Timeframe From Start to Finish?

[BendtedWreath]

To anyone who isn't aware, I'm still very green when it comes to writing. I've noticed that when a project is small, less than 10k words, I can set aside a few ways up to a week to get it done on my off time. 

However, I've also been working on a multi-chaptered project with only around 13 chapters or so to show for it for one entire year now. 

Everyday life has many obstacles, yes, but it's not like I have no time in my day that I can set aside for writing.

In fact, I have a solid 2 hours of commuting time I should be putting to good use. 

My questions for everyone are:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

[kbois]

44 minutes ago, BendtedWreath said:

To anyone who isn't aware, I'm still very green when it comes to writing. I've noticed that when a project is small, less than 10k words, I can set aside a few ways up to a week to get it done on my off time. 

However, I've also been working on a multi-chaptered project with only around 13 chapters or so to show for it for one entire year now. 

Everyday life has many obstacles, yes, but it's not like I have no time in my day that I can set aside for writing.

In fact, I have a solid 2 hours of commuting time I should be putting to good use. 

My questions for everyone are:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

First of all.... don't beat yourself up when it comes to time lines. Unless you are a writer by profession with deadlines set by a publisher, it doesn't matter how long it takes to write a story. You can't force words to come if they don't want to. 

Let me repeat that:

You can't force words to come if they don't want to. 

Everyone lacks focus at some point. Life happens. I've had entire weekends with nothing to do and yet I haven't written a full-length story in almost two years. Its not that I don't have ideas... I do. I have two stories that I started and both have stalled. 

The creative process has a will of its own. 

Whether or not you write everything down first, create an outline or just wing is up to you. There's no right or wrong way. Every author has their own way of working through the writing process. 

I've always just winged it, but I have gotten to the point where I have what I would consider a rolling outline, meaning I write down ideas pertaining to the story as they come and I'll refer to it frequently to see where they best fit. Sometimes a scene will pop into my head and I'll have to write it out even though its not in chronological order. That's what editing is for. 

Two hours of commuting time kinda sucks, but on the bright side, its time you can use to let your brain marinate some of your ideas. My brain never shuts off. If you can, during your vommute, just focus on daydreaming. Eventually something will ignite and you'll be able to move forward. Just don't miss your stop.

I'm looking forward to whatever you come up with. 

Hope this helps. 

 

[Mikiesboy]

1 hour ago, BendtedWreath said:

To anyone who isn't aware, I'm still very green when it comes to writing. I've noticed that when a project is small, less than 10k words, I can set aside a few ways up to a week to get it done on my off time. 

However, I've also been working on a multi-chaptered project with only around 13 chapters or so to show for it for one entire year now. 

Everyday life has many obstacles, yes, but it's not like I have no time in my day that I can set aside for writing.

In fact, I have a solid 2 hours of commuting time I should be putting to good use. 

My questions for everyone are:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

Do you have a journal or notebook. Write in it... any writing is good. Ideas, what you see on your commute, a poem. Whatever. 

I don't give myself time frames.  Changes, took me over a year to write, maybe more. 

I retired from full-time work 2 years ago due to health issues...it's harder to focus the more time i have … that's my experience. 

Hmm, well, i've done both. If i'm getting to 5k words, then i think i may have to start a new chapter soon.  My old editor once told me each chapter should so of be a story on its own. He was better at that than I am. But i try to find a comfortable place to end. A cliffhanger of an ending for each chapter gets old pretty quick. Sometimes it cannot be helped, however. 

[Krista]

1 hour ago, BendtedWreath said:

To anyone who isn't aware, I'm still very green when it comes to writing. I've noticed that when a project is small, less than 10k words, I can set aside a few ways up to a week to get it done on my off time. 

However, I've also been working on a multi-chaptered project with only around 13 chapters or so to show for it for one entire year now. 

Everyday life has many obstacles, yes, but it's not like I have no time in my day that I can set aside for writing.

In fact, I have a solid 2 hours of commuting time I should be putting to good use. 

