Translation Trashbin - 24. Bleibe, bleibe bei mir

A beautiful change? Feeling this life for the very first time... what a wonderful image that is.  Someone who's finally admitted or discovered who he really is?  It's lovely. Thanks AC.

That poem makes me delight, even as Goethe delighted in his lover. I think @Mikiesboy is right; the poet may feel or admit such exaltation because of a new self discovery. Thank you.

3 hours ago, Mikiesboy said:

A beautiful change? Feeling this life for the very first time... what a wonderful image that is.  Someone who's finally admitted or discovered who he really is?  It's lovely. Thanks AC.

Thanks for reading and commenting, Tim. The poem is pretty remarkable, least of which for the word Fremdling (stranger) being a masculine noun, meaning the beloved is male. 

After posting this, I looked for other translations of the poem into English. I could not find any online. This one may be way to obvious to those wishing to promote Goethe as some kind of ladies' man. 

Thanks again 

43 minutes ago, Parker Owens said:

That poem makes me delight, even as Goethe delighted in his lover. I think @Mikiesboy is right; the poet may feel or admit such exaltation because of a new self discovery. Thank you.

Completing this poem today (which I started a while back - in fact, it was the first Goethe I tackled), I was struck by this delight you mention. There are genuine connections to Whitman here: the falling in love with a (male) stranger; the desire that this person does not depart (after sex); and a wish that they feel as strongly as the poet does. 

Today the images in the poem all coalesced for me, and I saw the sky in the arms of my beloved stranger as we lay on the grass. An afternoon of country solitude and lovemaking coming to an end. But still, the changed sky overhead - Whitman could not have said any better. 

Thanks for your comments, Parker 

Yes, it was very good that I was probably a pestering nuisance the last days. And I won't say sorry. Lol 😀
Your translation is brilliant. As I can see in the comments, Parker and tim got at the first sight the new discovery Goethe made and wrote down. You brought alive the emotions - the young student - Goethe feels for this stranger. How tender and devoted he is and in the same moment the view on the other man and the glimpse we get to his behavior and the dynamic between them.
In the last lines it is breathtaking, how vivid the new awareness of Goethe shines, like the colors and noises are more richer,  more intense and the reader is able to see it through your translation in English. I think for Goethe this is a very „true“ poem in the sense, that he gives a lot away of his personal feelings. In other love poems I see more a concentration on the beloved. „Bleibe, bleibe bei mir“ is so innocent young first love, bringing Goethe close to me and hopefully to other readers as well.
An other aspect I really love is, that the rhythm of the original shows in your translation if I read both out loud. The intensifying of the massage through the repetition, works great. And this is such a difficult thing to bring in a translation.

There is one thing I want to mention as well. I have not read a single English translation except yours(!), that seem to get Goethe. They often lack on a kind of free spirit and his idea of: Love is ultimately natural in every way. Therefore, I am grateful for your work!

And as you mentioned Whitman his poem „To a stranger“, seems a bit like an answer, isn't it?

Lyssa

11 hours ago, Lyssa said:

In the last lines it is breathtaking, how vivid the new awareness of Goethe shines, like the colors and noises are more richer,  more intense and the reader is able to see it through your translation in English.

I will comment more, but to this point specifically, I really like (and respond well to) how Goethe weighted his poems at the end. It's something Shakespeare would do too, but Goethe is all the more free in his use, but just as effective. I think it's part of Goethe's art; he build towards a conclusion that cannot be seen until the reader lands on it. It's altogether remarkable for me, knowing how difficult it is to start a poem and have it increase in both intensity and simplicity, as if the verse were always moving straight to this conclusion. 

On 4/18/2019 at 9:51 AM, Lyssa said:

Yes, it was very good that I was probably a pestering nuisance the last days. And I won't say sorry. Lol 😀
Your translation is brilliant. As I can see in the comments, Parker and tim got at the first sight the new discovery Goethe made and wrote down. You brought alive the emotions - the young student - Goethe feels for this stranger. How tender and devoted he is and in the same moment the view on the other man and the glimpse we get to his behavior and the dynamic between them.
In the last lines it is breathtaking, how vivid the new awareness of Goethe shines, like the colors and noises are more richer,  more intense and the reader is able to see it through your translation in English. I think for Goethe this is a very „true“ poem in the sense, that he gives a lot away of his personal feelings. In other love poems I see more a concentration on the beloved. „Bleibe, bleibe bei mir“ is so innocent young first love, bringing Goethe close to me and hopefully to other readers as well.
An other aspect I really love is, that the rhythm of the original shows in your translation if I read both out loud. The intensifying of the massage through the repetition, works great. And this is such a difficult thing to bring in a translation.

There is one thing I want to mention as well. I have not read a single English translation except yours(!), that seem to get Goethe. They often lack on a kind of free spirit and his idea of: Love is ultimately natural in every way. Therefore, I am grateful for your work!

