CJ's Rant

[Canuk]

well the responses have been many and varied.

I am intrigued by those that are concerned about "too much detail" "too long to get to the end" etc as with all writing I read it's the journey that I enjoy and the detail is what makes the journey and it is certainly a bloody great journey we have been taken on here. Of course I wanted to know what happened next and yes I always wanted it to be Tuesday, but that is all part of the fun. And that CJ you have kept us coming back for 99+34 (or whatever bizarre numbering system you developed - blaming it on Australia!) chapters is a strong indication that quite a few of us enjoy the journey. keep it up.

[option]

maybe your looking in the wrong place for feedback?

 

as at this writing;

there have been 29 ratings, & its a 5star story

149 are following it

~40 have clicked 'like this'

 

& dont forget that the number of readers isnt recorded anywhere, if it was that would be a good feedback metric

 

 

those 29 ratings might not seem many, but i, & probably a lot of others, will rate a story once its finished, not whilst its still being written.

i would think the same applies for reviews, do you really expect people to write a review for every chapter? (it seems daft that you cant leave a review for the whole story!)

[TalonRider]

As of this posting, there has been 93,109 views in total.

 

As one of the team, CJ gets my comments when I send the chapter back to him. Sometimes is short, sometimes it's longer. Sometimes we get a conversation going back and forth, which is why I don't comment too much in the forum. I might say something that I shouldn't.

 

I will also from time to time, say or do something to get things stirred up a bit.

[option]

93109 views

137 chapters

= ~680 readers

[wetcoaster]

I apologize for being a freeloader. I have enjoyed your work and have always looked forward to the next installment. I recognize that you have a life beyond writing and wish you all success in your endeavors.

Reading the posts, I thought that I didn't have much to offer the discussions, so i didn't.

Thank you for this gripping story.

jaq

[C James]

First, a note to those worrying; All I asked for was some feedback, which I have been getting, (THANK YOU!). Many writers (not just me... please, please remember others that you read too) crave it, and it's our motivation. With me, good or bad, I need to hear it. Anyway, don't worry about me pulling the plug on public posting; I won';t be doing that unless feedback drops way back again.

 

And, I've been inspired by this; I've written more in the last 48 hours than in the previous two weeks. Also, I'm happier with the product; I think quality is up too.

 

Also, I'm working my way through the threads, e-mails, etc in posting order, a bit at a time, because I have a chapter in my head aching to get out and the keyboard is calling. (And it feels great to want to write, as opposed to have to write.)

 

Sorry you are not getting enough feedback; think Circumnavigation is a GREAT story; been following since the beginning; tempted to write when updates slowed but did not want to be pushy incase you were dealin with a family or personal situation, Hope you can see your way to the end....................and further.

 

Charles Ross

 

There have been family situations, plus a few other things, that were part of it. The other part, which it took me a while to realize, was it had become a grind, a chore, because my motivation was drying up.

 

I am now massively motivated to get this story done. I still have a pressing deadline; my mid-November departure.

 

As an author's husband, I am particularly bad about writing out authors - and I KNOW how important it is. I DO very much enjoy your writing - I can't tell you the number of times that I've gone back and re-read sections of Let the Music Play and Changing Lanes. I really love your characterizations of Trev, Shane, Lisa, Joel and so many others in the story - and the brilliant evil of Bridget.

 

So to a fantastic author and I'll try to be better, not only with you, but with other authors I read...

 

Thanks!!!!!

 

It was Dan who I got "Feedback is an author's lifeblood" from. That has always stuck with me, even before I began writing. Then, once I began writing, I realized it's even truer than I thought.

In truth, writers write because they have no choice. Also writers write because they want to be read, otherwise their work becomes their private journal. To threaten to withhold posting the last chapters is a form of sandbox coercion.

 

I've read every word of this story because I've thought you were a great storyteller. Your characters have been believable and your plot line unexpected. You don't need me to tell you that. You already know your skills and weaknesses.

 

If you need the babble of the masses to help you finish, maybe my estimation of your passion has been misplaced.

 

For what it's worth, I'll be disappointed if you don't finish and post.

 

Oddly enough, I think that I am a better judge of what motivates me than you are. What you say may well apply to many authors, but as I've said before, my motivation to post stories in public is feedback, good or bad. It is true that I will always write, but getting a chapter ready for public posting is a lot of work for both me and my team. That's what requires a motive. If I was just after readership, I could post my older stories (For the Love, Let the Music Play, etc) to all sorts of sites, but I have no reason to because they don't generate significant feedback. So, I post only on GA.

 

To be clear, I am not doing this for praise. It's feedback that I crave and need.

 

Sandbox coercion? Do bear in mind that people were already withholding feedback from me. Why on earth wouldn't I consider returning in kind?

[C James]

MMM. Not good to go begging. The story is good - otherwise it wouldn't be here, and neither would I. I've been reading each week (Tuesday evening) for me for many weeks/months/years even it feels like, and the story is an old familiar friend. I havent read anything else of yours, yet ! I would have preferred longer, less frequent chapters, but reading this weekly has been very enjoyable.

You're getting part of your wish; two chapters combined into one. Part of the reason is I wanted to do something to say thank you, and the other is I felt it works better as one chapter, not two.

 

CJ: I agree with Stanollie, "Trev's trip across the Indian Ocean is one of the most harrowing things I have read, certainly out-Mobys Dick." I've never read a more gripping description of drowning than Trevor's torture at the pirate's hands. And the same for his recovery, returning to his boat, and being left adrift with almost nothing to aid his survival. I shivered while reading his days on the South Indian Ocean. I share cc00nz conflictedness (if that's a word). I too desire both a shorter and a longer story. It doesn't make sense except that I want to see Trevor and Shane safe at the end of the story; and I want to keep in touch with their lives as they prosper in their charter business, possibly in another story. Thanks.

The Indian Ocean crossing was part of the story that was both challenging and rewarding to write. I was setting it up from the start, things like mentions of sundials, and Trevor's close call in the Atlantis (falling overboard and almost being left behind to certain death) and putting all the pieces in place. And also, figuring out how he'd survive.

 

CJ, I admit that I do not post nearly as often as I should. And of course that is being somewhat mean - as you say ; you are doing your half of the bargain - I should do mine.