My questions for everyone are:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

Your Questions: 

Answer to 1: I do not put any real timeframe for my writing. I will write when I wish to write. I have learned the hard lesson of finishing projects before I commit to them, by posting them here unfinished. It was a hard lesson, as it took me 5+ years to write, "The Best Year," because I kept stumbling around with it, and I lacked motivation at times. So, who needs the added pressures of a deadline or a mindset of, "I have to get this done on such and such day, because..." Unless you're working with a publishing deadline, then don't bother with that kind of thinking, it will do you more harm than good. If you don't have to put yourself into a strict structured mess, just don't do it. 

Answer to 2: Yes. I lack focus at times. It is easy for my brain to come up with a character and idea for a story. I can do that all day, I have story ideas jumping around inside my head all the time. I have a rule that they need to be in my head more than once. I need to be interested in it multiple times. That tells me that it is a character and/or story I really wish to tell and not something that I think would be fun in the moment. Because, fun in the moment can get you started. It can't carry you through the meat of the writing. It has to be an idea that can carry you through an entire story as you flesh it out and put the real work into it. --- I can do fun moment writing if it is short, like around 30k words. Anything of any length, it has to be an idea that I know will carry me  to the finish. Also, it is completely okay to start writing a story and fall out of love with it. We all have them in our documents collecting dust and waiting. I have stories that were started in 2007 and will never be finished. 

Real life gets in the way of writing. That is life. Sometimes you just can't bring yourself to be in a creative mindset when you're tired, frustrated, or bogged down by things. Some people can set that aside easier than others, I am not one of those people. I need to feel like writing, and when I do I force time to accommodate me, if that means I stay up on a Tuesday night well past 1am to finish a chapter, I will be bitchy at work in the morning...  As long as you can do that and keep some sanity and bounce back into a more healthy schedule, that is. 

Answer to 3: No, I don't write everything down before I flesh out the story. I do a character sheet, I keep the idea in my head. I have goals and themes I want to tell. I do not write those down either. If I write too much in the character sheets, if I write down plot plans, themes for chapters, etc... my motivation to continue to write, or even to start the story will fall away. To me it feels like I've jumped to the last five minutes of a film, or read the last chapter of a book. If I know everything there is to know, because I've fleshed everything out into puzzle pieces, but I can still see the picture I've formed - I no longer feel the need to put those pieces together. That is how I write, some people need details, I live for not knowing the majority of them. I am careful only where I need to be. 

[BendtedWreath]

1 hour ago, kbois said:

Whether or not you write everything down first, create an outline or just wing is up to you. There's no right or wrong way. Every author has their own way of working through the writing process. 

I've always just winged it, but I have gotten to the point where I have what I would consider a rolling outline, meaning I write down ideas pertaining to the story as they come and I'll refer to it frequently to see where they best fit. Sometimes a scene will pop into my head and I'll have to write it out even though its not in chronological order. That's what editing is for.

Indeed, I've been noticing the differences in methods everyone has. I think the way your ideas flow is fascinating, just as all other pantsers able to translate what they envision into words. I feel I'm still at the stage where I really need to learn what "chronological order" looks like and what comes first before I try venturing outside of it. I think the "getting it all down first" has been challenging for me because I am unsure of what that order is like. 

[BendtedWreath]

10 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

Do you have a journal or notebook. Write in it... any writing is good. Ideas, what you see on your commute, a poem. Whatever. 

Poetry has never been in my wheelhouse, but I understand what you mean. Keep track of everything.

10 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

I retired from full-time work 2 years ago due to health issues...it's harder to focus the more time i have … that's my experience. 

I'm really sorry to hear that. An abundance of time is also a curse. I agree. 

13 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

Hmm, well, i've done both. If i'm getting to 5k words, then i think i may have to start a new chapter soon.  My old editor once told me each chapter should so of be a story on its own. He was better at that than I am. But i try to find a comfortable place to end. A cliffhanger of an ending for each chapter gets old pretty quick. Sometimes it cannot be helped, however. 

I think that's exactly how I've been treating my project! As if each chapter is its own story of its own... and then I keep having to go back to try to make all the chapters before it make cohesive sense, and it's just been a snail's pace for me. 😂 I also agree with the balance and not too many cliffies. In my case, it's the opposite. Not enough cliffies or chapter-ending variations. I only noticed thanks to the help of other, more experienced writers (and I'm grateful to every single one of them for sparing some time for me, yourself included).  Thank you very much for sharing your thoughts. 

