cj CJ By Carlos Hazday - Series Discussion

[Carlos Hazday]

5 hours ago, dughlas said:

Any chance we might see a pic of the chair at Rod and Taisha's? I've always been more visually oriented but for some reason as I age I'm having more difficulty creating images from text.

I came across the chair(s) in one of the DC area newsletters I subscribe to. I liked them and decided they would work well in the story. Since Rod and Taisha live next door, they'll be making frequent appearances and one of my goals is not to make her too "white." The African motif worked with my goals.

https://www.jomofurniture.com/

 

[Gary L]

1 hour ago, Carlos Hazday said:

I came across the chair(s) in one of the DC area newsletters I subscribe to. I liked them and decided they would work well in the story. Since Rod and Taisha live next door, they'll be making frequent appearances and one of my goals is not to make her too "white." The African motif worked with my goals.

https://www.jomofurniture.com/

 

Amazing designs, wow!

[Carlos Hazday]

1 hour ago, Gary L said:

Amazing designs, wow!

I think they sell for a couple of thousand dollars each. Expensive for a stool, but reasonable for a work of art.

[Carlos Hazday]

@dhphllps

And although you didn't ask about it, the image in the banner's from a picture I took in April 2018 when I went to check out the house they were buying.

[frosenblum]

8 hours ago, Carlos Hazday said:

Had you not read that story?

Yes, I had. But I'd completely forgot it.

I'd recently reread about CJ & Owen's wedding, and the pre-wedding standoff then between CJ & his dads about having a pre-nupnuptual" blowup before CJ's wedding t was fun to reread the story not long after rereading , I was struck that a few things.

How different CJ 's life experience had been at 27 (kicked out of the house at 15, married many years, has several kids, step-parent's deaths and supporting Ritch through his grief, ???'s death, Mexico, Clinton campaign, already making plans to run for President)than Liebe's is, and how different his life had been than Liebe's. CJ  

[Carlos Hazday]

16 minutes ago, frosenblum said:

Yes, I had. But I'd completely forgot it.

I'd recently reread about CJ & Owen's wedding, and the pre-wedding standoff then between CJ & his dads about having a pre-nupnuptual" blowup before CJ's wedding t was fun to reread the story not long after rereading , I was struck that a few things.

How different CJ 's life experience had been at 27 (kicked out of the house at 15, married many years, has several kids, step-parent's deaths and supporting Ritch through his grief, ???'s death, Mexico, Clinton campaign, already making plans to run for President)than Liebe's is, and how different his life had been than Liebe's. CJ  

I firmly believe we are all the product of our experiences. Liebe may be reprimanded when she misbehaves, but she'll know unconditional love. He was older when Cesar and Brett got him, but I wrote several instances of his fathers putting their foot down. Just because you love somebody doesn't mean you have to put up with their crap.

Funny you mention the prenup, I bring it up in the current story.

[frosenblum]

7 minutes ago, Carlos Hazday said:

I firmly believe we are all the product of our experiences. Liebe may be reprimanded when she misbehaves, but she'll know unconditional love. He was older when Cesar and Brett got him, but I wrote several instances of his fathers putting their foot down. Just because you love somebody doesn't mean you have to put up with their crap.

Funny you mention the prenup, I bring it up in the current story.

CJ always had an "or else" when it was a matter of principle. Liebe didn't. CJ would have said, "In that case, we won't get married at the White House. I'd rather elope than let those so-and-sos be at my wedding."

[Carlos Hazday]

Just now, frosenblum said:

CJ always had an "or else" when it was a matter of principle. Liebe didn't. CJ would have said, "In that case, we won't get married at the White House. I'd rather elope than let those so-and-sos be at my wedding."

She did mention she wasn't going to pass up the opportunity for a Rose Garden wedding.

I imagined her as a socialite without being stuck up. Growing up with money and a father in positions of power has probably made her aware of how much image matters. Regardless of what she winds up doing in the future, being married at the White House will always be something few others can lay claim to.

