lets work together Topic Tuesday #4: Entertainment vs Commentary on Human Condition

[Brayon]

Entertainment vs Commentary on Human Condition is this week's topic. I was originally going to do one on Infodumps and why they are good and needed in Fantasy/SciFi stories, despite what publishers and those that adhere to dogmatic writing rules, say. But after reading @Carlos Hazday's blog entry called "Stories so White," I felt the need to switch up topics. This is also a topic, that I've discussed several times with my Non-GA friends, who I play tabletop RPGs with. While the majority, of this topic, is based on my opinions, I am going to show a couple of examples.

 

Human Condition

There's been a shift over the years, in how people consume books, movies, music, and tv shows, where they are looking for the underlying commentary on the human condition. A very vocal minority called "Social Justice Warriors" or "Fragile Snowflakes" are the ones leading the charge on this. They will dissect your work, looking for any hidden meaning or message you may have put in it. And, if you do put some sort of message into your work, then by all the Holy Identity Politics, it better be something that they approve of, or you might get something like this:

 

• "Your story sucks because you talk about slavery."
• "Your story sucks because the main character is white."
• "Your story sucks, because you are not advocating < Insert a cause I deem worthy here > in your story."

 

Add on to that, a campaign to ruin your life, get you fired from your job, death threats, and boycotts of anyone that supports you. If you think I'm joking, just look at Twitter or Google search for Brenden Eich. These "Group-Think" Activists will use social media to harass you, your readers, your publisher, and your family, friends, employer, school, and your 2nd-grade teacher, to shame you into either retracting your work or changing it to what they consider appropriate. Carlos' blog entry above is about, how one writer changed her entire story, after a campaign of online bullying from these SJWs.

 

It's all utter BULLSHIT. Yes, bold, underline, and italic.

 

"But, BHopper2. Didn't you just post a thread, saying as Gay Writers, we should hold ourselves to a higher standard? And that whole thing about sex scenes? Isn't that being a little hypocritical?" Glad you asked or thought that. It would be hypocritical of me, to not point out, I did say that as Homosexual Writers, because of the Double Standard that exists between us and Heterosexual Writers, should hold ourselves to a higher standard when it comes to what we write. That thread was based on the perceptions that some Heterosexuals have that Homosexuals are sexual predators, and have an obscene obsession with sex. I don't make the rules; I just point them out. Your mileage may vary, and things have become a lot better over the years, in Western Culture.

 

Entertainment

Not everything has to be for some cause. Sitting down to read a book, or watch a movie, can be for the entertainment value. Something that amuses you. For instance, the movie Warcraft is a high fantasy action film based on the MMO by Blizzard called World of Warcraft. If you love the game, you'll hate the movie. If you love High Fantasy and looking at eye-candy, you'll love the movie. Same can be said about a number of different movies, shows, and music. I love the show Supernatural, and the characters Sam and Dean. It's a story about two brothers, who hunt monsters. Some say it's more than that, but at its core, that's what the show is about. There's no politics in it, there's no plight to show a tale of the human condition, there's just a tale of brotherly love, and family. In fact, I've stopped watching a number of shows when they've become overly political, or are very biased. I want to be entertained. I don't want an essay on what you think are the sins of the human race.

 

In fact, when I write my stories, I'm not doing it for any reason other than for entertainment purposes only. I don't give a shit about causies, and their causes when I write. I write a piece of literature, that I like, and I tell a story, that I want to tell. Then I ask a group of friends here to Beta Read it and Edit it, and then post it as an entertainment piece. If people like my story, and leave a reaction to it, or even better a comment or a review, then I know I have brought joy to someone else.

 

"But, what about your Forbidden Love story, and what you said above?"

I would say that is the only cause, I do advocate for, and have written about. I do try to hold myself to a higher standard, but I'm human. I will fail at that. I did have my main characters in No Regrets killed because they were Gay because that's what does happen in parts of our Modern World, today. Most of my stories, don't include that sort of stuff.

 

So, there's my thoughts, and opinions on the topic. What are your thoughts on this?

Edited March 20, 2018 by BHopper2
Even with Grammarly and Autocorrect, the Typodemon strikes.

[Mikiesboy]

People have said sometimes there are hidden messages in my stories ... like Called To The Gates, for example. That story was written because of a line from the song Hallelujah by Leonard Cohen.  This one specifically: That David played and it pleased the Lord. 

 

When i heard it i thought... which Lord is he referring to? The story was born from that question.  People have said there is meaning in the story for them. I'm glad about that, but to me it was an answer to my question.  I don't think i have ever purposely set out to write a story that has a moral, or a hidden meaning. If readers find something that moves them, or influences them, it's because of them, likely, not because of me. 