[BendtedWreath]

18 minutes ago, Krista said:

Your Questions: 

Answer to 1: I do not put any real timeframe for my writing. I will write when I wish to write. I have learned the hard lesson of finishing projects before I commit to them, by posting them here unfinished. It was a hard lesson, as it took me 5+ years to write, "The Best Year," because I kept stumbling around with it, and I lacked motivation at times. So, who needs the added pressures of a deadline or a mindset of, "I have to get this done on such and such day, because..." Unless you're working with a publishing deadline, then don't bother with that kind of thinking, it will do you more harm than good. If you don't have to put yourself into a strict structured mess, just don't do it. 

I agree. My first goal when I started the project last year was to finish it by Halloween of that same year. Then, it was to finish it by this Halloween. Now, it's just to finish it with all my might, whenever that happens. 😂

21 minutes ago, Krista said:

Answer to 2: Yes. I lack focus at times. It is easy for my brain to come up with a character and idea for a story. I can do that all day, I have story ideas jumping around inside my head all the time. I have a rule that they need to be in my head more than once. I need to be interested in it multiple times. That tells me that it is a character and/or story I really wish to tell and not something that I think would be fun in the moment. Because, fun in the moment can get you started. It can't carry you through the meat of the writing. It has to be an idea that can carry you through an entire story as you flesh it out and put the real work into it. --- I can do fun moment writing if it is short, like around 30k words. Anything of any length, it has to be an idea that I know will carry me  to the finish. Also, it is completely okay to start writing a story and fall out of love with it. We all have them in our documents collecting dust and waiting. I have stories that were started in 2007 and will never be finished. 

That's a fascinating way to go about it! It makes perfect sense that if an idea doesn't hold your own interest more than a couple of times, it won't feel engaging enough to write about. I also find it amusing that your idea of short is 30k, and that's almost my current word count. 🤣 I'm glad it isn't that I've fallen out of love with my project though. I love it fine, I just need to learn how to portray what I'd like it to portray. 

26 minutes ago, Krista said:

Answer to 3: No, I don't write everything down before I flesh out the story. I do a character sheet, I keep the idea in my head. I have goals and themes I want to tell. I do not write those down either. If I write too much in the character sheets, if I write down plot plans, themes for chapters, etc... my motivation to continue to write, or even to start the story will fall away. To me it feels like I've jumped to the last five minutes of a film, or read the last chapter of a book. If I know everything there is to know, because I've fleshed everything out into puzzle pieces, but I can still see the picture I've formed - I no longer feel the need to put those pieces together. That is how I write, some people need details, I live for not knowing the majority of them. I am careful only where necessary. 

Wow, yes, I know a couple of other amazing writers who feel the same way as this. I, unfortunately, want- no, I need to know the ending clearly enough to write towards it. That's another struggle I've been facing at this "possibly midway, but I'm not sure, because this is my first multichapter story" stage. I want the ending to mean something to, at the very least, the characters, if not me. But it's just not clear enough for me yet. I can't see it. 

Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and experiences!

[kbois]

17 minutes ago, BendtedWreath said:

Poetry has never been in my wheelhouse, but I understand what you mean. Keep track of everything.

I'm really sorry to hear that. An abundance of time is also a curse. I agree. 

I think that's exactly how I've been treating my project! As if each chapter is its own story of its own... and then I keep having to go back to try to make all the chapters before it make cohesive sense, and it's just been a snail's pace for me. 😂 I also agree with the balance and not too many cliffies. In my case, it's the opposite. Not enough cliffies or chapter-ending variations. I only noticed thanks to the help of other, more experienced writers (and I'm grateful to every single one of them for sparing some time for me, yourself included).  Thank you very much for sharing your thoughts. 

Cliffies! 😈😈❤️

[BendtedWreath]

Just now, kbois said:

Cliffies! 😈😈❤️

I'm very much still working on that. Absolutely, Sensei! 🫡

[Krista]

9 minutes ago, BendtedWreath said:

I agree. My first goal when I started the project last year was to finish it by Halloween of that same year. Then, it was to finish it by this Halloween. Now, it's just to finish it with all my might, whenever that happens. 😂

That's a fascinating way to go about it! It makes perfect sense that if an idea doesn't hold your own interest more than a couple of times, it won't feel engaging enough to write about. I also find it amusing that your idea of short is 30k, and that's almost my current word count. 🤣 I'm glad it isn't that I've fallen out of love with my project though. I love it fine, I just need to learn how to portray what I'd like it to portray. 

