[AFriendlyFace] The Most Dangerous Place by AFriendlyFace

[Graeme]

The Most Dangerous Place by AFriendlyFace

Lee isn't a queer. Audrey doesn't drink. Andrew is having a tough time. Joyce loves her son.

 

 

:nuke: :nuke: Spoilers Below!!! :nuke: :nuke:

Edited September 5, 2008 by Graeme

[Tiger]

This story takes you into a world where the past haunts a mother and her son. Andrew has recently come to terms with who he is, but Lee resents Andrew. The house becomes a place where most would not want to be, but sooner or later, someone will discover what the most dangerous place is. Will Joyce be able to protect her son, or are they doomed to suffer a terrible fate at the hands of a malicious ghost?

 

I really enjoyed this story, because it delved into issues that are so important even in today

[Cynical Romantic]

This is a really good ghost story, Kevin! You did a good job of telling the story on two levels. The ghosts represent the fear, anger and hatred that can only be banished with love and acceptance. This works just as well metaphorically as it does as a plot of a blood-and-gore horror movie.

 

My only quip is that I wanted to know more about David, and what happened between him and Andrew, and whether he's related to the original David. There's a whole back-story there that you don't tell us. But that's okay. I can use my imagination.

 

Good job!

[AFriendlyFace]

This story takes you into a world where the past haunts a mother and her son. Andrew has recently come to terms with who he is, but Lee resents Andrew. The house becomes a place where most would not want to be, but sooner or later, someone will discover what the most dangerous place is. Will Joyce be able to protect her son, or are they doomed to suffer a terrible fate at the hands of a malicious ghost?

 

I really enjoyed this story, because it delved into issues that are so important even in today

[Tiff]

I might have to post another comment later, when I've thought this through some more, but naturally, I loved this!

 

The contrast between Audrey and Joyce's reaction was very powerful, especially because depending on a parent's support, it kind of makes or break a kid who is gay, or is coming out, or unsure about their sexuality. Lee didn't have any support from Audrey, although she did love her son, but she had her own problems from her own past/mother. Meanwhile, Andrew had Joyce's complete support and love. Unfortunately, he still lost his mother in the end, but from unconditional love rather than suicide.

 

I think the whole generational thing, if that's the right word, is a great theme. What you learn from your parents, you ultimately pass down to your kid. Audrey's mother was religious, didn't approve of her becoming pregnant. Then those beliefs were somewhat instilled in Audrey and she felt the same shame for her son when he might be gay. On the other hand, Andrew was just like his own mother, always there for his child. How you grow up really influences your future, your relations, and everything. I liked that message.

 

Thanks, Kevin! Great anthology, and definitely something to be proud of!

[kitten]

Hi, Kevin!

 

Your two previous anthology stories were good, and this one is even better. So I suppose it may seem a little perverse of me to say it didn't give me the same enjoyment as the other stories. However, please let me explain...

 

The previous anthology entries, though not dealing with particularly cheerful subjects, were not as tragically emotional this one. They were well written, interested me, and they amused me. They made me care about the protagonists, but in the way that I care when I read about starving children in some distant land - a genuine, but generalised and generic caring.

 

This story, however, involved me at a deeper and more personal level. It grabbed me by the throat, shook me, and threw me against the wall. Then, when I learned Joyce's fate, I felt like I'd been punched in the gut. I couldn't believe that it wasn't just another nightmare.

 

Only after I recovered from the shock was I able to think about the structure of the story and appreciate the symmetry of the meal time discussions, of principal's visits, etc. (BTW - I gather from this that school principals really visit parents in the US? I doubt that would ever happen here. The parents here would be summoned to the school!) Also, only after my emotions began to fade did I appreciate the generational juxtapositions, comparisons and relationships.

 

Hopefully, after this long and rambling exposition, you will understand why I say that this story didn't give me the same enjoyment as the previous two. Undoubtedly, there was some enjoyment with this story, but it was a different kind of enjoyment.

 

The enjoyment from this story wasn't the enjoyment one gets from listening to a pleasant tune. The emotions evoked were too powerful for that. It was more like the enjoyment one gets when one reaches shore after being caught in a storm, out at sea in a small sailing boat.

 

Thanks for a great story!

Kit

[wildone]

Wow, thanks Kevin

 

I agree with a lot of what Tiff and Kit had to say.

