' Live-Poets Society ' – A Corner For Poetry

[Valkyrie]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone.  I have some other ideas in the works that I will share once they coalesce enough to reach paper.  

 

Unless others suggest differently I would leave it as first written. Poetry in all its forms is a tool of expression. The thing that most kept me from poetry was an insistence on knowing and following esoteric rules. Does what you've written express what you intended ... if so it is not wrong. As AC has reminded us before western poets do not write haiku in the "correct" more fluid form of Japanese poets because our langauge structure is different so borrowing the structure of the form should be accepted. I am enamored of the cinquain ever since I found it and shared it with this group. Parker wrote one a bit ago that at first reading seemed off to my perception of the form. Please note it was "my" preconceived idea that was at fault. Parker explained why he wrote the way he did and suddenly the light shifted and I saw what he had done ... it was wonderful. So all that said ... do what feels right for your soul.

Very well-stated, dughlas  

[Mikiesboy]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone.  I have some other ideas in the works that I will share once they coalesce enough to reach paper.  

 

Very well-stated, dughlas  

Do what feels right ... i'm very selfish about my poetry... not often i ask for opinions.. because my poems are me and I'll rarely change them. I think I did once when AC suggested something. But i listen to others but listen to my heart. ...   

[Valkyrie]

Do what feels right ... i'm very selfish about my poetry... not often i ask for opinions.. because my poems are me and I'll rarely change them. I think I did once when AC suggested something. But i listen to others but listen to my heart. ...   

Thanks, Tim  I'm pretty happy with this one, but think I can come up with something better for the anthology.  

[northie]

I've taken up AC's kind invitation to share one of my favourite poems with you although you're actually going to get '2 for the price of 1' … Thanks to AC for allowing me to stretch the point a little.   

 

Quite some time ago Penguin Classics issued a sampler on the theme of 'Night thoughts' with a selection of poetry, fiction, essays, and play excerpts from their back catalogue. This slim book introduced me to all kinds of things I'd never tried before. Both of my choices come from there.

 

Henry King An Exequy to his matchlesse, never to be forgotten Freind

 

http://www.poetryarchive.org/poem/exequy-his-matchless-never-be-forgotten-friend

 

This funeral ode dates from the early C17. The poet is addressing his wife but he doesn't address her as a woman (with all that meant at that time) but more as his soulmate and life's companion. The version the link takes you to has had the orthography modernised.

 

Thomas Hardy Channel firing

 

http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46544

 

I hadn't read any of Hardy's poetry before I came across this. This is a poem of WW1 but it is not poetry of the battlefield, more a response from those left behind in 'Blighty'.

 

I have no idea whether these are already known to you. I hope you enjoy them and I would love to hear your thoughts and comments about them. Either post here or PM me (or indeed, both).   

[AC Benus]

But coming to form you selected, it might not correct(only according to the form). A Haiku is exact description of a situation. A constructive image. We tell what we see. Not that what we feel. We can't see emotions. We can only see the result of emotion. I will give you an example. If you see an old man tired, how can we tell that!!! Dripping sweat, dull face... and like that. I hope you understand.

Me too getting about it recently. And its difficult to tell what you see, without feeling about it. Please Correct me if I am wrong. Me too learning it.

You are not incorrect, but I think it would help us to remember there are three major schools of Haiku (Ikr, nothing's straightforward ).

 

Haiku in English already has a hundred-year history, and much of the way the form is used is open to either emotions of scene-painting in Western thought. 

 

The second school goes back to Basho and 18th century Japan. Basho-style Haiku rely on the reader's emotions being able to 'get it' through word imagery alone. For his poem, only the sight is presented. The "I" of the witness (or the subjective POV if you will) is totally repressed. Only the sight of a frog jumping into an old pond is required; the emotional understanding will come from the reader's ability to bring his or her own emotions to the table in the interpretation. 

 

The third school complicates matters, for sometimes genius breaks a rule so beautifully it creates a new school. This happened at the start of the 19th century with a poet named Issa Kobayashi. Issa's Haiku often place himself as an observer and ask the reader to understand the unstated emotions on their own.

