Poor Man's Son

[KYE]

Okay, my real issue with this chapter and what no one else seems to be saying is; Gathan is a rapist... I don't care how you look at it, he was told no by two people and f@%$^d them anyway, that is rape.... I don't care if it is because of anger issues, and with his parentage and early life I can understand why he would have them. Brad just killed a guy for doing much less to his kids than Gathan has done to two others...

 

I am going to reserve judgement on how I end up feeling about this storyline for the next few chapters but I really think there has to be some kind of consequence for Gathan's behaviour.

 

I agree he is a rapist but this is by no means the first story Mark has that includes rape or violent sex. Even JP tied up and raped a student in the first CAP story. Plus a teenage Hayes boy raping another teenage Hayes boy, Hmmmm, haven't we read that before? Sadly most of the times Mark tries to explain it as "partly" ok, like here saying the girl had 3 orgasms while getting raped. It is like it is ok to ignore someone saying NO as long as they get off. (i.e. JP raping his student, Gathan raping this girl). NOT. But yet Robbie got off being raped and has a lifetime of problems because of it. Mixed messages from the stories.

 

Personally I'll be glad when Mark gets past his obsession of including rape and violent sex as such a huge part of his stories.

 

I too will try to reserve judgement on how I end up feeling about this storyline for the next few chapters.

[Westie]

Im liking this story, but Im still unsure where its going.... Im hoping to see less interaction with minors in a pseudo-sexual setting though, I find that a little uncomfortable.

[methodwriter85]

Im liking this story, but Im still unsure where its going.... Im hoping to see less interaction with minors in a pseudo-sexual setting though, I find that a little uncomfortable.

 

I'm assuming that when Gathan goes off to college, he'll meet more age-appropriate guys and his flirtation with Will is going to settle down into a nice friendship. I mean, I know CAP isn't known for it's realism, but buying that a 9th grade kid is going to be allowed to hang out with a bunch of college kids is just too much of a suspension of disbelief. Seniors, yes. College kids? No. I know Brad is generally relaxed, but that would be ridiculous.

 

You know, Mark, this whole thing would have been a moot issue if you had just skipped over to 2004 or so when Will's eighteen and Gathan's 22....

Edited March 18, 2011 by methodwriter85

[Ivy]

when Gathan gets to Stanford in the fall will Matt and Wade be sophomores or juniors?? just wondering...it's been a while since they were center stage and I can't seem to remember if its been 1 or 2 years since bloodlines.

[methodwriter85]

It's junior year for Matt and Wade...which means it's time to start looking for internships, doing things like study abroad, and looking at grad schools and the like.

[PrivateTim]

I remember when every freaking girl had a crush on Jonathan Taylor Thomas, so you're right.

 

I remember when every freaking gay boy had a crush on JTT and the rumors about him flew hot and heavy around L.A.

[davewri]

Mark,

 

Please, please, please....Move away from the pedo stuff! Soon you'll have Gathan and Will inside Brad's S&M chamber.

 

You are a fantastic writer but we don't need to go down the dark road with children.

[Mark Arbour]

Mark,

 

Please, please, please....Move away from the pedo stuff! Soon you'll have Gathan and Will inside Brad's S&M chamber.

 

You are a fantastic writer but we don't need to go down the dark road with children.

 

Actually, I kind of expected more comments like this. Let me put you on the spot: When you were under 16, did you ever sleep with, or want to sleep with, an older guy?

 

The reason that I asked this is because I've had 3 other guys take me to task for that, and when push came to shove, all of them had answered yes to that question.

[Westie]

Actually, I kind of expected more comments like this. Let me put you on the spot: When you were under 16, did you ever sleep with, or want to sleep with, an older guy?

 

The reason that I asked this is because I've had 3 other guys take me to task for that, and when push came to shove, all of them had answered yes to that question.

 

Yes I did. Absolutely I did. I don't think that was the point anyone was making.

 

 

I think the beef people(and I) had might have been the portrayal, and perhaps the level of graphic detail included. You're an incredibly talented writer. I feel sure you could have found a way to subtly convey the truth and realism, without such detail

 

 

[davewri]

Mark,

I had my first sexual experience when I was six years old with a kid that was nine years old. And as I got older I looked at older guys too. When I was in college I had a sex partner that was in high school. Of course we have all had experience with all ages, that's not the point. Please don't go too far on this subject.

 

It's because you are such a great writer that you evoke such emotional involement for us readers. We will read every word you write.

[sat8997]

Okay then...I've had more than enough, thank you very much.

 

Dudes...chill the f**k out. We're, what, three chapters in? Might be nice to just let the story unfold.

[Hermetically Sealed]

Sorry, not getting the pedo comments, so far everyone has been below adult age. Teenagers are sexually active (even if only masturbation). In no way has Mark been gratuitous in dealing with this. He hasn't sensationalized the sexuality. If anything, it's been pretty dry.