And as you mentioned Whitman his poem „To a stranger“, seems a bit like an answer, isn't it?

Lyssa

Well, here it is almost a month later, and I missed my chance to come back in a timely manner. Belated, but, I need to say you are my guide and lodestone when it comes to feeling German poetry. If not for this Tender Tiger book exploring Goethe's same-sex loves, and YOU telling me about it (  ), I would never have ventured into thinking about doing more of his work in English than his The Violet poem (as lyrics to Mozart's song version). You opened up a vista to me. As I mention somewhere, Goethe in English translation is this monolithic man of stone. I can honestly assure you, I had no idea he was a poet as passionate and sensual as Walt Whitman, but now I know he is. This beating heart of passion and yes, tenderness too, is totally missing from the man in translations that exist in my mother tongue. 

That you say I can "do him" right humbles me. Your friendship and support has been all-important to me, and it's something which matters to me deeply. I have gained depth as a poet by simply understanding this stone statue of a man has one of the most beautiful of beating human hearts underneath. How would I have ever discovered that without you...? 

For that, and for many more gifts you have given me, a million thanks and kisses. Muah! 

4 minutes ago, AC Benus said:

Well, here it is almost a month later, and I missed my chance to come back in a timely manner. Belated, but, I need to say you are my guide and lodestone when it comes to feeling German poetry. If not for this Tender Tiger book exploring Goethe's same-sex loves, and YOU telling me about it (  ), I would never have ventured into thinking about doing more of his work in English than his The Violet poem (as lyrics to Mozart's song version). You opened up a vista to me. As I mention somewhere, Goethe in English translation is this monolithic man of stone. I can honestly assure you, I had no idea he was a poet as passionate and sensual as Walt Whitman, but now I know he is. This beating heart of passion and yes, tenderness too, is totally missing from the man in translations that exist in my mother tongue. 

That you say I can "do him" right humbles me. You friendship and support has been all important to me, and it's something which matters to me deeply. I have gained depth as a poet by simply understanding this stone statue of a man has one of the most beautiful of beating human hearts underneath. How would I have ever discovered that without you...? 

For that, and for meany more gifts you have given me, a million thanks and kisses. Muah! 

🙂 🙂 🙂  I am feeling very happy and as if I have been given a great gift, to be with you on this adventure to explore all the hills and valleys, sometimes mountains and abysses of poetry.  And I am also happy, that through you, the world got some awesome translations, to understand Goethe`s poetry and I can tell myself, I contributed a little.  Muha ❤️

On 4/18/2019 at 9:51 AM, Lyssa said:

Yes, it was very good that I was probably a pestering nuisance the last days. And I won't say sorry. Lol 😀
Your translation is brilliant. As I can see in the comments, Parker and tim got at the first sight the new discovery Goethe made and wrote down. You brought alive the emotions - the young student - Goethe feels for this stranger. How tender and devoted he is and in the same moment the view on the other man and the glimpse we get to his behavior and the dynamic between them.
In the last lines it is breathtaking, how vivid the new awareness of Goethe shines, like the colors and noises are more richer,  more intense and the reader is able to see it through your translation in English. I think for Goethe this is a very „true“ poem in the sense, that he gives a lot away of his personal feelings. In other love poems I see more a concentration on the beloved. „Bleibe, bleibe bei mir“ is so innocent young first love, bringing Goethe close to me and hopefully to other readers as well.
An other aspect I really love is, that the rhythm of the original shows in your translation if I read both out loud. The intensifying of the massage through the repetition, works great. And this is such a difficult thing to bring in a translation.

There is one thing I want to mention as well. I have not read a single English translation except yours(!), that seem to get Goethe. They often lack on a kind of free spirit and his idea of: Love is ultimately natural in every way. Therefore, I am grateful for your work!

And as you mentioned Whitman his poem „To a stranger“, seems a bit like an answer, isn't it?

Lyssa

You mentioned pestering me, and not being sorry 😋 I'm glad you're not sorry either. This was the first poem cited in the Tender Tiger book that I tried my hand at. I showed it to you, and you objected to my reading. As I do usually in such cases, I set the poem aside. I was not willing to give up my interpretation entirely, believing I knew a key to unlocking it existed, but I respected your opinion and reasonings for saying I missed the mark. 

After setting it aside, I was compelled to try other poems of Goethe, and slowly, I made my key work. Or put another way, I was able to make the several disparate parts of 'Goethe' work in my emotional view of the man. It was only a lucky accident that I rediscovered this abandoned attempt and looked at it with more experienced eyes. 

Your final critical push gave me wonderful clarity, and the poem seemed to make such simple sense at last. 

In your comments here, the most wonderful to me is hearing how you read both versions aloud and can feel the poem in both. I always want to give both the feel and relish of a poem in translation if I'm able to. I try to pay tribute to it on all the levels if I can, and pray I can keep them in balance.

Thank you, once more, for your support. It means a great deal to me