Schmaltz, saccharine, sickening

[Dannsar]

Having spent a lot of time on Nifty, and now having arrived here, I find that it is a truth, if not universally acknowledgeable, then certainly supportable, that writers of gay oriented fiction have an overbearing fondness for true love in the first chapter, which goes on forever and which is as sweet and understanding as a politician handing out lollies to babies on election day.

 

Often young characters fall truly madly deeply in love with most incredible gentleness, stacks of understanding, huge amounts of quiet forebearance of their hidden sexuality, and make the most mature decisions possible. And these, by the way, are decisions that their grandparents would fail to make, even with the wisdom of their years.

 

GA authors at least have a breadth of styles, but even here there is a tendency for Josh and Ben to discuss their emergent sexuality in a grown up fashion, before making the stressful decision to come out to each other. And thy are way frequently each others' best friend since before the womb, and love each other in that way only straight guys can. I mean, come on. Since when were fifteen year old males going to be anything other than awkward with this topic. And once they'd got it out there, since when were they not going to get it all out there, and as many ejaculations as possible, as fast as possible. There would be little caressing of smooth skin. There is statistically little chance of them both being six packed hunks. There is very little likelihood that they would never have a disagreement. The topic of love is pretty unlikely to raise its head in the first five paragraphs. And gentle breaking in of a partners anus with the apparently requisite standard of three fingers is almost obligatory. Yet, it is these nirvanas we are sold over and over.

 

Or is it just me?

[Cyhort]

Because real life is depressing. Stories, especially love stories, should be a pleasant escape and leave you feeling happy. At least that's how I feel.

[Sylphic]

No, I think I agree. Teenagers are typically hormone-led and do tend to fear what other people think of them, as a large generality.

Yet the understanding with which some of these teens settle arguments and accept each other is beyond my comprehension.

Still, I can't say I mind for the most part. These are written as a way to escape, and I guess a lot of us are suckers for happy endings. (:

Or beginnings, as you mentioned, Dannsar.

Maybe not always one hundred percent realistic, but the writing is entertaining, which is all I'm looking for!

[Agaith]

I agree with Cyhort I read to escape life and to enjoy myself. If I start reading about more of what I've tried to escape from it's not really escaping is it?

Everyone knows that what happens in the stories rarely happens in real life, hence the fiction part.

You may want to have realism in your stories and I'm sure you can find an author that does that. Most readers like to escape from the grind of life and read something that ends happily in the end, me included.

[Nephylim]

Clearly you haven't read my stories

[Marzipan]

Well it is about the ultimate romance fantasy. Same with straight romance. I can see the patterns too! But after reading - uhm - countles stories from both sides I still can continue reading them. I have found other types of stories in GA and I always get a huff when someone does something positively differently.

 

 

 

I'm not easy to surprise though.

 

 

[Agaith]

Clearly you haven't read my stories

 

Apart from Nephy's stories

Yes yours are far from sweet lmao

[Dark]

I think all genres have their stereotypes. These are part of what defines the genre. Realism isn't something typically found in the online romance genre (straight or gay). If you've ever read Harlequin books or even just the back page summary, you'll know that this debate, realism vs. romance, has been around since this genre began.

[Cia]

Yep, my characters usually find love. I met my husband and started dating him pretty much that night, almost 14 years ago. Attraction is definitely possible at first sight and I totally believe it can lead, sometimes very quickly, to love. I think that comes into my stories but the relationship usually isn't smooth sailing though and I'm a smart lady; I make sure at least one is 'experienced' so that I don't have to write that fumbling in. The one story I would say I wrote and focused on teenagers, 'Escaping the Pain', doesn't have sex in it at all and they're both virgins. Maybe I was avoiding writing sex in on purpose so I could put that off until I can get them in college and a little bit more comfortable in their own skin. I try to make the sex as realistic as possible and run it by at least one accomodating 'gay guy' author to make sure it's not totally off since I'm a woman and hampered at least a little with some of the details of sex with 2 men. I will have to say that I laugh at all of those 'virgins who are stretched a little and then sex is totally comfortable, what were all those people talking about??' plots. At least I know that isn't true.

[TetRefine]

The exact reason I stay away from most high school aged stories. They are usually way too romance heavy and unrealistic.

[Prince Duchess]

The exact reason I stay away from most high school aged stories. They are usually way too romance heavy and unrealistic.

 

Nah, I disagree there are some high school stories out there that depict high school the way it kind of was.... The Secret Life Of Billy Chase its very realistic.

[Dannsar]

Well, I reckon, they're bonkers , but I also think they are perfectly "acceptable". I mean, we do all need to escape. Heck, sometimes I wish I could escape permanently So, I reckon I can see Cyhort and Agaith's point. I hadn't really considered that people might want these for a reason, rather than for, say, laziness. So, I guess I've learnt something there.