Wow, yes, I know a couple of other amazing writers who feel the same way as this. I, unfortunately, want- no, I need to know the ending clearly enough to write towards it. That's another struggle I've been facing at this "possibly midway, but I'm not sure, because this is my first multichapter story" stage. I want the ending to mean something to, at the very least, the characters, if not me. But it's just not clear enough for me yet. I can't see it. 

Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and experiences!

Yes, 30k is a lovely number. I wish I could live in a world where I can finish  a complete project around 20 - 30k.. lol. Most of the time I am 90k+ into what should have been a silly Anthology story. I 'can't' structure my writing to fit short-story formats. It takes a whole different skillset to do that and I don't think I'll ever get the hang of it. All these fantastic Anthologies and short stories GA has to offer and I can't match that level in the same number of words. 

[BendtedWreath]

1 minute ago, Krista said:

Yes, 30k is a lovely number. I wish I could live in a world where I can finish  a complete project around 20 - 30k.. lol. Most of the time I am 90k+ into what should have been a silly Anthology story. I 'can't' structure my writing to fit short-story formats. It takes a whole different skillset to do that and I don't think I'll ever get the hang of it. All these fantastic Anthologies and short stories GA has to offer and I can't match that level in the same number of words. 

I disagree there. I'm sure you would be able to match that level in the same number of words if you wanted to. But you'd have to really want to create a compact experiment. Otherwise, it wouldn't feel fun.

[kbois]

33 minutes ago, BendtedWreath said:

I disagree there. I'm sure you would be able to match that level in the same number of words if you wanted to. But you'd have to really want to create a compact experiment. Otherwise, it wouldn't feel fun.

A few years ago there was a June Pride event that limited the number of words you could submit to 1000. Now that was freaking hard!

[BendtedWreath]

2 minutes ago, kbois said:

A few years ago there was a June Pride event that limited the number of words you could submit to 1000. Now that was freaking hard!

I... will have to hunt down that event somehow. Might have to call on some admins to help me dig it up. 

[Mikiesboy]

1 hour ago, BendtedWreath said:

I only noticed thanks to the help of other, more experienced writers (and I'm grateful to every single one of them for sparing some time for me, yourself included).  Thank you very much for sharing your thoughts. 

No worries. I'm happy to help if i can.  You'll figure out your style the more you write and try new things. And your editor can help you as well. 

Regarding short stories, I prefer them myself. I love to read a good long novel, but i like to write short stories.  I've written longer things, but they are more of a challenge for me.

But we're all different, and i think you should try different genres and styles to help you grow as a writer. 

[Valkyrie]

38 minutes ago, BendtedWreath said:

I... will have to hunt down that event somehow. Might have to call on some admins to help me dig it up. 

You can find the stories for it here   

 

 

[BendtedWreath]

1 hour ago, Valkyrie said:

You can find the stories for it here   

[Talo Segura]

My approach is you have to have a story to write a book, a start, a middle, and an end. It doesn't need to be in detail, but you need to know where the story is going. You don't need this outline on paper, it can be in your head, but I'll come back to that.

If you have a great idea, a start, you can enthusiastically write chapter one, anything from 2k to 5k words. If you can't write chapter two, don't know where this great start is going, the middle, the end, then you have a short story and that's all.

Outline in your head means you seriously need the time to write it, the whole story. Or you have to start writing the outline down. I can't come back to stories unless I'm writing a sequel, and those are difficult. Coming back to a story means reading what you have, timeline, plot, characters, a lot of work when it's not fresh in your head.

Timeframe from weeks to months, but I'm not spending a year writing a novel, not unless you pay me 😁

Currently, I don't write anymore, just read and comment, and sometimes review.

[Jason Rimbaud]

4 hours ago, BendtedWreath said:

To anyone who isn't aware, I'm still very green when it comes to writing. I've noticed that when a project is small, less than 10k words, I can set aside a few ways up to a week to get it done on my off time. 