 

it is interesting that you say that while comments on your stories have dropped off, it is not you alone. I only follow a couple of authors here and my commenting has dropped off with all. I had no idea I was part of a general movement!

 

but back to you and your story. . I am so impressed not only with the writing, but that you are brave enough to put it out there. I may write, but I am no where near courageous enough to let anyone (even my partner) read it. So even before I read anything I was impressed that you are prepared to put yourself on the line for us great unwashed to paw, pick over, disect and generally play with. Haveing got over that aspect I am also impressed by your writing.I have loved the story ever since day 1. the characters, the injudicious use of cliffies, the twisted yet not fantastical plot, your knowledge of sailing, particularly along bizarre bits of the Australian coast and your ability to describe wih tortuous accuracy what it must feel like to all-but drown, be attacked by pirates, to find your "dead" mother etc.

 

I am simply in awe of your skills. So bloody keep writing, OK? I promise - if you do, I will.

 

Many authors here have been disheartened and discouraged by the decline in feedback. It's a long-term problem, getting worse over time. Maybe part of it is new methods, like the "like" button; many people seem to think that that's a good substitute for actual feedback. It isn't.

 

As for me, I'm on a writing blitz. I'm both happier, and more inspired, than I've been in years.

[leoneozoe]

As like all 31 before me, why comment on a story that is as great as this one is, I had commented in the past but that was relevant then.

As a West Australian living in Perth and working extensively at HMAS Sterling GI, you have done a excellent job in your description of the base area and WA in general.

I love it. Keep up the good work, alway's "NO NEWS is GOOD News"

Alan

[Mark Arbour]

93109 views

137 chapters

= ~680 readers

 

The actual "views" are understated because the site only tracks how many readers go to the story page, not to each chapter. Those views are also overstated to the degree that people reread the story.

[Benji]

...............You said this because?

[spikeqwert]

guilty as charged...i do luv your story and i flailed to uphold my side of the bargain, in my defence i really didn't think comments from your readers were that important, well i guess i know better now...i looked at it more from what i am familiar with, construction, no one really comments on the hole i dig, or the concrete I pour for the footings, walls and basement floor...it is not till the house is done and becomes a home i get feed back...WELL DONE!

[Guest pacecardave]

Where to even begin, I guess it would be nice if I started off by saying I have enjoyed reading Circumnavigation for the most part......and I would enjoy reading the conclusion of it if you should decide to do so but if not I will not be terribly disappointed, afteall it wont be the first that I have read that the author has chosen not to finish and I am quite sure it wont be the last, thats just the way life is. I dont have to like it but I do have to accept it. I should also say that I do have my reasons for not replying to any or many of the stories I have read. First off I find it very annoying the hoops I have to jump through in order to respond and secondly the few times I have jumped thru those hoops I have found that shortly after registering on a site I find up getting a lot of junk mail, that the site promised me I wouldnt get but got anyway.

 

I agree very much with Gene Spicer PHD and his comments. You say only five more chapters but you cannot possibly finish up this story in five chapters and answer all the various plot lines you have going unless you decide to do something you have not done up to yet and that is give us five VERY ACTION PACKED CHAPTERS. All I can see you doing is taking us to a stopping point in this saga and then after a break starting a new story containing the same main characters several years down the road and then bring in some of the odd plot lines to weave into the story and continue on in that manner or some variation thereof. That is just my opinion and my view and afterall it is your story and you are free to take it in any direction you desire or feel necessary.

 

I know many if not most or nearly all will disagree with my posting here and that is fine, you wont be the first and certainly not the last to disagree with anything I post. Most are praising you for your great writing. Well I am not one to follow the "herd", I will say that you are a good author but your incinnation towards detail gets in the way of the story frequently. Also I know you are the master of the "cliffhanger" but you do tend to over use it, in my opinion.

 

Finally in closing I resent the hell out of it that you would threaten to withhold the ending chapters if "I" the reader dont write in and tell you how much I enjoy your story and beg you to continue. At this point I dont care if you continue posting the story or not, if you do I will read it but if you dont, "oh well" this wont be the first unfinished story I have read and it wont be the last I am quite sure. I am really not a HATER as I am sure some of you will say, you asked for my opinion or thoughts so you got them and you are free to do with them as you will. I would like to see the story continue to its conclusion but if not it wont be the end of my world. Thank you for listening to my rant, DEO"s Rant.

[wildone]

Where to even begin, I guess it would be nice if I started off by saying I have enjoyed reading Circumnavigation for the most part......and I would enjoy reading the conclusion of it if you should decide to do so but if not I will not be terribly disappointed, afteall it wont be the first that I have read that the author has chosen not to finish and I am quite sure it wont be the last, thats just the way life is. I dont have to like it but I do have to accept it. I should also say that I do have my reasons for not replying to any or many of the stories I have read. First off I find it very annoying the hoops I have to jump through in order to respond and secondly the few times I have jumped thru those hoops I have found that shortly after registering on a site I find up getting a lot of junk mail, that the site promised me I wouldnt get but got anyway.

 

I agree very much with Gene Spicer PHD and his comments. You say only five more chapters but you cannot possibly finish up this story in five chapters and answer all the various plot lines you have going unless you decide to do something you have not done up to yet and that is give us five VERY ACTION PACKED CHAPTERS. All I can see you doing is taking us to a stopping point in this saga and then after a break starting a new story containing the same main characters several years down the road and then bring in some of the odd plot lines to weave into the story and continue on in that manner or some variation thereof. That is just my opinion and my view and afterall it is your story and you are free to take it in any direction you desire or feel necessary.

 

I know many if not most or nearly all will disagree with my posting here and that is fine, you wont be the first and certainly not the last to disagree with anything I post. Most are praising you for your great writing. Well I am not one to follow the "herd", I will say that you are a good author but your incinnation towards detail gets in the way of the story frequently. Also I know you are the master of the "cliffhanger" but you do tend to over use it, in my opinion.