 

This is purely a matter of taste, and I don't for a minute believe I have a right to demand blood and guts pain at every turn. On the other hand, I kinda think that escaping blackness into whiteness just presents a different set of problems. And it's quite difficult to 'believe' in a character if everything goes awfully well. Just as much as it is difficult if everything goes awfully hell, too. I mean, is it really the case that lots of kids get thrown on the street by belligerent fathers?

 

Actually Stetson Boy by JC is a great version of the very sweet being tempered by the pretty awful, and nobody could call that story real, fabulous though it was. Jian's story went all round the houses to get to the sweet bit, via an awful lot of bitter. That made it all the more delectable.

 

These are only two recent paradigms, by the way, and should not be seen as reflections of this topic. What made the sweet escapism positive, was the tribulation en route.

 

Anyhow, I'm not trying to solve a problem here, just trying to get a grip on it, and perhaps try to effect a little change where possible. The world would be hell were it to reflect my world view.

[Toast]

If it is a good story, it is a good story. That can be any genre. Heck lots of stories that need work are worth reading. I have written about love and I have written sex. Realistic or complete fantasy, I can't get enough. Thus I read and write. Oh, my point, I try to put my stamp on it for good or bad.

[Dannsar]

Oh, and Nephy ... no ruddy wonder ... you're terrifying (but I will get there ... perhaps now, even, since I'm finished the anthology)

[Former Member]

Because real life is depressing. Stories, especially love stories, should be a pleasant escape and leave you feeling happy. At least that's how I feel.

 

Was thinking of saying the same thing. You beat me to it.

 

not every story I've read have the happy ever after ending, or the original couple lasting life long.

Personally I do like an happy ending though. As cyhort said, real life can be depressing it's nice to read a good story were things do work out well for the characters that we end up bonding with. Because in real life it hardly ever does.

[TrevorTime]

Because real life is depressing. Stories, especially love stories, should be a pleasant escape and leave you feeling happy. At least that's how I feel.

 

I totally agree with this. If I want some real life depressing moments, I can always read the local online newspaper.

 

So even though some gay fiction has its ups and downs, at the end of the day, it's still.............................fiction.

 

 

[Former Member]

The Secret Life Of Billy Chase its very realistic.

 

I agree, a great read aswell.

[One Cheap Suit]

We do have to admit there is a formula at work, eh?

 

- Kid wakes up to an alarm clock or a mom yelling at him to get up for school

- Formulaic, unnecessary description of kid's physical attributes, leading to a shower/wank scene

- Kid goes to school

- Kid falls in love with quarterback whose been eying him since the beginning of the year, kid and QB/boyfriend hook up in a hot sex scene or six

- Somebody walks in on them doing the deed OR

- Kid gets outed by former best friend with homophobia issues

- Kid gets beat up by football team pissed off by QB's newly discovered gay tendencies

--OR kicked out of his house

--OR beat up by the drunk mean dad

--OR hit by a car

---OR all of the above

- QBBF and kid profess eternal love over a hospital bed

- Kid moves in with understanding, tolerant parents of the QBBF

- Best friend gets his shit together and says sorry

 

Tweak this formula with

- parents killed by freak auto accident

- Understanding, snarky fag hag best friend who pushes QB and kid to get together

- Quirky best friend/understanding older brother/uncle who fixes things

 

I can pretty much tell by sentence #3 in any given Nifty/HS story where we're going to end up. GA is different in that some, not all, of these set pieces get taken down, but still, a creative writing class is sometimes warranted.

[TetRefine]

We do have to admit there is a formula at work, eh?

 

- Kid wakes up to an alarm clock or a mom yelling at him to get up for school

- Formulaic, unnecessary description of kid's physical attributes, leading to a shower/wank scene

- Kid goes to school

- Kid falls in love with quarterback whose been eying him since the beginning of the year, kid and QB/boyfriend hook up in a hot sex scene or six

- Somebody walks in on them doing the deed OR

- Kid gets outed by former best friend with homophobia issues

- Kid gets beat up by football team pissed off by QB's newly discovered gay tendencies

--OR kicked out of his house

--OR beat up by the drunk mean dad

--OR hit by a car

---OR all of the above

- QBBF and kid profess eternal love over a hospital bed

- Kid moves in with understanding, tolerant parents of the QBBF

- Best friend gets his shit together and says sorry

 

Tweak this formula with

- parents killed by freak auto accident

- Understanding, snarky fag hag best friend who pushes QB and kid to get together

- Quirky best friend/understanding older brother/uncle who fixes things

 

I can pretty much tell by sentence #3 in any given Nifty/HS story where we're going to end up. GA is different in that some, not all, of these set pieces get taken down, but still, a creative writing class is sometimes warranted.

 

 

You absolutely nailed it here. And I laughed at every point thinking of several Nifty stories that fit this exact description.

 

 

[Kev de Cauchery]

I actually agree with Dannsar, but then, I came here to find the exact type of story Dann talked about. To escape, like others said.

 

But then that's also why I write. I'm going to shamelessly plug my stories here because they are a bit different. A lot different recently if I may say. I try to explore and experiment a bit.