However, I've also been working on a multi-chaptered project with only around 13 chapters or so to show for it for one entire year now. 

Everyday life has many obstacles, yes, but it's not like I have no time in my day that I can set aside for writing.

In fact, I have a solid 2 hours of commuting time I should be putting to good use. 

My questions for everyone are:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

I am going to throw my unwanted two cents into this ring and give you another way to look at your own writing. And I disagree with many of the comments that were offered earlier in this thread. And before anyone gets butt hurt, the reason I disagreed are purely on a philosophical level, and not an attack on anyone. So I will be answering your questions and will generally be addressing, as concepts, some of the ideas that others have put forth. Because I believe writing starts in your head and you are in charge of what you produce. 

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? I'd first like to know what your definition of conclusion is.

My definition, the conclusion of any project would be three to five re-writes of a completed story, edited, and ready to share. All that could look to be a daunting task. 

Next what are you wanting to write. Is it a novel, short story, something in between? The answer to that question should give you a rough estimate how long your project should take. 

Here is a little guide, the average chapter is 4K to 6K, the average person can write 1K every hour. The average novel has 20 chapters, you can run the numbers and get a general idea how long each project should take you. A hundred thousand word novel should take you one hundred hours. If you commit to writing one hour a day, roughly three months to finish a novel. I think my math checks out, I don't know, I'm a stupid chef. Sounds good to me. 

That doesn't seem like that much when you break it down into manageable chunks. 

One hundred hours to get you the rough draft. You still will need to do re-writes, editing, more re-writes, polishing it until it gleams like the sun off my bald head. That could take another three months. So arguably, you should be able to finish a novel in six months. 

Now let's get real. And I'll use myself as an example. For the last two months, I took a break from GA to finally focus on a story I've been obsessing about for nearly two years. While I was writing other stories, my mind would always go back to this story. I even dreamed about it. So on June 3rd, I started writing it. On August 1st, I had finished the first draft at 266,675 words and 765 pages. 

Did that novel take me two months to write or over two years? 

In a very long way to answer your first question, before you even start the story, you need to have a few things in place. What is the ending? It can be vague, but you have to have something to write towards. With all my stories save one, by the time I got to the ending, it wasn't even close to what I had in mind when I first started writing it.

Because as the story progressed, with me always writing towards that ending, I discovered a better ending. It's okay to discover things while you write, but having a goal to write towards will help you not to get stuck and to have a path when things get difficult. More on that topic in the next answer. 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you? Here is where I differ from some of the other ideas that have been put forth. 

I have read people say you can't force writing, that if its not there, its not there and that's okay. Or that to be creative you have to wait on good ole muse to come knocking.  Or they say I write only when I feel inspired. To me, that sounds like excuses for not writing. 

Since I don't believe in the concept of muse, which is what the above sentence hints at, I disagree completely. Doesn't matter if I'm tired, or if I fought with my husband, or if the customers in my restaurant were assholes that day, when I'm ready to create, it comes when I sit down at my laptop with my glass of pink lemonade and strawberry/kiwi vape. I have developed the skill to use it when I desire. Muse is really only your own personal desire.

So how did I train myself to write whenever I want? Easy, there are many things one can do. But as every single successful author will tell you, like any other skill, it takes practice. For me, I got that practice by committing to writing two hours every day, seven days a week. And when I first started, it was hard to face that blank screen. And for the first few weeks, sometimes I would sit for two hours and write nothing. But I didn't give up. 

Instead, all that day, I would think about what I wanted to write that night. So when it came time to sit down, I had a really good idea ready to go. That got me in the habit of thinking about the story away from the keyboard. And while I don't outline my stories, I do go through them many times in my head before I sit down to write. 

I have major plot points I want to hit, a rough outline of chapters, key conflicts that builds towards a climactic ending and a rough idea of the main characters. That gives me a framework for the beginning, middle, and end. I also have ideas for key scenes that I either need to write towards or move on from. So I have a roadmap worked out beforehand. 

Then I start to write, and that's where I discover all the fun things, character traits, idiosyncratic behaviors, the fun dialogue that hopefully brings life to my stories. And when I do get stuck, I revert back to my roadmap to keep me in the right direction. So I plan, think about, and discover all at the same time when writing. And I never get stuck and the skill is there whenever I call upon it. 