[dughlas]

3 hours ago, Carlos Hazday said:

I came across the chair(s) in one of the DC area newsletters I subscribe to. I liked them and decided they would work well in the story. Since Rod and Taisha live next door, they'll be making frequent appearances and one of my goals is not to make her too "white." The African motif worked with my goals.

https://www.jomofurniture.com/

 

Thanks. I can understand the appeal for a young couple like Taisha and Rod. They are statement pieces.

[Unlimited Possibilites]

I saw this and thought of your story inked.

🧜🏻‍♂️. He is not as hunky as yours

[Carlos Hazday]

2 hours ago, Unlimited Possibilites said:

I saw this and thought of your story inked.

🧜🏻‍♂️. He is not as hunky as yours

You should check the artist who drew the mermaid I shared. Google Albron.

Hell, if I ever need inspiration for a story, I could write stuff about the men he creates.

Alex Bronning (Albron)

[Clancy59]

Just because you love a child, or anyone for that matter, it doesn’t mean you don’t discipline him/her.  In fact, that love should dictate that you DO discipline the child.  You want that child to grow up to be a productive, responsible member of society, rather than a self-centered, egotistical, ‘me first’ kind of person.  It doesn’t have to be harsh or abusive.  However, it does need to make a point to the recipient of the discipline.  The guys have promised to raise Liebe as a successful human by accepting their role as her parents.  If only everyone took that responsibility as seriously!

[Carlos Hazday]

@Clancy59

Considering I have no personal experience in child rearing, it's been quite interesting to read reactions to what I've written. This is fiction, so the children's reactions are not necessarily how most kids would act, but a lot of it is based on observation.

CJ being betrayed by his mother and stepfather, as horrible as it was, is based on reality. Heck, we have a couple of authors on GA who have experienced exactly the same thing. Yes, mothers and fathers can be horrible people. I knew I would be killing off Lourdes and Ritch and couldn't wait to do so. The thought of keeping them alive to increase drama was too much for me. Had I been writing today, I may have kept them around a bit to make them suffer, but those two were destined to die from the moment I created them. Hell, I wish I could kill all those parents who hurt and at times murder their kids.

My first beta reader ever objected when I had Cesar give CJ a beer in the first chapter; she claimed no father would do that. She was quickly dismissed. My father gave me my first shot of Scotch when I was 9 or so, I was allowed beer at times, and I've never had a DUI. Hell, I hate hangovers and barely drink. One of my nieces had her first taste of beer as a toddler when my brother and I would dip a finger in ours and let her lick it. She's an attorney these days.

The first time I had CJ smoke pot, an irate reader wrote me to tell me CJ would never do that. I laughed wondering how they would know what CJ would do, considering he's fictional and my creation. I think I know him better than anyone else. CJ getting high at 15 was based on statistics--the percentage of high school kids who admit to smoking pot--and anecdotal evidence. When I had season tickets for the Florida Panthers (hockey) my buddy and I became friendly with the couple sitting behind us. Eric and I showed up at a couple of games stoned, and the woman laughed at us. She admitted she had smoked pot when she was our age and that she got her daughter stoned at 16 so the girl wouldn't try it on the street.

CJ and Owen not allowing baby talk with Liebe is based on scientific studies. That crap can rot their brain. Speaking to a child as you would an adult has been proven to stimulate the brain often leading to earlier speech. We know Liebe's a chatterbox.

And them not coddling her when she throws tantrums but forcing her to tell them why she's crying is based on how one of my best friends (a therapist) dealt with her daughter. In the first chapter of Capitol Hill, when Owen disciplines Liebe and she cries, Pam's gut reaction was to hug her and probably tell her everything was okay. Reader1810 made a comment while beta reading about how Geoff handled the situation properly by deferring to her fathers. I REALLY liked that observation.

So, even though it's all fiction, I've tried to base a lot of it on reality. Maybe because I'm not a parent I was able to distill everything I read and saw better than someone with fixed ideas they're unwilling to admit may not always be right.