 

As for Gathan, I think he's handling things in his head the way someone that age likely would. He's not an adult, nor is/was he mature enough to think like one. It's easy for a detached reader to understand just how bad what he did was, and place judgment. Not excusing what Gathan did. It was wrong, but the way Mark has portrayed his handling of the situation seems fairly realistic. He knows what he did was wrong. He may or may not understand just how wrong his actions were, but he obviously understands enough to determine not to place himself in that situation anymore.

[Mark Arbour]

Sorry, not getting the pedo comments, so far everyone has been below adult age. Teenagers are sexually active (even if only masturbation). In no way has Mark been gratuitous in dealing with this. He hasn't sensationalized the sexuality. If anything, it's been pretty dry.

 

As for Gathan, I think he's handling things in his head the way someone that age likely would. He's not an adult, nor is/was he mature enough to think like one. It's easy for a detached reader to understand just how bad what he did was, and place judgment. Not excusing what Gathan did. It was wrong, but the way Mark has portrayed his handling of the situation seems fairly realistic. He knows what he did was wrong. He may or may not understand just how wrong his actions were, but he obviously understands enough to determine not to place himself in that situation anymore.

 

I think that's really the key...that he's trying to solve his own problems by not putting himself in that situation. In my way of thinking, a barely 18-year-old male would probably be self-reliant (figure out how to solve things on his own), and would solve the problem by avoidance ("I just won't have sex anymore"). I don't know that he'd overly moralize about things, especially since the most serious aspect of what he did was with Zach, and there were probably issues there before they f**ked around.

 

Okay then...I've had more than enough, thank you very much.

 

Dudes...chill the f**k out. We're, what, three chapters in? Might be nice to just let the story unfold.

 

You're right, but it's always interesting after the story is done to go back and see what everyone said in the beginning, and compare that to how things turned out.

[Mark Arbour]

Here's my personal view on minors and sex, and I'll use this to guide myself through the storyline. I figure that once guys hit puberty, they're going to be sexually active. So the questions that I have to answer are this:

 

1. What is the fictional-story age range limit for a partner for a minor? Generally speaking, my rule is a maximum of 5 years older.

 

2. What kind of sexual activities should a guy under the age of 16 be involved in? Before that age, I can see guys involved in frottage, jacking-off (mutually, alone, with each other, all the time, etc.), body exploration ("If I put my finger here, does it feel good?"), and oral sex (blow jobs and rimming). If they are involved in actual f**king, it will be with another minor that is close in age to them.

[davewri]

Sorry to stir up controversy about the age difference thing. Just a creepy premonition of where Mark might take the story. Having read all of the CAP series I know Mark will give this generation the same well written character development we have come to expect.

 

(Somehow when I read about Captain Sir George Granger sleeping with younger or older men it doesn't bother me as much.)

[sat8997]

Here's my personal view on minors and sex, and I'll use this to guide myself through the storyline. I figure that once guys hit puberty, they're going to be sexually active. So the questions that I have to answer are this:

 

1. What is the fictional-story age range limit for a partner for a minor? Generally speaking, my rule is a maximum of 5 years older.

 

2. What kind of sexual activities should a guy under the age of 16 be involved in? Before that age, I can see guys involved in frottage, jacking-off (mutually, alone, with each other, all the time, etc.), body exploration ("If I put my finger here, does it feel good?"), and oral sex (blow jobs and rimming). If they are involved in actual f**king, it will be with another minor that is close in age to them.

 

You forgot one.

 

3. Exactly how far can I push Sharon before she smacks me on the nose with a rolled up newspaper? :king:

[mmike1969]

just stirring the old pot:

 

what was more graphic and disrurbing?

a) Will and Gathan?

B.) Brian and Dino?

Edited March 20, 2011 by mmike1969

[Mark Arbour]

just stirring the old pot:

 

what was more graphic and disrurbing?

a) Will and Gathan?

B.) Brian and Dino?

 

What was more graphic and disturbing?

A) Will and Gathan?

B.) Brian and Dino?

C) Neither. Both were hot.

 

You forgot about the perverts in the crowd.

 

You forgot one.

 

3. Exactly how far can I push Sharon before she smacks me on the nose with a rolled up newspaper? :king:

 

OUCH!

[methodwriter85]

I was initially pretty freaked out about it, but then I thought about it and realized that just because I think a 15-year old is a child, they themselves don't feel that way, and most of them don't want sit around and play with tonka trucks anymore. (Malibu Stacey for JJ. )

 

It's in character for Will, as a guy with a more mature body, to be sexually active. John Hobart, I'm guessing, is also very mature for his physical age, and therefore it's not that surprising he's having sex at 12.

