The Drop in Centre

[Ryan Jones]

36 minutes ago, spyke said:

We're just going to have to agree to disagree on this topic. If you're really that insistent on doing this, then be up front with your actions rather than take this "cloak and dagger" approach.  Contact the man directly and tell him the entire story, rather than having people "surreptitiously" obtain his DNA without his consent and thereby removing all choice and say about the matter from him. 

Well, I think it's better to take the "cloak and dagger" approach until I'm sure that he's actually my child. Why would I want to disrupt his life until I knew for sure? I'm still not sure I'm going to contact him even if it turns out he is my son.

22 minutes ago, Reader1810 said:

On the other hand by obtaining and testing his DNA beforehand, it would determine if he is @Ryan Jones’s son or not without interrupting his life. 

The only issue I can see here is he may not want his DNA on record as this is the case with many individuals. 

Maybe being upfront about the situation is the best way to go? That is, let the choice be his. You know put his wishes above all else as hard as that may be it is showing respect towards him, which is something he might greatly appreciate and view as a positive. 

Just my two cents…

 

 

Thanks for both your comments.

His DNA will not be on file anywhere. This will be a private situation and even though I'm using contacts within the government to do all of it they understand the need and use of secrecy. If I didn't trust them I wouldn't have asked them to do it. I'm pretty certain that the lab doing the comparison won't know the names of either one of us.

 

[Reader1810]

44 minutes ago, Ryan Jones said:

Well, I think it's better to take the "cloak and dagger" approach until I'm sure that he's actually my child. Why would I want to disrupt his life until I knew for sure? I'm still not sure I'm going to contact him even if it turns out he is my son.

Thanks for both your comments.

His DNA will not be on file anywhere. This will be a private situation and even though I'm using contacts within the government to do all of it they understand the need and use of secrecy. If I didn't trust them I wouldn't have asked them to do it. I'm pretty certain that the lab doing the comparison won't know the names of either one of us.

Okay, I just thought of something. Will you tell him you had your relationship to him conformed via surreptitiously obtained DNA? Or if you don’t tell him and he figures that out? Some people might not be okay with that approach. If he’s one such person this could go very badly for you. 

You need to protect yourself as well, Ryan. 

[Mikiesboy]

49 minutes ago, Ryan Jones said:

Well, I think it's better to take the "cloak and dagger" approach until I'm sure that he's actually my child. Why would I want to disrupt his life until I knew for sure? I'm still not sure I'm going to contact him even if it turns out he is my son.

Thanks for both your comments.

His DNA will not be on file anywhere. This will be a private situation and even though I'm using contacts within the government to do all of it they understand the need and use of secrecy. If I didn't trust them I wouldn't have asked them to do it. I'm pretty certain that the lab doing the comparison won't know the names of either one of us.

 

All i can say is wow the ethics of this are pretty sketchy. 

[Kitt]

Obtaining and testing his DNA without his consent is not legal. That is why  law enforcement are required to obtain warrants to collect DNA without the subject's consent.

[Kitt]

12 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

All i can say is wow the ethics of this are pretty sketchy. 

Ethics may be sketchy, but the law is not. It is actually quite clear in America. No consent and probable cause must be shown to a judge, and you better cross your fingers the judge will agree. Most are loathe to invade a persons privacy without damn good reason. 

Something tells me "I want to know if he is my son" is not good enough.

[Ryan Jones]

2 hours ago, Kitt said:

Obtaining and testing his DNA without his consent is not legal. That is why  law enforcement are required to obtain warrants to collect DNA without the subject's consent.

For all I know everything done so far to find out that he was Patty's son was possibly illegal. Who knows what they did to gather that information? That gets me to thinking though. Maybe it's not even necessary. I'll call them tomorrow to suggest that they first look at all those DNA test sites. It's entirely possible the DNA might be available already.

 

2 hours ago, Mikiesboy said:

All i can say is wow the ethics of this are pretty sketchy. 

I'm agreeing with this statement. However it's a bit too late to worry about it. I do know a couple of adopted kids. I actually talked to one of them about it and asked his opinion. Just about the searching to find the records of the kid and he raised no objections to that. I even asked him (he's 36 now, never knew who his father was) what he would do if his biological father contacted him with the same type of situation that I'm in. He told me that he's like to meet his bio dad someday, especially now that his adoptive parents are both deceased.

There are times I wished I hadn't overheard that conversation at the high school reunion.

Edited August 25, 2021 by Ryan Jones

[Mikiesboy]

2 hours ago, Kitt said:

Ethics may be sketchy, but the law is not. It is actually quite clear in America. No consent and probable cause must be shown to a judge, and you better cross your fingers the judge will agree. Most are loathe to invade a persons privacy without damn good reason. 