 

Finally in closing I resent the hell out of it that you would threaten to withhold the ending chapters if "I" the reader dont write in and tell you how much I enjoy your story and beg you to continue. At this point I dont care if you continue posting the story or not, if you do I will read it but if you dont, "oh well" this wont be the first unfinished story I have read and it wont be the last I am quite sure. I am really not a HATER as I am sure some of you will say, you asked for my opinion or thoughts so you got them and you are free to do with them as you will. I would like to see the story continue to its conclusion but if not it wont be the end of my world. Thank you for listening to my rant, DEO"s Rant.

 

I would definitely not call you a 'hater' for that post Anyone who has invested their time in, what is it? 240 chapters must enjoy the story enough to continue reading.

 

What I will say is that you just taking the time to express how you feel, I am pretty sure CJ will appreciate it. You didn't rant on him, you actually gave him constructive feedback about the cliffhangers and the amount of detail. It is nothing that CJ hasn't been told before, and actually embraced and used as he has continued. If you want to know to the littlest detail how to build a nuclear bomb, then read some of CJ's earlier stuff. He takes the feedback and does implement in his future writing.

 

To tell the truth, I am pessimistic too about finishing this in 5 chapters. The thing is, I know and most people know the goat can't count . Remember, this was supposed to be a 30 chapter story

 

The only thing I will ask about your comments is the signing in thing. After the initial setup of an account, I don't find it bothersome at all to type in my Username and Password in under a couple of seconds. Maybe I don't understand what the big hassle is I do know others have brought this up too. If you want, you can PM me with that answer and I'll see if I can either help you, or get some answers for you.

 

Over the years I have had numerous conversations with CJ about when my comments and what my feelings are about what he is writing. Both in the Forum as well as the PM system. If you do think that they all have me on the 'love train' singing my praises for CJ, then let me correct you I give CJ constructive feedback when he deserves it in my opinion. The funny thing is, CJ is equally grateful for the constructive feedback as he is with the complimentary feedback. He just craves feedback. If you can phrase it like you did above, don't ever be afraid to post something in his topic or in a PM to him.

 

No, you are not a 'hater'. I respect you for taking the time to put together a thoughtful post that doesn't follow the rest of the herd.

Edited October 5, 2012 by wildone

[toolmanofla]

CJ,

 

 

It has indeed been a long time since I have posted anything and in fact, you and Don Hanratty are about the only reasons I did not give up coming to GayAuthors completely. The new format is cumbersome and totally confusing to use. The redesign is not easy to navigate around, and the premium content is prohibitive for people like me who cannot pay for access. Many of the stories I have loved reading over the years are either locked behind the premium barrier or the authors have removed them/moved away from this listing. When one of my face is still posting, it is very difficult to access their stories. I have loved every story you have posted and Circumnavigation is definitely terrific! Please keep the story going - some of us old geezers don't do much besides reading these days. Thanks for all your wonderful writing and for blessing us with your superb writing. Sorry for my own rant but I thought maybe it may help others.

Tim (toolmanofla)

[C James]

I don't post because I don't have time. I think this is a great story - let there no be no doubt about that. But I have my complaints, and I've refrained from spouting off, because it really is your story to tell.

 

But you've given me the opportunity, so...

 

I don't have time because I can pretty much skip a good three chapters and not lose any of the essentials of the story. Maybe I mean I don't have the patience. You're moving people around on the chessboard, but no pawns are taken, there's no 'check'. The last really major event in this story was the beheading of the mob boss, some ten chapters ago or so. Everything since then has been "Bridget reads a fax" - "Gray drives a car with Trevor in it" - "Rachel and Martin sail around awhile" - "Shane takes off his shirt". That's all great, but I want to read how the boy who had weights tied to him as he sank under the water, with his boat adrift above him, finally gets his revenge.

 

I think you've gotten too wrapped up in the detail in this story. I think its neat that there are a lot of plot devices in play, that there are a lot of interesting little details to plot out - if I had a calendar and a sextant and a spreadsheet to keep track of it all, and the time I'd need to really figure out where all the little niff-naw details are going to all suddenly come together and make something happen.

 

You say there are five chapters left. I think it's closer to fifteen, because all these details need their own exposition and their own storylines to track, and while I think it's great that a diver under Atlantis found the zinc anode, I know that an experienced diver has spent some time around boats, and you don't need a forensic expert to diagnose that Atlantis is basically a new boat. Two lines:

 

"What did you find?"

"The fiberglass is really clean, the glass is new, the running gear is all new. The sails still have creases. That boat hasn't been in the water long".

 

- would have sufficed to let Gray deduce that Trevor is sailing a boat that's pretty much a total refit. CJ, that's one stroll down a dock to deduce the condition of the boat. The ropes would be very clean, and neatly faked out on the dock, and very twisty because they just came out of the bag. The boat would be tidy and clean, as a very proud boat owner would want to show off their prowess and their shiny new boat. The running gear - lines, bumpers, the zodiac, is all new, and that would be very apparent to someone whose been around a marina - especially a diver.

 

But you turned it into a full paragraph of exposition about scratches on locks. Why did you handle it that way? I think you did that specifically so you could string out the story with the bubble trail and throw in an unnecessary cliffhanger. Tension in a story is a great thing, but when it's done with such a targeted, specific reason - string the reader along - it becomes tedious. It's a lot like the news broadcast telling me I need to tune in after the break to find the criminal in my neighborhood. Cliffhangers are fun - once in a while, used in moderation. Not every chapter has to string me along - I've been reading for 135 chapters, it's not like a quiet end to a chapter is going to stop me now.

 

Almost a million words, and if you really look at what's gone on in each chapter and ask "what happened in this chapter?" the answer is usually "not much".

 

Turn it into a web serial, which has no end, but is the "continuing adventures of Trevor and Shane". Write as many cliffies as you want in that environment.

 

You're at 143 chapters before its finished, at least.

 

Finish it. And then you will get a really great bit of review from me. As it is, I'm a little tired of catamarans floating around Australia while somebody reads a fax in Bermuda.