 

 

[frosenblum]

1 hour ago, Carlos Hazday said:

@Clancy59

Considering I have no personal experience in child rearing, it's been quite interesting to read reactions to what I've written. This is fiction, so the children's reactions are not necessarily how most kids would act, but a lot of it is based on observation.

CJ being betrayed by his mother and stepfather, as horrible as it was, is based on reality. Heck, we have a couple of authors on GA who have experienced exactly the same thing. Yes, mothers and fathers can be horrible people. I knew I would be killing off Lourdes and Ritch and couldn't wait to do so. The thought of keeping them alive to increase drama was too much for me. Had I been writing today, I may have kept them around a bit to make them suffer, but those two were destined to die from the moment I created them. Hell, I wish I could kill all those parents who hurt and at times murder their kids.

My first beta reader ever objected when I had Cesar give CJ a beer in the first chapter; she claimed no father would do that. She was quickly dismissed. My father gave me my first shot of Scotch when I was 9 or so, I was allowed beer at times, and I've never had a DUI. Hell, I hate hangovers and barely drink. One of my nieces had her first taste of beer as a toddler when my brother and I would dip a finger in ours and let her lick it. She's an attorney these days.

The first time I had CJ smoke pot, an irate reader wrote me to tell me CJ would never do that. I laughed wondering how they would know what CJ would do, considering he's fictional and my creation. I think I know him better than anyone else. CJ getting high at 15 was based on statistics--the percentage of high school kids who admit to smoking pot--and anecdotal evidence. When I had season tickets for the Florida Panthers (hockey) my buddy and I became friendly with the couple sitting behind us. Eric and I showed up at a couple of games stoned, and the woman laughed at us. She admitted she had smoked pot when she was our age and that she got her daughter stoned at 16 so the girl wouldn't try it on the street.

CJ and Owen not allowing baby talk with Liebe is based on scientific studies. That crap can rot their brain. Speaking to a child as you would an adult has been proven to stimulate the brain often leading to earlier speech. We know Liebe's a chatterbox.

And them not coddling her when she throws tantrums but forcing her to tell them why she's crying is based on how one of my best friends (a therapist) dealt with her daughter. In the first chapter of Capitol Hill, when Owen disciplines Liebe and she cries, Pam's gut reaction was to hug her and probably tell her everything was okay. Reader1810 made a comment while beta reading about how Geoff handled the situation properly by deferring to her fathers. I REALLY liked that observation.

So, even though it's all fiction, I've tried to base a lot of it on reality. Maybe because I'm not a parent I was able to distill everything I read and saw better than someone with fixed ideas they're unwilling to admit may not always be right.

 

 

Bravo!

[Clancy59]

1 hour ago, Carlos Hazday said:

@Clancy59

Considering I have no personal experience in child rearing, it's been quite interesting to read reactions to what I've written. This is fiction, so the children's reactions are not necessarily how most kids would act, but a lot of it is based on observation.

CJ being betrayed by his mother and stepfather, as horrible as it was, is based on reality. Heck, we have a couple of authors on GA who have experienced exactly the same thing. Yes, mothers and fathers can be horrible people. I knew I would be killing off Lourdes and Ritch and couldn't wait to do so. The thought of keeping them alive to increase drama was too much for me. Had I been writing today, I may have kept them around a bit to make them suffer, but those two were destined to die from the moment I created them. Hell, I wish I could kill all those parents who hurt and at times murder their kids.

My first beta reader ever objected when I had Cesar give CJ a beer in the first chapter; she claimed no father would do that. She was quickly dismissed. My father gave me my first shot of Scotch when I was 9 or so, I was allowed beer at times, and I've never had a DUI. Hell, I hate hangovers and barely drink. One of my nieces had her first taste of beer as a toddler when my brother and I would dip a finger in ours and let her lick it. She's an attorney these days.

The first time I had CJ smoke pot, an irate reader wrote me to tell me CJ would never do that. I laughed wondering how they would know what CJ would do, considering he's fictional and my creation. I think I know him better than anyone else. CJ getting high at 15 was based on statistics--the percentage of high school kids who admit to smoking pot--and anecdotal evidence. When I had season tickets for the Florida Panthers (hockey) my buddy and I became friendly with the couple sitting behind us. Eric and I showed up at a couple of games stoned, and the woman laughed at us. She admitted she had smoked pot when she was our age and that she got her daughter stoned at 16 so the girl wouldn't try it on the street.