Something tells me "I want to know if he is my son" is not good enough.

i've not mentioned this to my Husband. i have a fairly good idea what He'd say. Most likely the same as you i'm sure.  He's a bit fussy about doing the right things within the law. At a guess, I'd say the law is the same here.

[Wayne Gray]

2 hours ago, Kitt said:

Obtaining and testing his DNA without his consent is not legal. That is why  law enforcement are required to obtain warrants to collect DNA without the subject's consent.

Nailed it.

Besides, regardless of the outcome of the test if the data is acquired through illegal means, then the results are invalid.

Also ... you could literally go to jail over it.

[Ryan Jones]

53 minutes ago, Wayne Gray said:

Nailed it.

Besides, regardless of the outcome of the test if the data is acquired through illegal means, then the results are invalid.

Also ... you could literally go to jail over it.

I don't think there's really any issue about whether it's invalid or not. I'm not looking to do anything judicial with the information. It's for my own personal curiosity. Besides, I'm not an idiot, I doubt I'd be showing up at his door waving the test results and saying "Hi son, I'm your dad!"

55 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

i've not mentioned this to my Husband. i have a fairly good idea what He'd say. Most likely the same as you i'm sure.  He's a bit fussy about doing the right things within the law. At a guess, I'd say the law is the same here.

Laws. In my line of work things became very blurry, to say the least. I was breaking the law for the government at age 16 when I was being paid to join antiwar movements and report back. I'm not sure that I was ever taught that there were procedures to follow and lines not to cross.

Anyway, I think I'll just not post any further results from this. Whatever happens. Sorry to have bothered you all with this and thanks for any comments.

On to other news, hey, it's less than 2 months until preseason hockey!

[Kitt]

11 minutes ago, Ryan Jones said:

Sorry to have bothered you all with this and thanks for any comments.

1. It was not a bother. Never be sorry for starting a lively discussion

2. It is always good to look at all sides of an issue, and legality is a side to this one.

3. Your past employment history aside, fact is you can get into trouble if you obtain DNA by covert means. I am not saying you should or should not, just that you put yourself in a compromised position if you get caught.

[MichaelS36]

8 hours ago, Mikiesboy said:

All i can say is wow the ethics of this are pretty sketchy. 

Just a little. I've other choice words however...I won't bother. 

[MichaelS36]

6 hours ago, Wayne Gray said:

Nailed it.

Besides, regardless of the outcome of the test if the data is acquired through illegal means, then the results are invalid.

Also ... you could literally go to jail over it.

Without a doubt. I guess rights and personal privacy don't mean much to some.

[mollyhousemouse]

good morning 🌄!

 

[rickproehl]

16 hours ago, Ryan Jones said:

I don't think there's really any issue about whether it's invalid or not. I'm not looking to do anything judicial with the information. It's for my own personal curiosity. Besides, I'm not an idiot, I doubt I'd be showing up at his door waving the test results and saying "Hi son, I'm your dad!"

Laws. In my line of work things became very blurry, to say the least. I was breaking the law for the government at age 16 when I was being paid to join antiwar movements and report back. I'm not sure that I was ever taught that there were procedures to follow and lines not to cross.

Anyway, I think I'll just not post any further results from this. Whatever happens. Sorry to have bothered you all with this and thanks for any comments.

On to other news, hey, it's less than 2 months until preseason hockey!

i would like to add a thought to this. you should be honest with him. you have no idea who or what he was told of his parents. that is all he knows. i understand that you would like to know if he is yours. send a letter / email to him and tell him what you know. let him make the decision to contact you. if he does great and if he doesn’t that’s ok. you should think of him and his life. you can’t change the past at least be open with him. 

make sure you want to open this Pandora Box. some secrets are better left in the past and never spoken of. 
this is a hard decision to make.

if i could say something being honest with him would start to build a bridge.

Good Luck in your decision.

[Ryan Jones]

23 minutes ago, rickproehl said:

i would like to add a thought to this. you should be honest with him. you have no idea who or what he was told of his parents. that is all he knows. i understand that you would like to know if he is yours. send a letter / email to him and tell him what you know. let him make the decision to contact you. if he does great and if he doesn’t that’s ok. you should think of him and his life. you can’t change the past at least be open with him. 

make sure you want to open this Pandora Box. some secrets are better left in the past and never spoken of. 
this is a hard decision to make.

if i could say something being honest with him would start to build a bridge.

Good Luck in your decision.

Thanks for the message Rick.