 

These are very valid points, in the main. I might quibble on scene you mentioned (how they judged the condition of Atlantis) though that would be unfair for reasons that come later (and thus you had no way of knowing). Did I do it that way just to cause tension? No. I'm right on the edge of what I can say without giving spoilers, but often, when something stands out like the locks issue, there's a reason. In this case, that scene holds clues. However, if we apply that same point you raised in to many other areas, yes, you're right. I'm a detail nut. Let's take the journey in through The Rip; That's not really plot relevant, and though there's a few clues and forshadowing in it, not much, and nothing that couldn't have been slipped in elsewhere.

 

So why did I do it? Basically, as I've come to realize, I'm trying to have my cake and eat it too. A lot of people, myself very much included, like stuff like that; detail about a place, a chance to vicariously do something unusual. However, what it clearly does also do is bog down the flow and pacing. A scene like the passage through The Rip might work very well in a novel principally about sailing around the world. In a story with a mystery/action theme, it drags. I'm trying to do both, and in many ways they work against each other. I do see that now.

 

However, A great many readers (this is part of why I need and crave feedback) have let me know that they love these kind of scenes. Others don't like them. As Wildone mentioned later in this thread, in a prior novel I went into great detail on the inner workings of a nuclear warhead, showing it in microsecond by millisecond detail. Many people loved it. Some hated it. There was little middle ground. The problem I face as a writer is I can either do, or not do, such scenes. I can't (at least I haven't figured out how yet) have them for those who like them while also not having them for those who don't. Could I get away with this in a published novel? Hell no. So you raise some extreemly valid points.

 

Thank you for your feedback. I truly wellcome ALL kinds of it, and in fact, constructive criticisim has often been of tremendous benifit to me.

 

Thanks!!!

CJ

 

 

Okay, CJ, you've shamed me into writing a response, but not a review (that will come at the conclusion of the story).

 

Circumnavigation is the single most frustrating story I've ever read. Why? Because when I get to the end of a chapter there's no other chapter to read. I have to wait an interminable amount of time, most often a whole week, sometimes even much longer, and be miserable wondering what's going to happen to Trev and Shane, what the Queen Bitch Bridget has up her sleeves, and most recently what new total idiocy that Joel and Lisa are getting themselves into. I can just imagine what it's going to be like if Bridget attends their wedding.

 

On reflection, I certainly hope Bridget does attend the wedding. That increases the likelihood of someone dying. So far the body count in Circumnavigation has been sorely lacking. We want dead bodies! With Bridget on the top of the pile! Or maybe Bridget can take Joel and Lisa to the pier to throw them to the alligators, and Lisa trips her and the Queen Bitch slips on the wet dock (I picture it raining) and ends up in the water herself. That would be simply delicious. On the other hand, eating her would probably make the alligators sick.

 

So here you have the best piracy and escape scenes of any story ever, Trevor surviving by using his wits, canned hot dogs, and some very good luck. Then Joel, who's the same age as Trevor and should be as smart as he is, and he and Lisa start spreading fliers around the Bahamas? With Bridget's picture on them? And claims she has Alzheimer's Disease? And that she's their relative? Has he reverted mentally to when he was twelve years old? I hope Robert locks them into separate rooms and feeds them nothing but toaster pastries and cheese curls and water until he gets his computers back.

 

Oh, did I mention that I love Circumnavigation, with all of its frustrations and cliffhangers included. Keep it coming until it's finished, then stop. You will, at that point, be inundated with email commentary and reviews and offers for publication.

 

Colin

 

Oh, Robert is not going to let Lisa and Jeol's antics go unpunished.

 

Yep, Lisa and Jeol did some dumb things. So has Trevor in some ways. He's very skilled in the ways of sailing, but not a lot else. Lisa and Joel are very skilled at causing trouble while meaning well.

 

Mr. James,

 

I always feel I don’t express myself as well as I should when I write, but I could have at least sent a simple, “Thank you for your wonderful story” every so often.

 

Praise is small currency for such great works. Circumnavigation has been entertaining, intriguing, thought provoking, and extremely educational. Thank you for sharing this work with us.

 

My home is in the Front Range of the Rocky Mountains, at least fifteen hundred miles from the nearest ocean, and I know absolutely nothing about sailing the seas, but your story has made me interested enough to want to try it. Your vivid description of Trevor’s voyage across the great Southern Ocean was exciting, down-right scary, and utterly believable. You are obviously well trained in naval concepts and sciences, but you are able to convey your knowledge in easily understood terms within the story without being trite or boring. It is damn good writing.

 

I look forward to reading you stories for many years to come.

 

Again, thank you,

 

Vin

 

Thank you!!

 

I need to mention more often (and I'll take this opertunity) that the story is a team effort. And yes, there will be more stories once this is done. For that, I thank you and all the others who have reponded by various means.

 

well the responses have been many and varied.

I am intrigued by those that are concerned about "too much detail" "too long to get to the end" etc as with all writing I read it's the journey that I enjoy and the detail is what makes the journey and it is certainly a bloody great journey we have been taken on here. Of course I wanted to know what happened next and yes I always wanted it to be Tuesday, but that is all part of the fun. And that CJ you have kept us coming back for 99+34 (or whatever bizarre numbering system you developed - blaming it on Australia!) chapters is a strong indication that quite a few of us enjoy the journey. keep it up.

 

Thanks!!!!

 

I have to admit, I love the detail stuff (that's why I write it) and many do, but some do not. All opinions on that are very valid IMHO.

 

And who am I to agrue with Australian Maths? I had to use that, just like I had to use your inverted seasonal calander and backwards-rotating storms.

The actual "views" are understated because the site only tracks how many readers go to the story page, not to each chapter. Those views are also overstated to the degree that people reread the story.

 

Another factor at play in my case: I was horendously slow (I excell at procrastination, when I get around to it) moving this story moved over to GA stories, so more than half of it was first published on my old site, so any hits there don't count for here.

 

Where to even begin, I guess it would be nice if I started off by saying I have enjoyed reading Circumnavigation for the most part......and I would enjoy reading the conclusion of it if you should decide to do so but if not I will not be terribly disappointed, afteall it wont be the first that I have read that the author has chosen not to finish and I am quite sure it wont be the last, thats just the way life is. I dont have to like it but I do have to accept it. I should also say that I do have my reasons for not replying to any or many of the stories I have read. First off I find it very annoying the hoops I have to jump through in order to respond and secondly the few times I have jumped thru those hoops I have found that shortly after registering on a site I find up getting a lot of junk mail, that the site promised me I wouldnt get but got anyway.