 

I write for entertainment, not to influence. Though that likely cannot be said for my poetry. Often that is written in response to something, so it can be angry or searching. 

 

i do not have social media accounts, because what goes on there does not interest me. Everything is super heated, under a microscope, and i have zero interest in going there. 

Edited March 20, 2018 by Mikiesboy

[FormerMember4]

Interesting topic today. As a reader, I read for entertainment. Not for influence, or messages. There’s too much in life for everything to have a meaning, or agenda. I read to escape and relax.

I am like tim. I text with friends, and have email. I don’t have any social media accts. Makes my life easier, and stress free. I’m too sensitive to be bombarded like that.

Sometimes we do find messages in things we read. I often equate that to things that happened, or are happening in your life.

An author most often writes to produce a story, just that... a story. Not to be a therapist, or crusader.

I don’t pay attention to people who criticize a story on slavery, etc. As long as you’re treating topic with respect and research. Ignore the haters. Accept the worthy criticisms.

[Brayon]

As an example of a book on the Human Condition. Over on Dreamspinner Press, I spotted this book called 18% Gray that has politically biased written in its description blurb. I spotted it on my Public Library's eBook center, so I think I'll check it out and form an official stance on it. But, judging a book by its blurb, tells me it's a politically biased story.

 

Quote

In a future where the United States has split along party lines, Agent Matt Tennimore’s job is to get people out of the Confederated Red States, whether they’re captured special ops agents from his own country or gay CRS citizens who’ve petitioned for asylum. He never expected to have to retrieve his high school crush, aka the guy who ostracized him for being gay.

 

[Myr]

11 hours ago, BHopper2 said:

• "Your story sucks because you talk about slavery."
• "Your story sucks because the main character is white."
• "Your story sucks, because you are not advocating < Insert a cause I deem worthy here > in your story."

Please let me know if you see this on Gay Authors.  There isn't much I enjoy more than crushing annoying *censored* snowflakes.   People need to learn to leave each other alone.  I'm happy to apply the banhammer as often as needed to pound that into the thick, emptyheaded skulls.  The snowflakes abandoned polite society because it was too morale or too white or some such bullshit.  Fine, I can play by the new rules too and you will not like it.  

 

I was raised under the Golden Rule.  Do unto others as you'd have them do unto you.  But that has disappeared into the dustbin of history as the self-absorbed snowflake generation takes over and the "Greatest Generation" is pretty nearly all gone now.  Now the Golden Rule is considered religious or too moral or too white or some such.  That's okay. I can play by the Iron rule too.  Do unto others before they can do unto you. 

 

 

As for what I put in my stories?  I read and write for entertainment.  The very astute, like @Carlos Hazday, pick up on my inside jokes.  (Like naming an Aircraft Carrier, Rafael Cruz.  I suspect even telling most people that much wouldn't let them in on the inside joke).  Other things are incidental.  I believe in the concepts of honor and duty and those things are going to be in my stories.  But I have never and never plan to write a story to push a specific viewpoint or agenda.  That is extremely difficult to do without being didactic.  And nothing turns off a reader like coming across as a pompous pretentious preacher alliterating their way through a story.  I have also put some pretty dark things in some of my stories that have slipped by without comment.  I plan to explore some of that in the future as well.

 

12 hours ago, BHopper2 said:

If you love High Fantasy and looking at eye-candy, you'll love the movie.

Excellent. I'm in that category.  I have the movie in my stack of many things.

 

 

[comicfan]

Ok, I'm in it for entertainment. I will watch Hocus Pocus, Labyrinth, Krull, The Princess Bride, High Anxiety, Sleeping Beauty, or a hundred other films to be entertained.

 

My ever growing pile of to read has mysteries, horror, sci-fi, fantasy, and more.

 

When I write, it is to tell a story, that I hope, people will enjoy. I am not out to put hidden meaning, create new religions, or tell people how to live. I might focus on love or family, but I see that as universal experiences and not as the human condition under the microscope. I've told tales of love, my take on fairy tales, abuse, and a dozen other topics, but in the end I write the tales I like to read, not tales someone tells me to write. Sorry, to blather on, just figured I toss in my two cents.

[Brayon]

17 hours ago, Myr said:

Please let me know if you see this on Gay Authors.  There isn't much I enjoy more than crushing annoying *censored* snowflakes.   People need to learn to leave each other alone.  I'm happy to apply the banhammer as often as needed to pound that into the thick, emptyheaded skulls.  The snowflakes abandoned polite society because it was too morale or too white or some such bullshit.  Fine, I can play by the new rules too and you will not like it.  