And if that doesn't help you, I'll share with you another secret I learned. 

 

A few weeks ago, I knew what I wanted to happen in a particular chapter but I could not figure out how to write that particular scene. I was stuck, and when I checked my plot points, I saw that I was exactly where the story needed me to be, I just couldn't write the scene. So I wrote this instead, because this is a first draft and I know I can go back and correct it. So I wrote, "D goes to the island, gets blown up by a goat, and nearly dies." 

Suddenly I wasn't stuck. I know D went to the island, he got blown up by a goat, and he nearly died. Then using that as a placeholder, I could write the aftermath, what happened after D was blown up. And in the dialogue I actually discovered how it happened through eye witness accounts. This was showing not telling through interactions and dialogue. So if you get stuck, just write the next scene and hopefully that will give you a way to fill in the gaps later. Either way you're moving forward.

The final trick I learned. When you start a story, don't go back and edit. Keeping moving forward until you get to the end. You can always go back and expand on something, its easier to edit than to complete a story. Train yourself to keep going to the end, like writing, that is a skill that is learned and practice until it becomes second nature. If you have to write D went to the island and got blown up by a goat, do it. 

The first draft doesn't have to pretty, just get to the end. Think of it in this manner, authors write the story to the end. Then they go back and edit. 

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time? Think of chapters as you would a serial TV show. Each chapter contains it's own unique conflict/world building/character building arc with a resolved conflict while pushing the overall story forward. Babylon 5 did this in genius ways over their five year run. 

As a novel has to have a beginning, middle, and end with conflict resolution, your chapters don't have to follow that same formula. Sometimes chapters are there to raise the stakes, to make the conflict even bigger, put your characters into worsening scenarios to give depth and meaning. And sometimes they could be a breather, a chance to let the reader catch their breath and process what had just happened. Most writers know when the chapter should end. Don't be so tied to the idea that chapters should be 5K to 7K words. I have written chapters double that and still feel like they could be longer depending on what I am trying to say. If your chapters are less than 3k, you might be leaving a lot of narrative on the table. 

If any of this advice sticks in your head, because I get long. winded and boorish, take away this one thing. There is no muse, no 'well the words just aren't coming today'. That's your brain tricking you. Writing is a skill that needs to be practiced, to become great you have to write whether you feel like it or not. I didn't become a chef in San Francisco because sometimes I felt like cooking and sometimes I didn't. I have my own restaurant because when other people were going out drinking, I was at home practicing my recipes on my friends and neighbors. I have my own restaurant because when people were going to brunch and hanging out, I was drawing my logo and the floor plans to my first space before I had the money or a location. I had a goal and I worked towards it. 

Writing is the same thing, you have to write, when you don't feel like it, you write. When life is hard, you write. That's what author's do. Writers give up, or wait for inspiration, authors create the inspiration and push through the times they don't want to push. To become great at anything, they say you have to spend 10,000 hours. Writers takes breaks, authors don't. Authors develope the habits that keep them writing no matter how much time they can devout to their craft. 

The last thing I will say, lots of people approach writing differently and what works for me might not work for you. But one thing all the great authors agree upon, writing is a skill, your brain can be trained to be creative whenever you desire, and the only way to get good at it is by writing and reading other great authors. 

I'm sure none of this helps but It was fun for me to analyze my own thoughts. 

[BendtedWreath]

6 hours ago, Talo Segura said:

If you have a great idea, a start, you can enthusiastically write chapter one, anything from 2k to 5k words. If you can't write chapter two, don't know where this great start is going, the middle, the end, then you have a short story and that's all.

I never thought of it that way. But it is similar to how I feel, if I stall after a certain length without something to work towards, it might as well be a short story.

6 hours ago, Talo Segura said:

Timeframe from weeks to months, but I'm not spending a year writing a novel, not unless you pay me 😁

🤣 It’s been a year and more for me, but I find I don't mind it, as I dont plan on posting it live until I'm fairly happy with it. I don’t have to be 💯 percent satisfied, but even 75% content is better than anything less.

6 hours ago, Talo Segura said:

Currently, I don't write anymore, just read and comment, and sometimes review.