 

I know this is complicated, and I'd encourage you to check out the two Poetry Prompts I've posted on Basho and Issa style Haiku. In the prompts I have quite a few examples.     

Edited June 21, 2016 by AC Benus

[Emi GS]

The thing that most kept me from poetry was an insistence on knowing and following esoteric rules.

You know what my secret is... Some times I hate these rules too...

 

Thanks, Tim I'm pretty happy with this one, but think I can come up with something better for the anthology.

For the matter of fact, I really liked the poem. And as I said above it is heartfelt poem. And rules!!! Never mind...

 

You are not incorrect, but I think it would help us to remember there are three major schools of Haiku (Ikr, nothing's straightforward ).

Yeah, I have read them. And still confused. I eventually get them though...

[AC Benus]

 

Henry King An Exequy to his matchlesse, never to be forgotten Freind

 

http://www.poetryarchive.org/poem/exequy-his-matchless-never-be-forgotten-friend

 

This funeral ode dates from the early C17. The poet is addressing his wife but he doesn't address her as a woman (with all that meant at that time) but more as his soulmate and life's companion. The version the link takes you to has had the orthography modernised.

 

I like the King poem very much. I don't know, but there was a certain school of poetry at the time...I'm a bit tired to search it out right now...but it puts me in mind of Katherine Philips. Here's her shimmering love poem to Lucasia. 

 

I did not live until this time

    Crowned my felicity,

When I could say without a crime,

    I am not thine, but thee.

 

This carcass breathed, and walked, and slept,

    So that the world believed

There was a soul the motions kept;

    But they were all deceived.

 

For as a watch by art is wound

    To motion, such was mine:

But never had Orinda found

    A soul till she found thine;

 

Which now inspires, cures and supplies,

    And guides my darkened breast:

For thou art all that I can prize,

    My joy, my life, my rest.

 

No bridegroom’s nor crown-conqueror’s mirth

    To mine compared can be:

They have but pieces of the earth,

    I’ve all the world in thee.

 

Then let our flames still light and shine,

    And no false fear control,

As innocent as our design,

    Immortal as our soul.

[Parker Owens]

 

I've taken up AC's kind invitation to share one of my favourite poems with you although you're actually going to get '2 for the price of 1' … Thanks to AC for allowing me to stretch the point a little.   

 

Quite some time ago Penguin Classics issued a sampler on the theme of 'Night thoughts' with a selection of poetry, fiction, essays, and play excerpts from their back catalogue. This slim book introduced me to all kinds of things I'd never tried before. Both of my choices come from there.

 

Henry King An Exequy to his matchlesse, never to be forgotten Freind

 

http://www.poetryarchive.org/poem/exequy-his-matchless-never-be-forgotten-friend

 

This funeral ode dates from the early C17. The poet is addressing his wife but he doesn't address her as a woman (with all that meant at that time) but more as his soulmate and life's companion. The version the link takes you to has had the orthography modernised.

 

Thomas Hardy Channel firing

 

http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46544

 

I hadn't read any of Hardy's poetry before I came across this. This is a poem of WW1 but it is not poetry of the battlefield, more a response from those left behind in 'Blighty'.

 

I have no idea whether these are already known to you. I hope you enjoy them and I would love to hear your thoughts and comments about them. Either post here or PM me (or indeed, both).   

 

 

Thank you for sharing these. They are each moving and filled with vivid images. At first, I thought I preferred the first of your selections, but more reflection sent me to Hardy again. 'Red war yet redder' is indeed a line that will surely stick.

 

 Again, thank you.

[Parker Owens]

I like the King poem very much. I don't know, but there was a certain school of poetry at the time...I'm a bit tired to search it out right now...but it puts me in mind of Katherine Philips. Here's her shimmering love poem to Lucasia. 

 

I did not live until this time

    Crowned my felicity,

When I could say without a crime,

    I am not thine, but thee.

 

This carcass breathed, and walked, and slept,

    So that the world believed

There was a soul the motions kept;

    But they were all deceived.

