark has, through Bloodlines, Millenium, Poor Man's Son, and Paternity, created a pretty good portrait of pre-9/11 America- a booming economy, a budget surplus, bubbly pop music in the air, optimism abounding everywhere(well, except the dot-com bomb that just exploded), a generation of kids who have only really known economic prosperity and peace...it'll be interesting to see what it's like when Will's switching from worrying about the final details of his 15th birthday on Friday to suddenly worrying about whether or not the terrorists are going to try and attack Los Angeles, too.

 

 

It just kind of feels the United States was at a peak in the waning days of the Clinton Administration, and things were just never that good again. As much as I've whined about Mark fitting in 3 stories in 2000 instead of doing some time jumps, I gotta admit it's been interesting exploring in depth America's last year of innocence before everything changed.

Edited February 16, 2012 by methodwriter85

[Mark Arbour]

I thought the scene with Wade telling Matt about his uncle was just handled so perfectly. That relationship and how it ended impacted so much of how Wade handled himself and the world. This explained so much, maybe even more than the abuse by his Father. I just feel Wade and Matt are getting closer and more deeply involved even thought Wade is now starting to see other people. No matter what, I just can't see them not being in each others' life.

 

I think you're right about Matt and Wade. Wade hasn't told us really what's going on in his mind with this whole thing because he doesn't really get it himself. He will.