CJ and Owen not allowing baby talk with Liebe is based on scientific studies. That crap can rot their brain. Speaking to a child as you would an adult has been proven to stimulate the brain often leading to earlier speech. We know Liebe's a chatterbox.

And them not coddling her when she throws tantrums but forcing her to tell them why she's crying is based on how one of my best friends (a therapist) dealt with her daughter. In the first chapter of Capitol Hill, when Owen disciplines Liebe and she cries, Pam's gut reaction was to hug her and probably tell her everything was okay. Reader1810 made a comment while beta reading about how Geoff handled the situation properly by deferring to her fathers. I REALLY liked that observation.

So, even though it's all fiction, I've tried to base a lot of it on reality. Maybe because I'm not a parent I was able to distill everything I read and saw better than someone with fixed ideas they're unwilling to admit may not always be right.

 

 

Seriously, I think you do a fair job with CJ, Owen and Liebe.  They’re not going to be perfect.  For one thing, CJ has a temper and it can flare up occasionally, even now.  However, they have high expectations of, and for, Liebe.  They are completely aware of the limitations of her age and make the proper accommodations.  Avoiding ‘baby talk’ can have great effects on her vocabulary and her understanding of the discussions around her.  I’m not crazy about her use of their names—I’d rather she use the traditional ‘Daddy and Papa’ or some variation, but that’s me.  But not using ‘baby talk’ does not preclude the cuddling that is so necessary for the proper emotional development of the whole person, and they do that.  That is not the ‘coddling’ you described when she got upset.  They told her to tell them why she was upset.  It helped her to realize what her issue was and help them solve it.   However, it wasn’t surprising that Pam wanted to ‘rush to the rescue’ with those cuddles and kisses, but it really wasn’t her place since the guys were there, unless they asked for her assistance.  She is the Grandma, not the Mama.  Cuddling is for quiet, loving time.

As far as Lourdes and Ritch are concerned, while I am glad the guys don’t have to deal with them, I do sometimes wish, however, they could be around to see the happy, successful adult CJ has become, in spite of their assumptions of worthlessness simply because he identified himself to them as gay.

 I, for one, never really had an issue with you having minors tasting the alcoholic beverages, even to the point of having a small amount for themselves on special occasions.  (And they are teaching Liebe the proper way to be an Oenophile.  It’s part of her heritage.)  That could be because I was also raised that way.  My parents did not drink wine every night, but they did 3 or 4 times each month.  My brother and I were allowed to taste whatever they had, even if we were in a restaurant. Their position was that it took the mystique from alcohol and we wouldn’t be tempted to indulge as teens.  It worked.  Neither one of us has ever been drunk. Tipsy or buzzed, maybe, but not drunk. Neither one of us has ever had a DUI, either.  One time, I was on a field trip with my junior high school French classes and we visited a winery in Door County, WI.  After the tour, they took us all into the gift shop and offered the chaperones tastes of the wines.  Well, my Mom was a chaperone and did taste.  Imagine the shock of the other students when she simply turned to me and asked me my opinion!  (She actually asked if it would be OK, first, though.) The other kids asked why I got a taste and they didn’t and were told by the tour guide that she had given the sample to my Mom.  She couldn’t control if Mom gave me, her daughter, a taste or not!  (We bought 2-3 bottles! 🤭). When I was a baby, evidently a great-aunt gave me a taste of beer on her finger.  Mom said I made the worst face!  I can’t drink beer to this day, although I will use it to cook with.  And I never developed a taste for hard liqueur.  Neither one of us has ever been interested in drugs in any way, shape or form.

So, while these stories are fiction, they are quite realistic.  You do keep close enough to the truth that people, most of them, don’t raise any objections.  And when they do, I have seen you listen to them and give your reasons for going the direction you have or made the necessary adjustments.  Keep up the good work!