That just means I have to read your older work.

[BendtedWreath]

6 hours ago, Jason Rimbaud said:

I'm sure none of this helps but It was fun for me to analyze my own thoughts. 

On the contrary, I can't thank you enough for sharing another glimpse of your methods. You've told me before that you edit rough drafts until you're satisfied with them. I want to get to that stage, the first full draft completed, so that I can get to the 'editing about half the number of times J edits.' Not because I can't imagine myself editing as many times as you do, but because I would never be able to stop myself from endless editing.  😂 I already do have something similar to your "D heads to an island and gets blown up by a goat" written down, these placeholders for future scenes and chapters.  One of the problems is that some of those scenes feel out of order, or like too many unnecessary steps. There is also too much indirect confrontation (I'm sure some isn't much of an issue, but my case feels unbalanced). Some of the side characters have no problem with their own direct confrontations. But I don’t want it to feel like a sudden personality shift when the main character does it, which means I have to show him at different levels of confronting the conflicts being gradually more and more direct. 😅 This thought was indeed in my head before I began writing, but all the details of the where, when, and "how much" just don't feel like enough for the change I want to show happening. It feels like the first half of the story is stronger than the second half, and I need to figure out how to elevate the second half.

Edited August 14 by BendtedWreath

[Inkognito]

14 hours ago, BendtedWreath said:

To anyone who isn't aware, I'm still very green when it comes to writing. I've noticed that when a project is small, less than 10k words, I can set aside a few ways up to a week to get it done on my off time. 

However, I've also been working on a multi-chaptered project with only around 13 chapters or so to show for it for one entire year now. 

Everyday life has many obstacles, yes, but it's not like I have no time in my day that I can set aside for writing.

In fact, I have a solid 2 hours of commuting time I should be putting to good use. 

My questions for everyone are:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion?

Truthfully? I don’t have a consistent timeframe, and I don’t hold myself to one either. Most of my work so far has been short stories between 1k and 4k words. Some of those I’ve written and edited in a single day, while others have taken several days or even weeks.

My advice? Don’t compare your timeline to anyone else’s. The speed at which you finish a project has zero correlation with your talent, skill, value, or potential as a writer.

It’s not a race. It’s not even a sport. There’s no Writer Olympics to win a gold medal in.

It’s just storytelling and stress, bro.

 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

Absolutely. You can have the same two hours free every day, but that doesn’t mean you’re the same every day.

Maybe you’re sick.

Maybe something stressful is on your mind.

Or maybe you just wanna say “screw it” and watch cat videos.

That’s not laziness. It's being human.

Brains aren’t vending machines. You don’t insert time and get genius.

Sometimes you insert time and get static, existential dread, or a craving for Cheetos.

 

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

Yes.

I usually have a loose idea where the chapters might fall, but I don’t treat it like gospel.

If I’m on a roll, I’ll write like I’m rafting down Gravy River on Mashed Potato Mountain and worry about chapters later.

Other times, I go chapter by chapter. It depends on the story, my mood, and how many snacks I have within reach.

Neither way is better. If one method works for you, awesome. If you switch between both depending on the wind and moon phase, also awesome.

 

P.S.

Writers always think they’re right,
Just because they write.
But other writers know,
They're the one who's right.
Right?
Write. 😉

[BendtedWreath]

15 minutes ago, Inkognito said:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion?

Truthfully? I don’t have a consistent timeframe, and I don’t hold myself to one either. Most of my work so far has been short stories between 1k and 4k words. Some of those I’ve written and edited in a single day, while others have taken several days or even weeks.

My advice? Don’t compare your timeline to anyone else’s. The speed at which you finish a project has zero correlation with your talent, skill, value, or potential as a writer.

It’s not a race. It’s not even a sport. There’s no Writer Olympics to win a gold medal in.

It’s just storytelling and stress, bro.

 

I'm curious to see what some of your longer work is like. I should make another reading list.

17 minutes ago, Inkognito said:

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

Absolutely. You can have the same two hours free every day, but that doesn’t mean you’re the same every day.

That’s not laziness. It's being human.

Very true. Never thought of it that way. 