 

The only one I can't see as sexually active would be JJ. I feel having him sexually active as this point would be out of character. Mainly because most people at 14, male or female, don't go for 14-year old boys who still look like they're 11 or 12. They go for the guys who are built like Will and John. But I'm also arguing chastity for JJ because of the expectations JJ's under to maintain a pristine, virginal image as a figure skater. Finally, I can't really see that many people being all that interested in a prissy diva- his current persona would be a buzzkill in terms of dating.

 

Hopefully JJ will take a backseat with all this sexuality stuff, and we won't see him getting into that stuff until he's at least 16 or 17. I'm assuming he won't be hit with the puberty stick until he's about that age.

Edited March 20, 2011 by methodwriter85

[PrivateTim]

Mark,

 

Please, please, please....Move away from the pedo stuff! Soon you'll have Gathan and Will inside Brad's S&M chamber.

 

You are a fantastic writer but we don't need to go down the dark road with children.

 

Dark Road? I had my first sexual encounters at 13 and thought I had made the greatest discovery ever. Dark road? I don't get that.

 

Mark,

I had my first sexual experience when I was six years old with a kid that was nine years old. And as I got older I looked at older guys too. When I was in college I had a sex partner that was in high school. Of course we have all had experience with all ages, that's not the point. Please don't go too far on this subject.

 

It's because you are such a great writer that you evoke such emotional involement for us readers. We will read every word you write.

 

If we've all had experience with all ages, then what is the point? In case you don't get it, teens are very active sexually these days and are much more sexually aware than ever. I am not saying it is good or bad, but I don't get this artificial attitude built around the age of 18. I had an umteenth grandfather serving in the Connecticut Regiment at age 13 in the Revolution and his grandson (or great grandson) served in the Pennsylvania Regiment at 16 in the Civil War.

 

Somehow we have this attitude where at under 17 we have to shield them from everything and then bang, the next day they turn 18 and now they can vote, make all their own life decisions and live in a world we don't want to prepare them for.

[Mark Arbour]

Somehow we have this attitude where at under 17 we have to shield them from everything and then bang, the next day they turn 18 and now they can vote, make all their own life decisions and live in a world we don't want to prepare them for.

 

But they still can't drink.

[davewri]

You missed the point entirely. I have no issues about age differences in mutual relationships. When I was 13 I was hitting on anyone and everyone (even did a few girls...ewww). Of course kids are more active now than ever before thanks to the internet and cell phones. The best time of a kids life are the hours after school and before the parents get home.

 

What bothered me is that Mark has introduced the S&M room in Brad's house. I was referring to the apparent rage building in Gathan and I wouldn't want to see Will and Gathan in that room . The only reference to age I meant to imply was that I wouldn't care to read about teenagers and S&M.

 

I'm sure Mark will write another great story that will keep us all waiting for each chapter.

[methodwriter85]

I honestly don't think Mark would go with having 13-year olds having fun in the S&M room. There are some lines that shouldn't get crossed. And 13-year olds aren't interested in stuff like that anyway. At that age it's all about early tenative sexual exploration- I don't think someone's going to look up ways to spice up sex when they're still new to it.

 

I just had this thought- maybe the discomfort we've having is because we've followed Brad's kids since they were babies, and they were pretty well-featured. Brad existed in the story as a kid, but he didn't get that well-featured until he was about 11 with the Land Whore. But for Brad's kids, they've been featured a lot as little kids. So it's like, in a sense, Will and JJ feel like they're our own kids, and it's hard switching from seeing them as little kids to seeing them as sexually active teenagers.

 

Well, Will and John. JJ's still pure as snow. Or at least he pretends he is for PR purposes.

[PrivateTim]

You missed the point entirely. I have no issues about age differences in mutual relationships. When I was 13 I was hitting on anyone and everyone (even did a few girls...ewww). Of course kids are more active now than ever before thanks to the internet and cell phones. The best time of a kids life are the hours after school and before the parents get home.

 

What bothered me is that Mark has introduced the S&M room in Brad's house. I was referring to the apparent rage building in Gathan and I wouldn't want to see Will and Gathan in that room . The only reference to age I meant to imply was that I wouldn't care to read about teenagers and S&M.

 

I'm sure Mark will write another great story that will keep us all waiting for each chapter.

 

If I missed the point entirely, it is because you failed to articulate it.

 

There is no correlation between the SM room Brad and Robbie's house and what has happened with any of the kids.

 

It was the "stop the pedo stuff" comment that really irked me given that there was nothing "pedo" at all since that would involve pre-pubescent children and none of the children are pre-pubescent.

 

But they still can't drink.

 

And I would change that too.

 

Either move the voting age back to 21 or move the drinking age back to 18.

[methodwriter85]

Unfortunately there will never be a concentrated movement to get the drinking age back down to 18.

Edited March 21, 2011 by methodwriter85