[Anton_Cloche]

On 3/3/2023 at 11:49 AM, Carlos Hazday said:

I came across the chair(s) in one of the DC area newsletters I subscribe to. I liked them and decided they would work well in the story. Since Rod and Taisha live next door, they'll be making frequent appearances and one of my goals is not to make her too "white." The African motif worked with my goals.

https://www.jomofurniture.com/

 

Thinking about the rocking chair the Pam Liston 'sniffed' at (didn't meet her definition of antique or keepsake), I tried to put it into a time perspective and the only one that comes to mind from the early 60's is this one:

https://images.app.goo.gl/eD7n6gMyFtYGJHFr6

https://jfk.artifacts.archives.gov/objects/8328/carolina-rocker

Edited March 12, 2023 by Anton_Cloche

[Carlos Hazday]

6 hours ago, Anton_Cloche said:

Thinking about the rocking chair the Pam Liston 'sniffed' at (didn't meet her definition of antique or keepsake), I tried to put it into a time perspective and the only one that comes to mind from the early 60's is this one:

https://images.app.goo.gl/eD7n6gMyFtYGJHFr6

https://jfk.artifacts.archives.gov/objects/8328/carolina-rocker

Once they leave the White House, CJ and Owen will return to Everhope. It'll be home 'till the end. Aba's rocking chair may be in the White House with them for a while, but it'll go home with them. Who knows the two of them could wind up rocking their granchildren to sleep on it.

[Clancy59]

They will absolutely be rocking their grandchildren in that chair!  It may be making the rounds between Liebe and the boys as as they have their own children!  The arguments will start with who will inherit it!  Pam just didn’t know the history of the chair.  She thought it had just had too much use and needed to be replaced.

[chris191070]

2 hours ago, Carlos Hazday said:

Once they leave the White House, CJ and Owen will return to Everhope. It'll be home 'till the end. Aba's rocking chair may be in the White House with them for a while, but it'll go home with them. Who knows the two of them could wind up rocking their granchildren to sleep on it.

The question is are we gonna get a story about there time after CJ's 8 years as President. So we can meet there grandchildren.

[Carlos Hazday]

5 hours ago, Clancy59 said:

They will absolutely be rocking their grandchildren in that chair!  It may be making the rounds between Liebe and the boys as as they have their own children!  The arguments will start with who will inherit it!  Pam just didn’t know the history of the chair.  She thought it had just had too much use and needed to be replaced.

They can always donate it to CJ's Presidential Library after he leaves office.

 

[Carlos Hazday]

3 hours ago, chris191070 said:

The question is are we gonna get a story about there time after CJ's 8 years as President. So we can meet there grandchildren.

Not a chance. Considering Liebe married near the end of the presidency, kids may not come for a few years. Once I'm dead, someone could always try that but not me.

[Carlos Hazday]

1957 Buick

I looked at a lot of old cars over the weekend, and I think I settled on using this one.

[JACC]

21 hours ago, Carlos Hazday said:

Not a chance. Considering Liebe married near the end of the presidency, kids may not come for a few years. Once I'm dead, someone could always try that but not me.

You still have an awful lot to write, @Carlos Hazday, don’t think you’ll get rid of us by something as boring as passing away. Spoiler alert: there’s an afterlife!

[frosenblum]

On 3/12/2023 at 3:52 AM, Carlos Hazday said:

Once they leave the White House, CJ and Owen will return to Everhope. It'll be home 'till the end. Aba's rocking chair may be in the White House with them for a while, but it'll go home with them. Who knows the two of them could wind up rocking their granchildren to sleep on it.

I can hear 2003 CJ & Owen echoing the dads: "Carlos, shut your mouth, we're too young for you to already be imagining us as grandparents!!!" "P.S., how many grandkids?'

[dughlas]

5 hours ago, Carlos Hazday said:

1957 Buick

I looked at a lot of old cars over the weekend, and I think I settled on using this one.

Classy. Now if only we had aged so well.