 

For as a watch by art is wound

    To motion, such was mine:

But never had Orinda found

    A soul till she found thine;

 

Which now inspires, cures and supplies,

    And guides my darkened breast:

For thou art all that I can prize,

    My joy, my life, my rest.

 

No bridegroom’s nor crown-conqueror’s mirth

    To mine compared can be:

They have but pieces of the earth,

    I’ve all the world in thee.

 

Then let our flames still light and shine,

    And no false fear control,

As innocent as our design,

    Immortal as our soul.

 

Thank you AC for giving us this poem to reflect upon. Each stanza improves upon its predecessor, and the complex rhythm of stanza five appealed to me right away. By comparison stanza six is simplicity itself...innocent in design...but sublime indeed.

[northie]

Thank you for sharing these. They are each moving and filled with vivid images. At first, I thought I preferred the first of your selections, but more reflection sent me to Hardy again. 'Red war yet redder' is indeed a line that will surely stick.

 

 Again, thank you.

 

Thank you, Parker, for finding the time to read both poems.

 

Of the two, my favourite is the King. I remember that what first drew me in was simply the title: so poignant and heartfelt.

 

The Hardy - your quote being followed immediately by 'Mad as hatters' gives such a strong impression of Hardy's view of things. 

 

I'm glad you enjoyed them both. 

[northie]

Correction to my description of the Hardy poem: it is a poem of the period immediately prior to WW1 when there was a rapid escalation of arming and preparation for war.

Sorry, left it too long to correct my original post.

Edited June 23, 2016 by northie

[J.HunterDunn]

I like the King poem very much. I don't know, but there was a certain school of poetry at the time...I'm a bit tired to search it out right now...but it puts me in mind of Katherine Philips. Here's her shimmering love poem to Lucasia. 

 

I did not live until this time

    Crowned my felicity,

When I could say without a crime,

    I am not thine, but thee.

 

This carcass breathed, and walked, and slept,

    So that the world believed

There was a soul the motions kept;

    But they were all deceived.

 

For as a watch by art is wound

    To motion, such was mine:

But never had Orinda found

    A soul till she found thine;

 

Which now inspires, cures and supplies,

    And guides my darkened breast:

For thou art all that I can prize,

    My joy, my life, my rest.

 

No bridegroom’s nor crown-conqueror’s mirth

    To mine compared can be:

They have but pieces of the earth,

    I’ve all the world in thee.

 

Then let our flames still light and shine,

    And no false fear control,

As innocent as our design,

    Immortal as our soul.

 

I appreciated this poem very much, especially the line "I am not thine, but thee" .

 

What sounds a bit off to me is the "I could say without a crime". Is this an expression I'm not familiar with ? To me it feels too much as something that had to rhyme with "time".

 

Please enlighten me.

[Emi GS]

 

I've taken up AC's kind invitation to share one of my favourite poems with you although you're actually going to get '2 for the price of 1' … Thanks to AC for allowing me to stretch the point a little.

 

Quite some time ago Penguin Classics issued a sampler on the theme of 'Night thoughts' with a selection of poetry, fiction, essays, and play excerpts from their back catalogue. This slim book introduced me to all kinds of things I'd never tried before. Both of my choices come from there.

 

Henry King An Exequy to his matchlesse, never to be forgotten Freind

 

http://www.poetryarchive.org/poem/exequy-his-matchless-never-be-forgotten-friend

 

This funeral ode dates from the early C17. The poet is addressing his wife but he doesn't address her as a woman (with all that meant at that time) but more as his soulmate and life's companion. The version the link takes you to has had the orthography modernised.

 

Thomas Hardy Channel firing

 

http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46544

 

I hadn't read any of Hardy's poetry before I came across this. This is a poem of WW1 but it is not poetry of the battlefield, more a response from those left behind in 'Blighty'.

 

I have no idea whether these are already known to you. I hope you enjoy them and I would love to hear your thoughts and comments about them. Either post here or PM me (or indeed, both).

These poems are two different kinds, that everyone can observe. But for me they were both same. The struggle, the craziness and all made me look at them as the same.