Good to know. Thank you, Myr.

 

19 hours ago, BHopper2 said:

As an example of a book on the Human Condition. Over on Dreamspinner Press, I spotted this book called 18% Gray that has politically biased written in its description blurb. I spotted it on my Public Library's eBook center, so I think I'll check it out and form an official stance on it. But, judging a book by its blurb, tells me it's a politically biased story.

 

I have never left a negative review before. I've left less than stellar ones, but never a negative. This will be a first.

 

If you can overlook the lack of worldbuilding, lack of detail, characters who go from young adult military people to high school kids, the blatant biased in politics, and horrible dialogue, it's a half-way decent covert-op thriller. Frankly, if this was the first book I read from Dreamspinner Press, I would never read another book they publish again.

Edited March 21, 2018 by BHopper2

[Brayon]

6 hours ago, BHopper2 said:

I have never left a negative review before. I've left less than stellar ones, but never a negative. This will be a first.

 

If you can overlook the lack of worldbuilding, lack of detail, characters who go from young adult military people to high school kids, the blatant biased in politics, and horrible dialogue, it's a half-way decent covert-op thriller. Frankly, if this was the first book I read from Dreamspinner Press, I would never read another book they publish again.

Full Review of 18% Gray:

It took me a little over 12 hours to read it eCover to eCover. Somethings that were bad with it:

• Lack any sort of Worldbuilding. Outside of a few words, not even full sentences, that a war happened in the USA, prior to the split into two nations of the Red States vs the Blue States. There was nothing else about the setting the book was in.
• Blatant Liberal Bias. Blue states were Liberal, and therefore the good guys. Red states were Conservative, and therefore the bad guys.
• Lacked any detail. One of the protagonists lived in a 2-bedroom apartment. There you go, that was all the detail you got. It had a fridge because he took out two pouches of beer. (Pouches of beer? Why pouches? Oh, yeah, you don't know why, because there was no Worldbuilding. No Infodump to explain the world.)
• Main Characters were 23 and 25 years old respectfully. Both are covert-ops trained military veterans, who have seen combat action. (Wait? there's fighting between the Red and Blue? Oh, yeah, you don't know why, because there was no worldbuilding.) Used to go to high school together, and therefore, reverted back to High School personality.
• I'm not even going to comment on the Nymphomanic Nun, from the Roman Catholic Church.
• Lots of interesting technology. But WTF is a crotch rocket? It has a shield of some sort, that you have to lift to get out of. I'm guessing it's some sort of motorcycle, that is fairly powerful, and can go off-roading.
• Red States are ultra poor, run down, and using tech 2 decades behind the Blue. But has AI drones, Directed Energy Weapons, Disruptor grenades, Digital Camo w/ thermal imaging blockers, and a slew of other things. AI satellite systems. But they don't believe in Global Warming, even though most of them are turning into an arid climate. Most people walk from city to city, and town to town because they can't afford other transportations.
• Red States practice forced Conversion Therapy on anyone that has the Gay Gene.
• Horrible Dialogue.
• Typos everywhere, and this was a "professionally done" and edited work. You can buy a copy for $5.00 on Dreamspinner.

Now, this is a book that has a message about the Human Condition. The Author was trying for a Handmaiden's Tale type of world and failed. It devolved into a High School level sex fantasy between the main characters and a technical error-filled piece of literature. The blatant biased that Conservative Values, Gun-Rights, Religious Liberty, are all inherently evil was a major theme of the book. Again, there is hardly any worldbuilding, but the few instances that the Author used, made it a point to show anyone that was a Conservative was a Homophobe, and anyone that was a Liberal was an open-minded free-thinker. If this was a story or an Author that was on GA, I'd be ranking it a flat 2-stars.

 

[Sam Wyer]

I think I have some double standards here.  I generally consume media for the entertainment value, but when I’m writing, I’m happy to push my own values out there, usually subtly, but still.  I don’t think anything is too overt though, so people can just enjoy the story.

But now you’ve got me thinking, isn’t all of my writing informed by my own views and values?  Probably.  I don’t have a very good imagination, so I tend to use what I know.  Is it possible (for me) to write purely for entertainment?  Hmmm, this needs more thought.

[stephanie l danielson]

I definitely try my best just to write for entertainment value. If there is an subtext to things, my boys follow mostly my values, my life, my world. I was raised a certain way and my boys live that life too for the most part.

I have just very recently introduced two new things to my writing, that being swapping partners and menage. Why? Not to shock, not to put out there what the market thinks it wants, but because the story was headed that way and to stretch myself. If you enjoy it, great! If not, then don't read it.