 

The one thing that wasn't mentioned was that this story scared the crap out of me. This could easily be made into a screen play that would scare the hell out of me.

 

One underlying theme that I got the impression of, was the time line. It starts out with in my guess the 60's were homophobia was probably more rampant and parents in general weren't accepting of their children if they were gay. Some people say things were much more simpler back then, but I wonder if things just weren't talked about back then :wacko: . Both Lee and Audry's actions seem to fit the profile of a dysfunctional family in denial, but one that was still ruled by the times attitudes and acceptance of silence.

 

Next we fast forward to Andrew and Joyce. I would guess in the last ten years. A more enlightened (at least I hope) society that is more accepting of the differences between parents and children. I got the feeling that they were an exact image of their kin but 40 years later.

 

The pain and rage that motivated Lee was decided by society before he ever had the chance to grow up and experience the change in attitudes.

 

Finally not only did Joyce die for the unconditional love of Andrew but I also felt that she also showed her love and regret for Lee by finally putting him out of his pain.

 

What an amazing story Kevin, you should be proud of how much of a dynamic story you wrote .

 

Thanks again,

 

Steve

[AFriendlyFace]

The contrast between Audrey and Joyce's reaction was very powerful, especially because depending on a parent's support, it kind of makes or break a kid who is gay, or is coming out, or unsure about their sexuality. Lee didn't have any support from Audrey, although she did love her son, but she had her own problems from her own past/mother. Meanwhile, Andrew had Joyce's complete support and love. Unfortunately, he still lost his mother in the end, but from unconditional love rather than suicide.

Hey Tiff!

 

I think you're very right; parental acceptance and support is very crucial in the coming out process. Sometimes the lack thereof can be off-set by having a strong support system of friends or other family members. Lee definitely didn't have the benefit of either of these things.

 

I think the whole generational thing, if that's the right word, is a great theme. What you learn from your parents, you ultimately pass down to your kid. Audrey's mother was religious, didn't approve of her becoming pregnant. Then those beliefs were somewhat instilled in Audrey and she felt the same shame for her son when he might be gay. On the other hand, Andrew was just like his own mother, always there for his child. How you grow up really influences your future, your relations, and everything. I liked that message.

Thanks!

 

I was hoping it was coming off as too 'preachy' or anything. I also felt like it was important at the end to show Andrew as a good parent as well to sort of 'complete things' and show that Joyce's impact was enduring.

 

 

Your two previous anthology stories were good, and this one is even better. So I suppose it may seem a little perverse of me to say it didn't give me the same enjoyment as the other stories. However, please let me explain...

 

The previous anthology entries, though not dealing with particularly cheerful subjects, were not as tragically emotional this one. They were well written, interested me, and they amused me. They made me care about the protagonists, but in the way that I care when I read about starving children in some distant land - a genuine, but generalised and generic caring.

 

This story, however, involved me at a deeper and more personal level. It grabbed me by the throat, shook me, and threw me against the wall. Then, when I learned Joyce's fate, I felt like I'd been punched in the gut. I couldn't believe that it wasn't just another nightmare.

 

Wow, thanks Kit! I really appreciate that!

 

I was definitely trying to emotionally engage the readers with this one. To be honest, Joyce's death took me off guard as well. This is the absolute least premeditated story I've ever written. I usually know almost exactly what's going to happen before I write it. This time I just went with the flow and allowed the story to 'write itself'.

 

Joyce was always meant to be the hero of the story, but her death was somewhat 'spur of the moment' if you will. I really didn't know it was going to happen until I got to the scene, but by that point I felt like it fit better than anything else I could come up with.

 

As I said, there was that same prior uncertainness with David. As I mentioned before I was somewhat tempted to make him the benevolent incarnation of David Goldberg. I was also tempted to make him a stronger 'love interest' for Andrew. In the end though it felt right as it was.

 

Similarly Evelyn was a bit of an enigma to me. I wasn't certain ahead of time how large a role she would play. I think her part in the story was important though. I definitely wouldn't have let Joyce die if I hadn't established a strong, accepting grandmother who would presumably raise Andrew.

 

Actually, the story became very different from the original concept. Before I started getting it down on paper (or rather the computer screen), I wasn't sure whether or not I wanted to make Lee the ultimate villain or an ultimate good guy. I considered having him overcome his internalized homophobia to save Andrew from a gay bashing. In the initial concept, before I'd even decided that they were all be related, I'd even considered having Andrew die and sort of making Lee a love interest.