 

Everyone, or most people, can write about so intensively about love. But war, there will be less I think. Or I happened to be never met them. So instantly the second poem became my favorite one. And I loved them. Its not means that I liked violence, I was just flattered by the way it had been written.

 

That's what I think...

Edited June 23, 2016 by The Eminent MGK

[Emi GS]

I like the King poem very much. I don't know, but there was a certain school of poetry at the time...I'm a bit tired to search it out right now...but it puts me in mind of Katherine Philips. Here's her shimmering love poem to Lucasia. 

 

I did not live until this time

    Crowned my felicity,

When I could say without a crime,

    I am not thine, but thee.

 

This carcass breathed, and walked, and slept,

    So that the world believed

There was a soul the motions kept;

    But they were all deceived.

 

For as a watch by art is wound

    To motion, such was mine:

But never had Orinda found

    A soul till she found thine;

 

Which now inspires, cures and supplies,

    And guides my darkened breast:

For thou art all that I can prize,

    My joy, my life, my rest.

 

No bridegroom’s nor crown-conqueror’s mirth

    To mine compared can be:

They have but pieces of the earth,

    I’ve all the world in thee.

 

Then let our flames still light and shine,

    And no false fear control,

As innocent as our design,

    Immortal as our soul.

I liked it very much Ben. And the last stanza just stole my heart. Thanks for sharing Ben...

[Emi GS]

I think you guys already know. But just putting it here. Hope you guys like them...

 

https://www.gayauthors.org/story/the-eminent-mgk/emispoetryprompts/2

[AC Benus]

I appreciated this poem very much, especially the line "I am not thine, but thee" .

 

What sounds a bit off to me is the "I could say without a crime". Is this an expression I'm not familiar with ? To me it feels too much as something that had to rhyme with "time".

 

Please enlighten me.

Crime is such an interesting word to hone in on. Although I bet a contemporary (mid 17th-century) word source could be found saying 'crime' is synonymous with 'fault' or 'defect,' the use here forces a person (both then and now) to make no mistake this is a poem about same-sex love. Women, especially high-born women like Philips, could question society's pronouncements on Gay people without fear of legal sanction. Men had to be more circumspect, although all the great poets published love poems to men anyway. I suppose they refrained from being as sensual as poets like King and Philips allowed themselves to be. 

 

Just a theory...      

 

edit: plus 'crime' plays off perfectly with 'innocent' in the second-to-last line

Edited June 23, 2016 by AC Benus

[AC Benus]

 

I've taken up AC's kind invitation to share one of my favourite poems with you although you're actually going to get '2 for the price of 1' … Thanks to AC for allowing me to stretch the point a little.   

 

Quite some time ago Penguin Classics issued a sampler on the theme of 'Night thoughts' with a selection of poetry, fiction, essays, and play excerpts from their back catalogue. This slim book introduced me to all kinds of things I'd never tried before. Both of my choices come from there.

 

Henry King An Exequy to his matchlesse, never to be forgotten Freind

 

http://www.poetryarchive.org/poem/exequy-his-matchless-never-be-forgotten-friend

 

This funeral ode dates from the early C17. The poet is addressing his wife but he doesn't address her as a woman (with all that meant at that time) but more as his soulmate and life's companion. The version the link takes you to has had the orthography modernised.

 

Thomas Hardy Channel firing

 

http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46544

 

I hadn't read any of Hardy's poetry before I came across this. This is a poem of WW1 but it is not poetry of the battlefield, more a response from those left behind in 'Blighty'.

 

I have no idea whether these are already known to you. I hope you enjoy them and I would love to hear your thoughts and comments about them. Either post here or PM me (or indeed, both).   

 

So, I'm not sure, but I would place King and his poem in the so-called Metaphysical School of poetry. (I'd place Philips in the same School.) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphysical_poets#Major_poets

 

I love the feeling of flying the King poem gives me. It's almost like a soul briefly detaching from the body to get a bird's eye view of the scene. Loving and yet removed, it's surely one of the world's great poems. Timeless and giving.