 

: P Prolly that's why people don't love them. Anyway, I'm a review whore. ：P

 

 

[Guest solesofwind]

Hi everyone, i'm a newbie here^^. I've just found this site and haven't read any stories other than Nephylim's but I'm a loyal reader of literotica.com and have read hundreds stories there. There're many stories there that fit exactly bigdave's decriptions but there're also realistic and quality ones which I really love. I'm gonna discovering this site more cuz I'm having free time^^ to see if the stories here have any difference^^. by the way, anyone here reading stories at literotica, i mean gay male ones? Some stories there are really wonderful.

[Marzipan]

Hi everyone, i'm a newbie here^^. I've just found this site and haven't read any stories other than Nephylim's but I'm a loyal reader of literotica.com and have read hundreds stories there. There're many stories there that fit exactly bigdave's decriptions but there're also realistic and quality ones which I really love. I'm gonna discovering this site more cuz I'm having free time^^ to see if the stories here have any difference^^. by the way, anyone here reading stories at literotica, i mean gay male ones? Some stories there are really wonderful.

 

 

Hey sweetie! Wlcome to GA! GO wild with the stories here, there is much variety within the stories and authors and genres. I can say I have read all decent gay stories in Lit and stolen few of the best authors here too. You know Zolia_Lily? She transferred here My gal

 

She is a perfect example for not writing the obvious. She did that with her first gay story and after that... well she has blown my mind with anything she has written. Sadly not much of it posted anywhere. I believe she is the ones to get publishing deals.

 

Whe I write anything within the romance genre, I do try to avoid the clishees, but... obviously some f them are there. I like to bring (and read) raunchy twists and if a story has something unexpected in it - stands out - it catches my eyes. Good example is Kingdom by the Sea's Social Skills - she plays with the stereotypes but makes them something totally different and real. The sex in her story felt realistic and not like mechanic "written in the stars" type.

 

I could rant all day about my favorities and WHY they are special. But as Dark said earlier, it is called a genre for a reason. There are other genres in the site if one gets bored with the romance.

[PrivateTim]

We do have to admit there is a formula at work, eh?

 

- Kid wakes up to an alarm clock or a mom yelling at him to get up for school

- Formulaic, unnecessary description of kid's physical attributes, leading to a shower/wank scene

- Kid goes to school

- Kid falls in love with quarterback whose been eying him since the beginning of the year, kid and QB/boyfriend hook up in a hot sex scene or six

- Somebody walks in on them doing the deed OR

- Kid gets outed by former best friend with homophobia issues

- Kid gets beat up by football team pissed off by QB's newly discovered gay tendencies

--OR kicked out of his house

--OR beat up by the drunk mean dad

--OR hit by a car

---OR all of the above

- QBBF and kid profess eternal love over a hospital bed

- Kid moves in with understanding, tolerant parents of the QBBF

- Best friend gets his shit together and says sorry

 

Tweak this formula with

- parents killed by freak auto accident

- Understanding, snarky fag hag best friend who pushes QB and kid to get together

- Quirky best friend/understanding older brother/uncle who fixes things

 

I can pretty much tell by sentence #3 in any given Nifty/HS story where we're going to end up. GA is different in that some, not all, of these set pieces get taken down, but still, a creative writing class is sometimes warranted.

 

That might be the Nifty formula, but not what I have read in the works of Dom Luka, Mark Arbour, Adam Phillips and what limited dkstories I've read. I've also read some works of the newer younger authors and they may not have the sophistication of the people I've noted, but there have been some fine works.

[Guest solesofwind]

Hey sweetie! Wlcome to GA! GO wild with the stories here, there is much variety within the stories and authors and genres. I can say I have read all decent gay stories in Lit and stolen few of the best authors here too. You know Zolia_Lily? She transferred here ../../public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif My gal ../../public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif

 

She is a perfect example for not writing the obvious. She did that with her first gay story and after that... well she has blown my mind with anything she has written. Sadly not much of it posted anywhere. I believe she is the ones to get publishing deals.

Of course I know Zolia_Lily, she's one of my favorite writers^^ (it's hard not to know her, she's famous there). She transferred here? Wow! I didn't know that^^.

[ScrawnyMe]

I have to agree with everyone around here... There are so many different perspectives on the matter..that only shows that there could be perspectives about every thing...you can't put story-telling into categories of right or wrong..

 

As for me, when I first got involved into reading stories, which could be three years back, I was so interested in the typical ones which were all about first sight loves and the overwhelming encounters of young boys. It was kind of a fantasy world with their perfect bodies and the unblemished looks.. I couldn't get enough of them.. now I no longer look for those kind of stories. But that doesn't mean that a certain audience wouldn't want to.

 

Like there is sci-fi, fantasy, horror, etc,; there's a genre called romantic. Young writers could start off writing like that, but after they get a perspective on narrating stories, they'll learn and improve.