 

I agree very much with Gene Spicer PHD and his comments. You say only five more chapters but you cannot possibly finish up this story in five chapters and answer all the various plot lines you have going unless you decide to do something you have not done up to yet and that is give us five VERY ACTION PACKED CHAPTERS. All I can see you doing is taking us to a stopping point in this saga and then after a break starting a new story containing the same main characters several years down the road and then bring in some of the odd plot lines to weave into the story and continue on in that manner or some variation thereof. That is just my opinion and my view and afterall it is your story and you are free to take it in any direction you desire or feel necessary.

 

I know many if not most or nearly all will disagree with my posting here and that is fine, you wont be the first and certainly not the last to disagree with anything I post. Most are praising you for your great writing. Well I am not one to follow the "herd", I will say that you are a good author but your incinnation towards detail gets in the way of the story frequently. Also I know you are the master of the "cliffhanger" but you do tend to over use it, in my opinion.

 

Finally in closing I resent the hell out of it that you would threaten to withhold the ending chapters if "I" the reader dont write in and tell you how much I enjoy your story and beg you to continue. At this point I dont care if you continue posting the story or not, if you do I will read it but if you dont, "oh well" this wont be the first unfinished story I have read and it wont be the last I am quite sure. I am really not a HATER as I am sure some of you will say, you asked for my opinion or thoughts so you got them and you are free to do with them as you will. I would like to see the story continue to its conclusion but if not it wont be the end of my world. Thank you for listening to my rant, DEO"s Rant.

 

Thank you for taking the time to join and weigh in. I very much appreciate it.

 

What you are giving me here is feedback, which is exactly what I asked for. Feedback can be, and offten is, constructive ciricisim, as yours is. And I thank you for it.

 

As for what I did and did not threaten to do, what I said was that the lack of feedback was making me lose interest in posting chapers. That's a fact, it was.

 

I can promose that I am absolutly not going to just reach some stopping point and then do a "book II" or whatever. I may well revisit the world of Circumnavigation for a short story or two at some point, but that's all. There will be no sequel novel, because everything is wrapped up and resolved at the end. Will there be action? Of course.

 

I would definitely not call you a 'hater' for that post Anyone who has invested their time in, what is it? 240 chapters must enjoy the story enough to continue reading.

 

What I will say is that you just taking the time to express how you feel, I am pretty sure CJ will appreciate it. You didn't rant on him, you actually gave him constructive feedback about the cliffhangers and the amount of detail. It is nothing that CJ hasn't been told before, and actually embraced and used as he has continued. If you want to know to the littlest detail how to build a nuclear bomb, then read some of CJ's earlier stuff. He takes the feedback and does implement in his future writing.

 

To tell the truth, I am pessimistic too about finishing this in 5 chapters. The thing is, I know and most people know the goat can't count . Remember, this was supposed to be a 30 chapter story

 

The only thing I will ask about your comments is the signing in thing. After the initial setup of an account, I don't find it bothersome at all to type in my Username and Password in under a couple of seconds. Maybe I don't understand what the big hassle is I do know others have brought this up too. If you want, you can PM me with that answer and I'll see if I can either help you, or get some answers for you.

 

Over the years I have had numerous conversations with CJ about when my comments and what my feelings are about what he is writing. Both in the Forum as well as the PM system. If you do think that they all have me on the 'love train' singing my praises for CJ, then let me correct you I give CJ constructive feedback when he deserves it in my opinion. The funny thing is, CJ is equally grateful for the constructive feedback as he is with the complimentary feedback. He just craves feedback. If you can phrase it like you did above, don't ever be afraid to post something in his topic or in a PM to him.

 

No, you are not a 'hater'. I respect you for taking the time to put together a thoughtful post that doesn't follow the rest of the herd.

 

Absolutly!!! I love, and crave, all forms of feedback.

 

For those that don't know, a common reponse of mine to someone pointing out an error or problem is to go fix it (if possible), then add them to the writing credits with my sincere thanks. Why? Because they just helped me AND improved the story.

 

Sometimes, I may not be able to act on constructive citicisim even if I agree, due to it being too late in the story, etc. However, at the very least, I sure keep it in mind for the next one. This doesn't mean I agree with every bit of constructive criticisim, sometimes I don't. But I need to know what people are thinking, and even if I disagree, I thank them. An example would be a large amoutn of sex scenes. I get this one a lot, and it's somethng I won't do. It's just a personal taste thing; I object to that in a story as much as some here object to some of my tech detail scenes. That doesn't mean their point isn't valid (of course it is) it's just not me, so I thank them and polititely disagree.

 

CJ,

 

It has indeed been a long time since I have posted anything and in fact, you and Don Hanratty are about the only reasons I did not give up coming to GayAuthors completely. The new format is cumbersome and totally confusing to use. The redesign is not easy to navigate around, and the premium content is prohibitive for people like me who cannot pay for access. Many of the stories I have loved reading over the years are either locked behind the premium barrier or the authors have removed them/moved away from this listing. When one of my face is still posting, it is very difficult to access their stories. I have loved every story you have posted and Circumnavigation is definitely terrific! Please keep the story going - some of us old geezers don't do much besides reading these days. Thanks for all your wonderful writing and for blessing us with your superb writing. Sorry for my own rant but I thought maybe it may help others.

Tim (toolmanofla)

 

Thanks!!!

 

If at any time, you (or anyone) needs help with site features and naviagion, please feel free to ask me, publically or via PM, for help, and I'll do my best to do so.

 

Okay, I've more replies to make in this thread, but there's a software limit as to how many I can do at a time, plus I'm in the midst of a writing blitz. I'll be back a bit later, (and to do my PMs and emails too).

 

Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!

 

CJ

[Red_A]

This is my opinon, and not necessary anybody elses.

 

Quote from CJ "yes, you're right. I'm a detail nut. Let's take the journey in through The Rip; That's not really plot relevant, and though there's a few clues and forshadowing in it, not much, and nothing that couldn't have been slipped in elsewhere. "

 

The Rip is the most complex and difficult stretch of water in the world. It is the only place which has a course which not only tell you how to navigate the Rip but takes you out and shows you on the water, in fact for some classes of yachtsmen it is

is compulsory.