 

In the end though, once I started writing the story, it flowed very firmly in the direction in which it took. I wasn't always sure where it would take me, but it seemed to know and was very determined in heading in that direction. As I said, this is the most free-range I've ever allowed one of my stories.

 

 

Only after I recovered from the shock was I able to think about the structure of the story and appreciate the symmetry of the meal time discussions, of principal's visits, etc. (BTW - I gather from this that school principals really visit parents in the US? I doubt that would ever happen here. The parents here would be summoned to the school!) Also, only after my emotions began to fade did I appreciate the generational juxtapositions, comparisons and relationships.

Thanks!

 

I'm glad it had that aftereffect! Regarding the principals' visits aspect...well, I definitely think a principal's visit would have occurred for Lee. He was in a small town, and I imagined him in the 50s actually. For a small town in the 50s I think something as 'scandalous' as what happened would have warranted a principal's visit.

 

For Andrew it's more of a stretch. That's why I tried to include the remarks about Andrew's exemplary grades and skill at baseball. Basically, I wanted to imply that Joyce and his principal had established an at least partially personal, cordial relationship and that Andrew's previous excellent behaviour and the high regard in which he and Joyce would have been held would have resulted in the principal deciding to make it more personal and gentle by paying Joyce a visit.

 

Hopefully, after this long and rambling exposition, you will understand why I say that this story didn't give me the same enjoyment as the previous two. Undoubtedly, there was some enjoyment with this story, but it was a different kind of enjoyment.

 

The enjoyment from this story wasn't the enjoyment one gets from listening to a pleasant tune. The emotions evoked were too powerful for that. It was more like the enjoyment one gets when one reaches shore after being caught in a storm, out at sea in a small sailing boat.

Thanks Kit! I really appreciate it

 

Wow, thanks Kevin

 

I agree with a lot of what Tiff and Kit had to say.

 

The one thing that wasn't mentioned was that this story scared the crap out of me. This could easily be made into a screen play that would scare the hell out of me.

Woo hoo!! Thank you, Steve!

 

I was wondering if I'd managed to actually successfully scare anyone. It was meant to be a very suspenseful, unnerving piece. I was trying to gradually build the tension and anxiety up to a fever pitch which culminated in Lee's physical transcendence and Andrew walking into the room and seeing him.

 

I also wanted to convey to the readers that my characters were not safe. I didn't want to kill or hurt them superfluously by any means, but anything could have happened (as long as I felt it was consistent and powerful). I didn't want readers to get to the end of the story and know ahead of time that Andrew would somehow pull through. He really might not have.

 

One underlying theme that I got the impression of, was the time line. It starts out with in my guess the 60's were homophobia was probably more rampant and parents in general weren't accepting of their children if they were gay. Some people say things were much more simpler back then, but I wonder if things just weren't talked about back then :wacko: . Both Lee and Audry's actions seem to fit the profile of a dysfunctional family in denial, but one that was still ruled by the times attitudes and acceptance of silence.

 

Next we fast forward to Andrew and Joyce. I would guess in the last ten years. A more enlightened (at least I hope) society that is more accepting of the differences between parents and children. I got the feeling that they were an exact image of their kin but 40 years later.

As I said, I was actually imagining them in the 50s. I messed with the timeline a bit. In fact that was one of the only fairly major things I changed. It was actually because of Evelyn. I wanted her to serve as that bridge between the two times, but settling on an approximate age, and even the link itself, was more difficult. In fact I even sat down with a pen and paper and crunched some numbers to come up with her age, as well as Joyce's and Audrey's, at each point in the story.

 

The characters definitely were highly similar, indeed almost exact images of each other. I really wanted to explore the concept that Andrew could have ended up like Lee if he'd grown up in similar circumstances. I also wanted to explore the notion that Joyce could actually have ended up with Audrey under conditions similar to her own. In many ways it does go back to Evelyn in that regard. She was a good and supportive mother to Joyce. She accepted her daughters' teenage pregnancy (and it would have been at least slightly harder for Joyce's generation versus Andrew's for example) and supported and nurtured her. As a result Joyce grew into the kind of affirming, dedicated mother that she turned out to be, and all the love and protection Andrew received translated into him in turn growing up to be a good father.