19 minutes ago, Inkognito said:

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

Other times, I go chapter by chapter. It depends on the story, my mood, and how many snacks I have within reach.

Neither way is better. If one method works for you, awesome. If you switch between both depending on the wind and moon phase, also awesome.

I find it fascinating that you're able to do either given the circumstances. Everyone has such unique strengths. I think part of my problem is that I have to figure out what works for me (regarding bigger projects, the small ones aren't too much of a trouble). I'm already going to try out some of the things everyone's mentioned, just to see if any of it helps me figure some things out. 

24 minutes ago, Inkognito said:

Writers always think they’re right,
Just because they write.
But other writers know,
They're the one who's right.
Right?
Write. 😉

🤣 Yes, no two writers write exactly the same and all methods vary behind the scenes. Even so, seeing all of the different routines and structures is inspiring. That all of you shared even that much with me makes a sap like me fight back eye allergies because it reminds me I'm not the only one who gets stuck sometimes. There is an end in the horizon and I just have to keep working my way through to reach it. Thank you so much.

[CassieQ]

 

17 hours ago, BendtedWreath said:

 

My questions for everyone are:

1. What is your general timeframe from the start of a project to its conclusion? 

2. Do you lack focus sometimes, even (or especially) when you have the time available to you?

3. Do you write everything down first and then section it off into chapters, or do you build it up one chapter at a time?

1)  Timeframe depends on the length.  I can pound out an SA entry in a few weeks.  Anthology pieces are usually longer, can take a few months.  Long projects take years.  My current WIP is 5 years old and right at 200K words.  But I'm also a slow writer and have a full time job in healthcare (if you know, you know).

2)  Hahahahahahahaha yes.  This is a constant struggle.   The more time available,  the more things I find to distract myself.  The best option, for me, is to eliminate my main sources of distraction...my phone and the internet.   I've had the best results from writing outside or in my car, longhand, during my lunch breaks at work with the phone inside the building.  Leaving the house also works well.  I can't write in silence without my attention wandering, so I usually listen to music that is tolerable, but that I don't love enough to make me stop writing to listen.  Disney instrumentals work well for this, they're pleasant and melodic with no lyrics.  

3)  I draft everything into one huge document (that I back up in multiple places, I've learned well from past mistakes).   I abhor planning things out beforehand so when I need to double check things for continuity, I just scroll back up instead of having to remember what chapter had what and go looking for it.  I cut the draft into chapters and proof them again before I send them out to editors or beta readers.  This method is good for me but is probably too chaotic for some writers.  

Edited August 14 by CassieQ

[Ron]

Well, dang! If I’ve learned something from all of the above it’s this:

You do you because it works for you, and I’ll do me because no one else is doing me (or something like that).

Otherwise, I can greatly sympathize with any and every author who struggles to get their words out on the page. I would love to disagree with @Jason Rimbaud on the subject of discipline but I fear I’d be on the losing end of a stick. But all the same I agree with @Mikiesboy in that having too much time on your hands is a grave risk, considering one’s time might feel unlimited — I can sit down and write pretty much any time I want, until I wonder where the day went. And, there’s this little gem from @Inkognito : “It’s just storytelling and stress, bro.” We need a drumroll after that. @BendtedWreath needs to know what the ending looks like in order to write toward it. For whatever reason I usually come up with a title and an ending lickety-split, along with some of the beginning and/or parts in-between, then I’m left with all these blank-spaces that must be filled in. And then I actively muse and muse some more (as opposed to being affected by a muse) thinking that I have lots of time… .

In the end I’ve paid attention to all of the given advice (even if I didn’t mention you specifically). Yes, I could have spent all of that time writing instead of reading and writing this, but I’m sure some things may require time to percolate. I’ll take the wait-and-see approach, maybe some of it will stick. Thanks.

[CassieQ]

16 hours ago, kbois said:

Two hours of commuting time kinda sucks, but on the bright side, its time you can use to let your brain marinate some of your ideas. My brain never shuts off. If you can, during your vommute, just focus on daydreaming. Eventually something will ignite and you'll be able to move forward. Just don't miss your stop.

I'm looking forward to whatever you come up with. 

 

Daydreaming while performing physical tasks also helps me.  Going for a walk, taking a shower, driving, etc.