 

To leave the passage out, and only give a sentence, would be to ignore a great big hole in the road. A story loosely based on sailing ignoring the second worst Harbur entrance in the world!

 

In fact CJ gave only a tenth of the detail I thought necessary to give a feel of the task. So with data available, I rewrote the passage. It came to 5 pages. That was too much obviously and it was so complex that even a yachtsman about to enter the Rip would be bored to tears and not understand the Rip.

 

The second and third attempts reduced it to a page, but it was packed with detail.

 

From this exercise, I came to the conclusion, that CJ was about right, for the majority of readers, and that some would feel it was not complex enough and others too too much, But in the end I thought it was about right.

 

The other conclusion was that I thought the Sydney Yacht Club was right in saying that the only way to explain, was to take people on the water and show them.

[DavidGWM]

I have to confess that I am as guilty as others for failing to provide any feedback.

 

Circumnavigation is a wonderful piece of fiction which got me "hooked" when I first started reading it earlier last year.

 

Like others, I have looked forward to the weekly instalments and I have missed my weekly "fix" on those occasions when CJ has been unable to post the next instalment. I sincerely hope that CJ will be able to complete the story over the next few weeks - which I am sure will delight the hundreds of readers waiting, like me, with baited breath - wondering what fate awaits our heroes and villains.

 

Please CJ keep up with the good work and also keep an eye on the number of views that your story is getting (93,491 at the time of writing) - which suggests an average of 678 viewers (and loyal supporters) per chapter.

[Bob Hartman]

Guilty as charged! Yes, I have been one of those individuals who has never posted on your Forum or anyone else's on Gay Authors. I have this site Bookmarked on my Smartphone and before going to sleep at night I read a little. Sometimes it is the entire chapter other times, if I am really tired, it may be just a few paragraphs.

 

CJ, I think I have read everything you have posted here. I have read some of the Forum posts but not too many. I truly enjoy your writing and will miss Circumnavigation when it is completed. Someone else wrote here the possibility of turning this story into a screenplay and movie. It would be a task to get it condensed but there are great elements and continuous excitement. CJ, I respect you for not allowing your characters to be defined just because they happen to be gay.

 

My apology, for not commenting previously. I had never signed up. I just read and went to sleep. After reading your rant, I realized the significance of receiving feedback. I think your Stories are terrific! Thank you.

[TalonRider]

This is something that most of us are guilty of, including myself. Authors that I edit for, or beta read for, get comments sent back with the chapter. I don't do it enough for authors that I just read.

 

This isn't the first time an author has done something like this. My best advise is, let an author know what you think of their stories/chapters by particpating in their forum, leaving a comment with the story, or sending them a PM or email.

 

When you PM/Email the author, just don't say you like a chapter, let them know why you liked it. If you feel the need to criticise then do it constructively. If you do it right, you may just make yourself a friend. I have an author/friend that we talked about the story enough, if I had a question, he'd challenge me to find the answer and report back to him. A plus to all this is that we've actually met in person twice over the past few years.

[PDW51]

This is truly a firs for me, replying/leaving a comment. I have often consider sharing my thoughts about what I chose to read, but at the last minute I back off... why?

That is both hard and an extremely personal piece; part of it is about coming out of the closet after I turned fifty, a good 8 year's after my divorce and at a time when my daughter could understand. It was a time when for the first time in my life I was only taking care of me and I was finally ready to risk the reaction of my family [which did not go well when I tested the waters at the age of 19].

I started reading "gay' literature about 2 years before I came out, I wanted to understand not only myself but the evolution of the culture pre and post aid. Face it must of the men I was looking to meet and hopefully relate to had lost people hat mattered to aids.

Another part related to my professional life, I am an arts manager. I have managed Orchestras ans now I am the manager of a dance company. My personal views of arts are shared only with people I know; I never wanted to be considered a critic. I enjoy sharing my reactions in conversations, however they have always when in person, never online. There is something about making sure that I can clarify or explore a thought without creating offense that I find impossible online.

Finally, reading is a place I go to escape everything I deal with daily, yet I am drawn to stories that focus on the interactions of people. A great story gives me different viewpoints on the world, the best challenge my assumptions.

 

I understand your side of this as well, so finally I am taking the first step, which I grant has been all about me so far; so why do I enjoy your writing?

I enjoy the time you spent fully developing your characters, how their backgrounds make them act and react. There is also the note of the unexpected, you do as others noted, create great cliffhangers that make me wonder where you are heading... who will survive and who won't. There are many times as I read i think on conversations with my daughter [we are extremely close and always have been]; times when she could not hear what I was trying to tell her. so the challenges Trevor has with his father ring to true.

 

One last note, your "rant" got me thinking more about the potential relationship between authors and fans. I am not sure that I will start responding like this to others, but I will think about it more.

[Altimexis]

There isn't much I can add that hasn't already been said. No doubt that Circumnavigation is a gripping tale, albeit a bit long. It appears that when finished, it will be over a million words in length. My Naptown Tales series, which consisted of 25 interrelated short stories, a novella and two full-length novels, ran about half that overall, with another 250k being added in the sequel, Legacy (hey, I'm allowed to post a plug for my own writing). For comparison, a quick search reveals that War and Peace is close to 600k in length. Yes, Cricumnavigation is longer than War and Peace. It's only natural that, posted over a period of about three years now, comments for Circumnavigation will fall off over time. I seriously doubt, however, that readership is diminished greatly - such is the power of the story.

 

C.J. and I have very different writing styles and techniques. I would like to think I'm equally thorough when it comes to my background research, although my readers certainly point out when I make an error. The primary difference is that I will not start posting a novel until I have at minimum finished the first draft. It's not that I go back and make a lot of changes - I just want to be sure that I won't let my readers down by walking away from an unfinished story the way so many authors do. Not being under the constant pressure of posting, however, I think creates a different writing environment. Frankly, I'm amazed that C.J. is able to maintain such incredibly high quality with a write-as-you-go approach. Some of the greatest authors wrote for serial publications, however, so I certainly cannot fault the approach.