 

It was really Evelyn who broke the cycle. Evidence suggests that Margret wasn't all that warm or supportive a mother so how did these qualities become ingrained in Evelyn? I don't really have the answer. I suspect that her younger age and perhaps her mother's gradual mellowing played a role. I also think that she might have always been a more free-thinking, contrarian. Finally, I think it helped that unlike Audrey, Lee, Joyce, or Andrew she didn't really have to go against society's mores. She could more subtly subvert them without bearing the brunt of them.

 

 

The pain and rage that motivated Lee was decided by society before he ever had the chance to grow up and experience the change in attitudes.

 

Finally not only did Joyce die for the unconditional love of Andrew but I also felt that she also showed her love and regret for Lee by finally putting him out of his pain.

That's a great point! For awhile I considered allowing Joyce to act as the impetus for a more thorough redemption of Lee. Up until she saw them both at the bottom of the stairs, and was struck by how similar they looked, I wasn't sure if she would 'love' Lee or fight him. When he hurt Andrew in front of her his fate was sealed.

 

 

What an amazing story Kevin, you should be proud of how much of a dynamic story you wrote .

 

Thanks again,

 

Steve

Thank you very much, Steve!

 

 

 

I really appreciate the comments, you guys! This story was quite special to me and it's definitely my favourite non-serial

 

-Kevin

[kitten]

In the end though, once I started writing the story, it flowed very firmly in the direction in which it took. I wasn't always sure where it would take me, but it seemed to know and was very determined in heading in that direction. As I said, this is the most free-range I've ever allowed one of my stories.

 

-Kevin

 

In my experience, when a story writes itself like this, it means you've created realistic characters and that you understand the situation and the personalities so well that, consciously or subconsciously, your mind automatically chooses the best dramatic flow. When that happens, the resulting story draws the reader in and the reader is totally convinced by it. They, too, go-with-the-flow!

 

BTW - hope the hurricanes let you get online again soon - I've been missing your posts!!

 

Kit

[MikeL]

I gather from this that school principals really visit parents in the US? I doubt that would ever happen here. The parents here would be summoned to the school!

Regarding the principals' visits aspect...well, I definitely think a principal's visit would have occurred for Lee. He was in a small town, and I imagined him in the 50s actually. For a small town in the 50s I think something as 'scandalous' as what happened would have warranted a principal's visit.

Great story, Kevin. It was interesting to see that Lee (the ghost), after so many years of "living" in hate, was not affected by Joyce's love for Andrew .

 

You are right about parents being summoned to the principal's office; at least that's true of public schools. My wife taught at a private school for a number of years. In private schools, where the parents pay tuition, the parents almost always seem to think that they will have the last word. If their precious little one (including high school students), is reprimanded for behavior or gets a poor grade, they demand a meeting with the principal and teacher. And - another sign of the times - the parent nearly always takes the child's side, no matter how egregious the conduct or how lazy the student. It takes a strong principal to maintain civility and academic integrity in the private school.

[tomon]

I think everyones mentioned how amazing this story is and gone into depth about how intricate and well designed the plot is so I'll just sum up with:

 

During the confrontation between Lee, Andrew and Joyce, I actually covered my mouth in shock/fear at least twice.

 

Oh and I love Joyce.

[Graeme]

It was the symmetry/asymmetry between the two mother/son relationships that struck me early on, too.

 

But I agree that the societies they lived in also had a role to play. The society that Lee lived in was very different to the one Andrew lived in. You could see that in the way Lee viewed himself -- he flatly refused to see himself as 'queer'.

 

One thing that I found fascinating in this, and some of the other anthology stories, was an implicit explanation of ghosts and why there aren't many around. Lee could only be a ghost while he held onto his anger. If his emotions weren't running high, he couldn't do anything. When his anger finally reached a peak, he could manifest. The interesting part to me is the source of that anger:

 

Lee felt a vague feeling of

[G-Galloway]

Kevin!

 

I really loved the beginning of your story. It's just so eerie and bloody!! lol

 

Also, it was really cool how you mirrored the dinner dialogue for each generation.

 

The floating knife and bat in the end were a little over the edge for my taste, but perhaps I'm being influenced by the fact that.... YOU KILLED JOYCE!!!

 

Thanks for the nice story. It kept me from doing actual work and you're the only one to blame. ;-)

 

Cheers,

G

[jfalkon]

At this point there's not much I can add. I really loved your story. My favorit part was the way you created a symetry between the two generations. It ilustrated the way peoples' atitudes have changed over time. Great job!