My original thoughts on this have changed. Right now I told my friend that I didn't want to know anything other than if the child lived, still lives and where they live. Those questions have been answered already. It would be nice if he is looking for blood relations, it would make things clearer and certainly require no secrecy. I'll know that before the end of the month, if he's done any DNA test kit like Ancestry or the like. I hadn't really considered my 1976 Charlotte stay until this morning, if he has done this he's likely to have found an unanticipated brother(s) or sister(s).

I realize as @MichaelS36 so eloquently put it that I'm basically ignoring this person's right to privacy but I have no idea how to find out what I need to know without disrupting his life.

I'd really like to have it out with Patty's parents. Or Patty for that matter but they're all dead and I have yet to find a true medium to do the contact for me. I'll have to wait until I'm back in the universal mind to do that.

 

 

[Mikiesboy]

This week's fun fare ... 5x baby bok choy, 2 tomatoes,  a winter mystery squash, 3x green peppers, 10 plums, 10 peaches, 4x small cucumbers, 12 beets on the smaller size and 4 pears.

We get a list of veggies.. once i get that i will update the mystery squash. That's a lot of food!!

[kbois]

23 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

This week's fun fare ... 5x baby bok choy, 2 tomatoes,  a winter mystery squash, 3x green peppers, 10 plums, 10 peaches, 4x small cucumbers, 12 beets on the smaller size and 4 pears.

We get a list of veggies.. once i get that i will update the mystery squash. That's a lot of food!!

Mystery squash sorta looks like something in the pumpkin family?

Everything looks great (except for the dreaded peppers)!

Enjoy!

[Reader1810]

35 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

i get that i will update the mystery squash

Okay, this got me curious, so I did a little researching of my own.

Apologies if I’m stealing your thunder, but I think it’s this type of squash. 

http://www.tradewindsfruit.com/content/malabar-gourd.htm

[mollyhousemouse]

oh @Mikiesboy it all looks so delicious!

and your kitchen is so bright!

[Mikiesboy]

57 minutes ago, Reader1810 said:

Okay, this got me curious, so I did a little researching of my own.

Apologies if I’m stealing your thunder, but I think it’s this type of squash. 

http://www.tradewindsfruit.com/content/malabar-gourd.htm

i dont think so.. it really looks like a zucchini but you can knock on it.. it's hard.

[mollyhousemouse]

as of 25 minutes ago, my weekend can start. Phil sees His eye dr. tomorrow, i have a baby shower in the afternoon and that is my WHOLE day.

hope everyone is good this afternoon

[Mikiesboy]

23 minutes ago, mollyhousemouse said:

oh @Mikiesboy it all looks so delicious!

and your kitchen is so bright!

there's a floor to ceiling window in there.. we get lots of light and breeze .. a corner apartment is the best. 

[Mikiesboy]

2 minutes ago, mollyhousemouse said:

as of 25 minutes ago, my weekend can start. Phil sees His eye dr. tomorrow, i have a baby shower in the afternoon and that is my WHOLE day.

hope everyone is good this afternoon

that'll be nice     and i hope Phil Sir's appointment goes well ... fingers crossed🤞

[Mikiesboy]

This is the note we get every week about what we've received:

 

Produce for the week: August 26

Kabocha Squash (Simcoe, ON) // Surplus
White Peaches (Beamsville, ON) // Small blemishes
Pears (Beamsville, ON) // Too small or small blemishes
Nectarines* (Beamsville, ON) // Too small or small blemishes
Burbank Plums (Beamsville, ON) // Too small or small blemishes
Field Beefsteak Tomatoes (Simcoe, ON) // Surplus
Cauliflower** (Gormley, ON) // Surplus
Baby Bok choy (Mount Albert, ON) // For variety
Napa Cabbage** (Mount Albert, ON) // Surplus
Beets (Newmarket, ON) // Too small

Sun Tan Peppers (Simcoe, ON) // A slight tinge of red
Baby Cucumbers (Leamington, ON) // Too wonky

Notes:
• We got a call from a couple who own an acre of land in Simcoe saying
they had unexpectedly grown way too many kabocha squash, and that
the squash had gotten way too big due to the heavy rain. We couldn’t
let them go to waste, so we hope everyone can make good use of
them!
• Sun Tan peppers are rejected from the green pepper harvest since they
have a very slight (sometimes unnoticeable) tinge of red caused by
increased sun exposure.

• Everything except the tomatoes, pears, and squash should be
refrigerated immediately to preserve shelf life (the peaches can be left
out if they’ll be consumed within a day).
• *We had a limited supply of nectarines today (that’s the way it goes
sometimes in the produce rescue business), so some boxes had extra
peaches as a substitute.

[Kitt]

32 minutes ago, Mikiesboy said:

that'll be nice     and i hope Phil Sir's appointment goes well ... fingers crossed🤞

What he said!