 

Another way we differ I think is in our need for feedback. Yes, I love to hear from my readers, but I write primarily for my own enjoyment and am far too used to the lack of feedback. I think my writing, particularly my more recent writing, is quite good for the most part, but it's obviously not the sort of thing most of the G.A. readership is looking for. I have no problem with that, and I really appreciate constructive comments, even when extremely negative. My only gripe is when a reader leaves feedback that is factually ungrounded and then never responds to my response. I think we all face that now and then.

 

I think C.J. has written an incredible story that will stand the test of time. I think it might have been better if it had been a bit shorter, but that's my personal opinion. It's not that a certain level of detail is needed to describe The Rip, for example, but there are entire sections and subplots that add little to the story. Not that I would expect any story to maintain the level of intensity of the pirate attack, but some of the slower parts of the book might have been abridged or left out entirely. One doesn't need to account for every day, nor should one try. This is an extremely minor complaint. I've thoroughly enjoyed reading Cicumnavigation and look forward to reading the final chapters, hopefully without any hiatus.

[Benji]

There isn't much I can add that hasn't already been said. No doubt that Circumnavigation is a gripping tale, albeit a bit long. It appears that when finished, it will be over a million words in length. My Naptown Tales series, which consisted of 25 interrelated short stories, a novella and two full-length novels, ran about half that overall, with another 250k being added in the sequel, Legacy (hey, I'm allowed to post a plug for my own writing). For comparison, a quick search reveals that War and Peace is close to 600k in length. Yes, Cricumnavigation is longer than War and Peace. It's only natural that, posted over a period of about three years now, comments for Circumnavigation will fall off over time. I seriously doubt, however, that readership is diminished greatly - such is the power of the story.

 

C.J. and I have very different writing styles and techniques. I would like to think I'm equally thorough when it comes to my background research, although my readers certainly point out when I make an error. The primary difference is that I will not start posting a novel until I have at minimum finished the first draft. It's not that I go back and make a lot of changes - I just want to be sure that I won't let my readers down by walking away from an unfinished story the way so many authors do. Not being under the constant pressure of posting, however, I think creates a different writing environment. Frankly, I'm amazed that C.J. is able to maintain such incredibly high quality with a write-as-you-go approach. Some of the greatest authors wrote for serial publications, however, so I certainly cannot fault the approach.

 

Another way we differ I think is in our need for feedback. Yes, I love to hear from my readers, but I write primarily for my own enjoyment and am far too used to the lack of feedback. I think my writing, particularly my more recent writing, is quite good for the most part, but it's obviously not the sort of thing most of the G.A. readership is looking for. I have no problem with that, and I really appreciate constructive comments, even when extremely negative. My only gripe is when a reader leaves feedback that is factually ungrounded and then never responds to my response. I think we all face that now and then.

 

I think C.J. has written an incredible story that will stand the test of time. I think it might have been better if it had been a bit shorter, but that's my personal opinion. It's not that a certain level of detail is needed to describe The Rip, for example, but there are entire sections and subplots that add little to the story. Not that I would expect any story to maintain the level of intensity of the pirate attack, but some of the slower parts of the book might have been abridged or left out entirely. One doesn't need to account for every day, nor should one try. This is an extremely minor complaint. I've thoroughly enjoyed reading Cicumnavigation and look forward to reading the final chapters, hopefully without any hiatus.

 

............... May I add that Aletimexis is an excellent writer whose stories can be found also in AWESOME DUDE

[C James]

There isn't much I can add that hasn't already been said. No doubt that Circumnavigation is a gripping tale, albeit a bit long. It appears that when finished, it will be over a million words in length. My Naptown Tales series, which consisted of 25 interrelated short stories, a novella and two full-length novels, ran about half that overall, with another 250k being added in the sequel, Legacy (hey, I'm allowed to post a plug for my own writing). For comparison, a quick search reveals that War and Peace is close to 600k in length. Yes, Cricumnavigation is longer than War and Peace. It's only natural that, posted over a period of about three years now, comments for Circumnavigation will fall off over time. I seriously doubt, however, that readership is diminished greatly - such is the power of the story.

 

C.J. and I have very different writing styles and techniques. I would like to think I'm equally thorough when it comes to my background research, although my readers certainly point out when I make an error. The primary difference is that I will not start posting a novel until I have at minimum finished the first draft. It's not that I go back and make a lot of changes - I just want to be sure that I won't let my readers down by walking away from an unfinished story the way so many authors do. Not being under the constant pressure of posting, however, I think creates a different writing environment. Frankly, I'm amazed that C.J. is able to maintain such incredibly high quality with a write-as-you-go approach. Some of the greatest authors wrote for serial publications, however, so I certainly cannot fault the approach.

 

Another way we differ I think is in our need for feedback. Yes, I love to hear from my readers, but I write primarily for my own enjoyment and am far too used to the lack of feedback. I think my writing, particularly my more recent writing, is quite good for the most part, but it's obviously not the sort of thing most of the G.A. readership is looking for. I have no problem with that, and I really appreciate constructive comments, even when extremely negative. My only gripe is when a reader leaves feedback that is factually ungrounded and then never responds to my response. I think we all face that now and then.

 

I think C.J. has written an incredible story that will stand the test of time. I think it might have been better if it had been a bit shorter, but that's my personal opinion. It's not that a certain level of detail is needed to describe The Rip, for example, but there are entire sections and subplots that add little to the story. Not that I would expect any story to maintain the level of intensity of the pirate attack, but some of the slower parts of the book might have been abridged or left out entirely. One doesn't need to account for every day, nor should one try. This is an extremely minor complaint. I've thoroughly enjoyed reading Cicumnavigation and look forward to reading the final chapters, hopefully without any hiatus.

 

I agree about not posting until the first draft is done. I have thought, many times, that that's the best way. I think the flow would have been far better, and there are some things that, yes, I'd trim. My problem is that, without feedback and interaction, plus the deadlines of a posting schedule, I'd have never had the motivation to actually get it written, so for me, a serial was the only way.

 

I think I was about 12 chapters into Circumnavigation before I began to post. (not counting the final two, and some drafts of sections such as the Indian Ocean crossing).