 

I'm so glad you posted it. Can't wait to see what you share with us next  

 

(as for the Hardy piece...I'll have to turn my attention to it next...)

[northie]

These poems are two different kinds, that everyone can observe. But for me they were both same. The struggle, the craziness and all made me look at them as the same.

 

Everyone, or most people, can write about so intensively about love. But war, there will be less I think. Or I happened to be never met them. So instantly the second poem became my favorite one. And I loved them. Its not means that I liked violence, I was just flattered by the way it had been written.

 

That's what I think...

 

Thank you, Emi, for taking the time to read and consider these two poems.  You join Parker in preferring the Hardy.

 

Yes, poetry about love is all around us - personal experience of love (good, bad, indifferent) is common so being able to draw on that experience to produce poetry is similarly abundant. War is something else. The sheer number of people exposed to the realities of war during WW1 must have been a significant factor in the flowering of poetry during that time. Generally, war is a rarer subject for poetry.

 

Hardy was writing in the years just before WW1 (see my correction post) and voicing views which were definitely not those of the Establishment. There again, Hardy was used in his novels to expressing thoughts, emotions, and situations which the majority of English society found difficult or unacceptable. 

[Emi GS]

Thank you, Emi, for taking the time to read and consider these two poems.  You join Parker in preferring the Hardy.

 

Yes, poetry about love is all around us - personal experience of love (good, bad, indifferent) is common so being able to draw on that experience to produce poetry is similarly abundant. War is something else. The sheer number of people exposed to the realities of war during WW1 must have been a significant factor in the flowering of poetry during that time. Generally, war is a rarer subject for poetry.

 

Hardy was writing in the years just before WW1 (see my correction post) and voicing views which were definitely not those of the Establishment. There again, Hardy was used in his novels to expressing thoughts, emotions, and situations which the majority of English society found difficult or unacceptable.

 

Yeah war is never. Not even to the both parties. And some thing and descriptions looks brutal, just like you said unacceptable. But what I see in this poem is a clear description and in no cruel way. Yeah the images may display in our minds red blood but not this poem according to me. I hope I'd never get those images of brutality into my mind. Not while reading poetry.

[northie]

So, I'm not sure, but I would place King and his poem in the so-called Metaphysical School of poetry. (I'd place Philips in the same School.) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphysical_poets#Major_poets

 

I love the feeling of flying the King poem gives me. It's almost like a soul briefly detaching from the body to get a bird's eye view of the scene. Loving and yet removed, it's surely one of the world's great poems. Timeless and giving.

 

I'm so glad you posted it. Can't wait to see what you share with us next

 

(as for the Hardy piece...I'll have to turn my attention to it next...)

 

I'm so pleased this poem had such an effect on you.

 

'Loving and yet removed' Yes, it is so obviously an outpouring of immense grief and desolation at the loss of his soulmate - highly personal in one way yet the lack of any anchors by way of personal details, time or geography, makes it a poem which also has universal meaning.

 

The poet spends so much time not speaking of fixed, mundane, earthly matters but rather of the soul, identity, and of the afterlife, I can understand your feeling of 'flying'. This, I think, if nothing else, makes King definitely a metaphysical poet.

[Parker Owens]

On a (much) lighter note, I added this bit to Occasional Poetry.  Hope you enjoy it. The link follows.  https://www.gayauthors.org/story/parker-owens/occasionalpoetry/30

[northie]

On a (much) lighter note, I added this bit to Occasional Poetry.  Hope you enjoy it. The link follows.  https://www.gayauthors.org/story/parker-owens/occasionalpoetry/30

Dispelling the English baroque gloom - excellent idea!

[Emi GS]

On a (much) lighter note, I added this bit to Occasional Poetry.  Hope you enjoy it. The link follows.  https://www.gayauthors.org/story/parker-owens/occasionalpoetry/30

Read and Reviewed ( ) and got your reply too...

[Emi GS]

Got e-mail from Lily about anthology. And she said 'I am in'...

[Emi GS]

Tim, do you remember these...

 

https://www.gayauthors.org/story/the-eminent-mgk/MIP_MGK/21