 

One thing I have noticed; when I'm only a chapter or so ahead of the posting schedule, I find the quality drops. I haven't been happy with my writing at times like those.

 

Thanks!!!

 

This is truly a firs for me, replying/leaving a comment. I have often consider sharing my thoughts about what I chose to read, but at the last minute I back off... why?

That is both hard and an extremely personal piece; part of it is about coming out of the closet after I turned fifty, a good 8 year's after my divorce and at a time when my daughter could understand. It was a time when for the first time in my life I was only taking care of me and I was finally ready to risk the reaction of my family [which did not go well when I tested the waters at the age of 19].

I started reading "gay' literature about 2 years before I came out, I wanted to understand not only myself but the evolution of the culture pre and post aid. Face it must of the men I was looking to meet and hopefully relate to had lost people hat mattered to aids.

Another part related to my professional life, I am an arts manager. I have managed Orchestras ans now I am the manager of a dance company. My personal views of arts are shared only with people I know; I never wanted to be considered a critic. I enjoy sharing my reactions in conversations, however they have always when in person, never online. There is something about making sure that I can clarify or explore a thought without creating offense that I find impossible online.

Finally, reading is a place I go to escape everything I deal with daily, yet I am drawn to stories that focus on the interactions of people. A great story gives me different viewpoints on the world, the best challenge my assumptions.

 

I understand your side of this as well, so finally I am taking the first step, which I grant has been all about me so far; so why do I enjoy your writing?

I enjoy the time you spent fully developing your characters, how their backgrounds make them act and react. There is also the note of the unexpected, you do as others noted, create great cliffhangers that make me wonder where you are heading... who will survive and who won't. There are many times as I read i think on conversations with my daughter [we are extremely close and always have been]; times when she could not hear what I was trying to tell her. so the challenges Trevor has with his father ring to true.

 

One last note, your "rant" got me thinking more about the potential relationship between authors and fans. I am not sure that I will start responding like this to others, but I will think about it more.

 

Thank you!

 

Trying to get background and detail right is somewhat of an obsession of mine. I also have an absolutely awesome team, who never cease to amaze me. I can't count the times they have saved the story from errors large and small, ranging from typos to factual errors. To give an example from the most recent chapter, if it wasn't for the team we'd have seen Trevor with one hand on the wheel, one on the radio, and with a sandwich in the other. Three hands. Or, the building Gray was in in Brisbane; I originally had it as a hotel, but though it is now, it wasn't in 2007. This story is very much a team effort.

 

Thanks for joining in, and welcome!!

 

Guilty as charged! Yes, I have been one of those individuals who has never posted on your Forum or anyone else's on Gay Authors. I have this site Bookmarked on my Smartphone and before going to sleep at night I read a little. Sometimes it is the entire chapter other times, if I am really tired, it may be just a few paragraphs.

 

CJ, I think I have read everything you have posted here. I have read some of the Forum posts but not too many. I truly enjoy your writing and will miss Circumnavigation when it is completed. Someone else wrote here the possibility of turning this story into a screenplay and movie. It would be a task to get it condensed but there are great elements and continuous excitement. CJ, I respect you for not allowing your characters to be defined just because they happen to be gay.

 

My apology, for not commenting previously. I had never signed up. I just read and went to sleep. After reading your rant, I realized the significance of receiving feedback. I think your Stories are terrific! Thank you.

 

Thanks!

I have always felt that too much is made of sexual orientation. It does not define who we are, so the same applies to my characters.

 

 

I have to confess that I am as guilty as others for failing to provide any feedback.

 

Circumnavigation is a wonderful piece of fiction which got me "hooked" when I first started reading it earlier last year.

 

Like others, I have looked forward to the weekly instalments and I have missed my weekly "fix" on those occasions when CJ has been unable to post the next instalment. I sincerely hope that CJ will be able to complete the story over the next few weeks - which I am sure will delight the hundreds of readers waiting, like me, with baited breath - wondering what fate awaits our heroes and villains.

 

Please CJ keep up with the good work and also keep an eye on the number of views that your story is getting (93,491 at the time of writing) - which suggests an average of 678 viewers (and loyal supporters) per chapter.

 

One thing skewing the statistics; my slowness. We were around 80 chapters into the story before I moved it over to GA stories.

 

Right now, I think I'm on track to get this completed and posted before my mid-November departure (I'll be gone until New Year's) . I promise I'll do all I can to make that happen.

 

This is my opinon, and not necessary anybody elses.

 

Quote from CJ "yes, you're right. I'm a detail nut. Let's take the journey in through The Rip; That's not really plot relevant, and though there's a few clues and forshadowing in it, not much, and nothing that couldn't have been slipped in elsewhere. "

 

The Rip is the most complex and difficult stretch of water in the world. It is the only place which has a course which not only tell you how to navigate the Rip but takes you out and shows you on the water, in fact for some classes of yachtsmen it is

is compulsory.

 

To leave the passage out, and only give a sentence, would be to ignore a great big hole in the road. A story loosely based on sailing ignoring the second worst Harbur entrance in the world!

 

In fact CJ gave only a tenth of the detail I thought necessary to give a feel of the task. So with data available, I rewrote the passage. It came to 5 pages. That was too much obviously and it was so complex that even a yachtsman about to enter the Rip would be bored to tears and not understand the Rip.

 

The second and third attempts reduced it to a page, but it was packed with detail.

 

From this exercise, I came to the conclusion, that CJ was about right, for the majority of readers, and that some would feel it was not complex enough and others too too much, But in the end I thought it was about right.

 

The other conclusion was that I thought the Sydney Yacht Club was right in saying that the only way to explain, was to take people on the water and show them.

 

The Rip is indeed complex. One of the things I like about writing stories that involve travel (almost all of mine have) is being able to show interesting and unusual places. It's somewhere I've never been and would like to one day.

[wetcoaster]

thanks for another riveting chapter. Although it's nowhere near a cliff, my fingers are tender from all the nail biting. Love the tale.

[C James]

thanks for another riveting chapter. Although it's nowhere near a cliff, my fingers are tender from all the nail biting. Love the tale.

 

Thanks!!!

 

As always, no cliffs or cliffhangers.